Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 17 Jan 2024

Vol. 1048 No. 1

An tOrd Gnó - Order of Business

Minister of State at the Department of the Taoiseach (Deputy Hildegarde Naughton)

I move:

Wednesday's business shall be:

- Thirty-ninth Amendment of the Constitution (The Family) Bill 2023 (Committee and remaining Stages) (to conclude within 2 hrs 30 mins)

- Motion re Statement for Information of Voters in relation to the Thirty-ninth Amendment of the Constitution (The Family) Bill 2023 (without debate and any division to be taken immediately)

- Fortieth Amendment of the Constitution (Care) Bill 2023 (Committee and remaining Stages) (to conclude within 2 hrs 30 mins)

- Motion re Statement for Information of Voters in relation to the Fortieth Amendment of the Constitution (Care) Bill 2023 (without debate and any division to be taken immediately)

Wednesday's private members' business shall be the Motion re Investment Funds Trading in the Residential Property Market, selected by Sinn Féin.

Thursday's business shall be the Second Stage of the Social Welfare (Liable Relatives and Child Maintenance) Bill 2023 (if not previously concluded, to adjourn either at 5.15 p.m. or after 3 hrs 30 mins, whichever is the later).

Thursday's private members' business shall be the Second Stage of the Organisation of Working Time (Reproductive Health Related Leave) Bill 2021 [Seanad], selected by the Labour Party.

Proposed Arrangements for this week’s business:

In relation to Wednesday's business, it is proposed that:

1. the ordinary routine of business as set out in Schedule 3 to Standing Orders shall be modified to the extent that, notwithstanding the provisions of Standing Order 34A(1)—

(i) the Dáil may sit later than 10.32 p.m. and shall adjourn on the conclusion of topical issues pursuant to Standing Order 37 which shall be taken on the conclusion of private members’ business;

(ii) questions to the Taoiseach pursuant to Standing Order 46(1) shall not be taken, and Government business shall be taken at the time when such questions would normally be taken but in any event not earlier than 3.05 p.m.;

(iii) the Motion re Statement for Information of Voters in relation to the Thirty-ninth Amendment of the Constitution (The Family) Bill 2023 shall be taken without debate immediately upon the conclusion of that Bill, and the Motion re Statement for Information of Voters in relation to the Fortieth Amendment of the Constitution (Care) Bill 2023 shall be taken without debate immediately upon the conclusion of that Bill;

(iv) private members’ business may be taken later than 6.12 p.m. and shall in any event be taken on the conclusion of Government business; and

(v) questions pursuant to Standing Order 46(1) to a Minister other than the Taoiseach shall not be taken;

2. the proceedings on Committee and remaining Stages of the Thirty-Ninth Amendment of the Constitution (The Family) Bill 2023 shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion after 2 hours and 30 minutes by one question which shall be put from the Chair and which shall, in relation to amendments, include only those set down or accepted by the Minister for Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth;

3. any division claimed on the proceedings on the Motion re Statement for Information of Voters in relation to the Thirty-ninth Amendment of the Constitution (The Family) Bill 2023 shall be taken immediately;

4. the proceedings on Committee and remaining Stages of the Fortieth Amendment of the Constitution (Care) Bill 2023 shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion after 2 hours and 30 minutes by one question which shall be put from the Chair and which shall, in relation to amendments, include only those set down or accepted by the Minister for Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth; and

5. any division claimed on the proceedings on the Motion re Statement for Information of Voters in relation to the Fortieth Amendment of the Constitution (Care) Bill 2023 shall be taken immediately.

In relation to Thursday's business, it is proposed that:

1. the ordinary routine of business as set out in Schedule 3 to Standing Orders shall be modified to the following extent:

(i) no motion for a Committee report pursuant to Standing Order 102 or private member's Bill pursuant to Standing Order 160 shall be taken, and private members' business pursuant to Standing Order 159(1) and Standing Order 169 shall be taken for 122 minutes on the adjournment of Second Stage of the Social Welfare (Liable Relatives and Child Maintenance) Bill 2023, or where Second Stage of that Bill concludes within its allotted time, on the conclusion thereof; and

(ii) topical issues shall be taken on the conclusion of private members' business, and the Dáil shall adjourn on the conclusion thereof;

2. the proceedings on Second Stage of the Social Welfare (Liable Relatives and Child Maintenance) Bill 2023 shall, if not previously concluded, be interrupted and stand adjourned either at 5.15 p.m. or after 3 hours and 30 minutes, whichever is the later, and shall not be resumed on Thursday; and

3. notwithstanding anything in Standing Order 170(2), the proceedings on Second Stage of the Organisation of Working Time (Reproductive Health Related Leave) Bill 2021 [Seanad] shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion after two hours.

An Ceann Comhairle

Is that agreed?

Deputies

It is not agreed.

Deputy Matt Carthy

Since the Dáil last met, South Africa has shone a light on the humanitarian catastrophe that has been unleashed in Gaza by bringing a case against Israel under the Genocide Convention to the International Court of Justice. In bringing that case, South Africa and the South African Government have done humanity a great service. The case against Israel as presented by the South African legal team was compelling. The ICJ has heard in stark, indisputable terms that Israel is in gross violation of international law.

Ireland should join that case, just as we rightfully joined the ICJ case against Russia. Ireland should ensure that we are on the right side of history. Will the Minister ensure that the Government changes course and begins the process of joining the South African case or, at a minimum, will she commit to a Dáil debate that will allow Members here to clearly outline our disgust at the ongoing Israeli aggression in Palestine and to demand international action to make it stop?

Deputy Ivana Bacik

I support the call for a debate on Ireland joining South Africa in the case against Israel. That is a crucial ask. I will return to that on Questions on Promised Legislation but we need that debate and, if possible, to agree cross-party a motion on Ireland joining South Africa in that case.

Can I ask about a Private Member's Bill that we in Labour are putting forward tomorrow evening in the House? The Organisation of Working Time (Reproductive Health Related Leave) Bill 2021 would provide for paid leave from employment where an employee has suffered an early pregnancy loss or miscarriage or, indeed, where an employee needs time off work for fertility treatment. The Bill passed in the Seanad with Government support last year. We are bringing it in on Second Stage and we are disappointed to hear reports that the Government has tabled an amendment to delay the reading of Second Stage by 12 months. We ask the Chief Whip to withdraw that amendment and allow the Bill to pass Second Stage.

Deputy Jennifer Whitmore

We need the Minister to come in urgently to outline the Government's plans when it comes to housing asylum seekers and Ukrainians across this country. What we have seen over recent days is a ripping up of Government policy. We have seen U-turn after U-turn, which will make it nearly impossible for the Government to house refugees when they come into this country seeking refuge. I also remind the Minister that 600 very vulnerable men are on our streets in sub-zero temperatures who have no protections from the State. She is legally and morally obliged to provide them with protection. I ask the Minister to explain exactly what her policy is because it is in complete disarray. Even her own party colleagues do not know what the policy is. We need to understand it. We need to know exactly what the Government is doing. Where is the strategy and the long-term planning? It is way beyond time for this Government to put in a medium- to long-term plan to deal with this issue.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

On 22 November, we tabled a motion calling on the Government to instigate action under the genocide convention over Israel's genocide in Gaza. The Government voted that down. At that point, 14,000 people had been murdered by Israel. To date, approximately 24,000 people have been murdered by Israel. Another 6,000 to 7,000 are buried under the rubble and 2 million people have been displaced. Still, the Government brings shame on this country by refusing to support South Africa's action regarding genocide at the International Court of Justice, ICJ. The Government gives excuse after excuse as to why it cannot do it. Indeed, I believe the Taoiseach misled the Dáil when asked about this in November, when he said we could not intervene in the ICJ case unless we were directly involved in the dispute. South Africa has shown that not to be true. Germany has now intervened, shockingly, on Israel's side. Will the Government do what Blinne Ní Ghrálaigh did and show some honour from this country by joining the South African case against the massacre and genocide that Israel is committing against the people of Gaza?

Deputy Mattie McGrath

The Minister knows I have admiration for her, but it is disappointing and an insult to this House that neither the Taoiseach or the Tánaiste are here today after five weeks. One is in Davos and I do not know where Deputy Martin is. I refute out of hand the allegations that Deputy Bríd Smith made about the Rural Independents and me misleading the Dáil and our voting record on votes of confidence, the eviction Bill and so on but that is nothing new. The Minister, Deputy O'Gorman is present. He has made a mess in Roscrea. The good people of Roscrea are welcoming and have welcomed so many. They organised lorries to go out with aid when the war started in Ukraine and did the same with many other charitable causes. The mishandling of the situation there is the responsibility of the Government and the Garda seriously mishandling it too. I have written to both the chief superintendent and superintendent. I did not get any response. There is a total mishandling and besmirching of good people. Their only functioning hotel up to last Thursday was just taken away by a greedy developer. It is a shame.

We need a full debate on immigration policy.

We had one in our Private Members' time and we got lampooned and God knows what. We need a policy. It is not functioning. It is ham-fisted. Now, as the Government goes along, it throws money at a problem two days later to save some backbenchers. It is dysfunctional in the extreme.

Deputy Thomas Pringle

I fully support the call for a debate on Gaza and for Ireland to support South Africa in taking the Israelis to the ICJ because that is vitally important. It is important that the Government reflects the views of the Irish people. The Irish people are way ahead of the Government on this and it is time the Government got behind the people and supported this case.

Minister for Social Protection (Deputy Heather Humphreys)

The way the system works in this House is that all parties have the opportunity in Private Members' time to bring forward their own propositions. Many things are considered at the Business Committee, as we know, and the Chief Whip has given a commitment to have a balanced debate on immigration in the new year, so that will be organised.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

What about Gaza? There is a genocide going on. Will the Government give us a debate-----

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy, you have asked the question.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

-----where we can discuss the genocide, the worst crime-----

An Ceann Comhairle

No, let us not have a-----

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

-----the worst possible crime?

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy, resume your seat.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

I will answer.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

Will the Government give us that debate?

An Ceann Comhairle

I will ask the Minister. Minister, will you respond on that matter?

Deputy Heather Humphreys

All these things are debated. They were debated before Christmas, as I understand it. Ireland intervened before the court in the case taken by Ukraine against Russia. We participated in two advisory opinion cases related to Israeli action in Palestine last year. We were never afraid to intervene at the appropriate time.

Deputy Paul Murphy

A Cheann Comhairle------

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

A genocide.

An Ceann Comhairle

No, no. Resume your seats.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

We asked for a debate here and we asked for it at the Business Committee. It is a genocide.

An Ceann Comhairle

You asked and have got your answer. Resume your seat.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

Will the Government not give us the debate at least?

An Ceann Comhairle

Resume your seat. Stop making a charade of the place. Will you resume your seat?

Deputy Paul Murphy

It makes a charade of the place not to discuss a genocide-----

An Ceann Comhairle

Resume your seat.

Deputy Paul Murphy

-----and to continue as if we have business as usual,

An Ceann Comhairle

Please.

Deputy Paul Murphy

-----when 250 Palestinians------

An Ceann Comhairle

Please, please.

Deputy Paul Murphy

-----are being killed every single day and the Government will not even have a debate about it.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

You have Private Members' time.

Deputy Paul Murphy

That makes a charade of this place, a Cheann Comhairle.

An Ceann Comhairle

Do you want me to suspend the House?

Deputy Paul Murphy

That makes a charade of this place.

An Ceann Comhairle

Do you want me to suspend the House?

Deputy Paul Murphy

We need to have a debate this week.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

Ceann Comhairle.

An Ceann Comhairle

Do you want me to suspend the House?

Deputy Paul Murphy

We need to have a debate.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

Can we have the debate?

An Ceann Comhairle

Resume your seat.

Deputy Paul Murphy

It is a charade not to have a debate.

An Ceann Comhairle

Resume your seat.

Deputy Mick Barry

Some 10,000 people-----

An Ceann Comhairle

Resume your seat.

Deputy Mick Barry

-----have been killed since the Dáil last debated this issue.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputies, please resume your seats.

Deputy Mick Barry

Four Groups have requested a debate this week-----

An Ceann Comhairle

Please resume your seat.

Deputy Mick Barry

-----and the Minister has not even agreed to a debate next week,-----

An Ceann Comhairle

Please resume your seat.

Deputy Mick Barry

-----let alone a debate this week.

An Ceann Comhairle

The House is suspended for five minutes.

Cuireadh an Dáil ar fionraí ar 2.52 p.m. agus cuireadh tús leis arís ar 2.57 p.m.

Sitting suspended at 2.52 p.m. and resumed at 2.57 p.m.

An Ceann Comhairle

The question is that the arrangements for this week's business-----

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

Can we have an answer from the Government on whether it is going to allow for a debate on genocide? I mean, seriously, the Minister did not even answer. Is the Government going to give us a debate on a genocide that is happening and the ICJ case? It is shameful if it does not.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy, I will give the Minister an opportunity to answer if she wants. The simple fact of the matter is that I do not think there is a single Member in this House who is not sickened by what they see happening in Gaza-----

Deputy Mattie McGrath

Hear, hear.

An Ceann Comhairle

-----and what we saw happen in Israel on 7 October.

Deputy Mary Butler

Hear, hear.

An Ceann Comhairle

We were shocked and appalled by all of it but I do not know what is being achieved by shouting in here and jumping up and down-----

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

Maybe we could do what South Africa did.

An Ceann Comhairle

-----or by a debate. Minister, over to you.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

Thank you, a Cheann Comhairle. I absolutely agree with what you just said. The Deputies have Leaders' Questions as an opportunity to raise this. They have another opportunity through oral parliamentary questions, they have written parliamentary questions-----

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

It is a genocide.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

Let me finish. They have their own Private Members' time. Why are they not using that?

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

We do not have it for weeks.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

The Deputies have had loads of opportunity. They would rather get up there-----

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

We used it in November and the Government voted it down.

Deputy Paul Murphy

We used it to debate the genocide convention.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Boyd Barrett asked the Minister a question. Would the Deputies do her the courtesy of listening without shouting and interrupting her again? What gallery are they playing to?

Deputy Paul Murphy

She is misleading the Dáil.

An Ceann Comhairle

What gallery are you playing to, Deputies?

Deputy Paul Murphy

We used our Private Members' time.

An Ceann Comhairle

What gallery are you playing to? If you ask the Minister a question, have the good manners and courtesy to allow her to respond without interruption.

Deputy Paul Murphy

An answer would be great.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

Thank you, a Cheann Comhairle. The Deputies have an opportunity at Topical Issues. There are loads of opportunities.

Deputy Mick Barry

So it is a "No".

Deputy Heather Humphreys

They do not have to stand up there are and create a big fuss so that they get attention. They will run it off on social media and there will be big song and dance. I know what they do all the time. This is all about themselves.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

It is a genocide.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

It is not about the people that we are watching on the television. What we are seeing is terrible.

Deputy Paul Murphy

Then do something about it.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

We are all aware of what is happening to children, mothers and fathers. I can assure the Deputies that we are doing everything we can as a Government.

Deputy Paul Murphy

No, you are not. You are doing nothing.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

Yes, we are. As I said, the Whip will speak at the Business Committee and the matter can be decide there.

Question put: "That the proposed arrangements for this week's business be agreed to."

The Dáil divided: Tá, 78; Níl, 61; Staon, 0.

Tá

• Berry, Cathal.
• Brophy, Colm.
• Browne, James.
• Bruton, Richard.
• Burke, Colm.
• Burke, Peter.
• Butler, Mary.
• Byrne, Thomas.
• Cahill, Jackie.
• Calleary, Dara.
• Cannon, Ciarán.
• Chambers, Jack.
• Collins, Niall.
• Costello, Patrick.
• Coveney, Simon.
• Cowen, Barry.
• Creed, Michael.
• Crowe, Cathal.
• Devlin, Cormac.
• Dillon, Alan.
• Donnelly, Stephen.
• Donohoe, Paschal.
• Duffy, Francis Noel.
• Durkan, Bernard J.
• English, Damien.
• Farrell, Alan.
• Feighan, Frankie.
• Fitzpatrick, Peter.
• Flaherty, Joe.
• Flanagan, Charles.
• Fleming, Sean.
• Foley, Norma.
• Griffin, Brendan.
• Harris, Simon.
• Haughey, Seán.
• Heydon, Martin.
• Higgins, Emer.
• Humphreys, Heather.
• Kehoe, Paul.
• Lahart, John.
• Lawless, James.
• Leddin, Brian.
• Lowry, Michael.
• Madigan, Josepha.
• Martin, Catherine.
• Matthews, Steven.
• McAuliffe, Paul.
• McEntee, Helen.
• McGuinness, John.
• McHugh, Joe.
• Moynihan, Aindrias.
• Moynihan, Michael.
• Murnane O'Connor, Jennifer.
• Murphy, Verona.
• Naughten, Denis.
• Naughton, Hildegarde.
• Noonan, Malcolm.
• O'Brien, Darragh.
• O'Brien, Joe.
• O'Callaghan, Jim.
• O'Dea, Willie.
• O'Donnell, Kieran.
• O'Donovan, Patrick.
• O'Dowd, Fergus.
• O'Gorman, Roderic.
• O'Sullivan, Christopher.
• O'Sullivan, Pádraig.
• Ó Cathasaigh, Marc.
• Ó Cuív, Éamon.
• Phelan, John Paul.
• Rabbitte, Anne.
• Richmond, Neale.
• Ryan, Eamon.
• Smith, Brendan.
• Smyth, Niamh.
• Smyth, Ossian.
• Stanton, David.
• Troy, Robert.

Níl

• Andrews, Chris.
• Bacik, Ivana.
• Barry, Mick.
• Boyd Barrett, Richard.
• Browne, Martin.
• Buckley, Pat.
• Cairns, Holly.
• Carthy, Matt.
• Clarke, Sorca.
• Collins, Joan.
• Collins, Michael.
• Connolly, Catherine.
• Conway-Walsh, Rose.
• Cronin, Réada.
• Crowe, Seán.
• Cullinane, David.
• Daly, Pa.
• Doherty, Pearse.
• Donnelly, Paul.
• Ellis, Dessie.
• Farrell, Mairéad.
• Funchion, Kathleen.
• Gannon, Gary.
• Gould, Thomas.
• Guirke, Johnny.
• Harkin, Marian.
• Healy-Rae, Michael.
• Howlin, Brendan.
• Kelly, Alan.
• Kenny, Gino.
• Kenny, Martin.
• Kerrane, Claire.
• Mac Lochlainn, Pádraig.
• McGrath, Mattie.
• McNamara, Michael.
• Mitchell, Denise.
• Murphy, Catherine.
• Murphy, Paul.
• Mythen, Johnny.
• Nash, Ged.
• O'Callaghan, Cian.
• O'Donoghue, Richard.
• O'Reilly, Louise.
• O'Rourke, Darren.
• Ó Broin, Eoin.
• Ó Laoghaire, Donnchadh.
• Ó Murchú, Ruairí.
• Ó Snodaigh, Aengus.
• Pringle, Thomas.
• Quinlivan, Maurice.
• Ryan, Patricia.
• Sherlock, Sean.
• Shortall, Róisín.
• Smith, Bríd.
• Smith, Duncan.
• Stanley, Brian.
• Tóibín, Peadar.
• Tully, Pauline.
• Ward, Mark.
• Whitmore, Jennifer.
• Wynne, Violet-Anne.

Staon

Tellers: Tá, Deputies Hildegarde Naughton and Cormac Devlin; Níl, Deputies Richard Boyd Barrett and Pádraig Mac Lochlainn.

Question declared.

Deputy Darren O'Rourke

We have had announcements of energy price reductions this week but the fact remains that energy companies are far too slow to pass on wholesale savings. Even with these planned reductions, energy prices here are far too high. We have some of the highest electricity and gas prices in Europe. Almost 275,000 domestic electricity customers and almost 160,000 domestic gas customers are in arrears. The Minister will know that the Society of St. Vincent de Paul took 20,000 calls from people struggling with energy bills last year. On these cold days and freezing cold nights, people are afraid to turn on the heat and light. That is scandalous. Does the Minister agree that there is significant scope for further energy price reductions? What will the Government do to ensure these materialise quickly?

Deputy Heather Humphreys

I thank Deputy O'Rourke for raising this issue. I am glad to see that energy prices are coming down. The Government has done a lot, paying out a €200 energy credit in the past month, with more to come, and my Department expanded the fuel allowance. These are things we have been doing. Like Deputy O'Rourke, I would like to see energy prices come down further to reflect the market.

Deputy Ivana Bacik

I raise again the proceedings under way in the International Court of Justice, ICJ, under the genocide convention. Yesterday, I contacted all party leaders on both sides of the House seeking signatures of support for a cross-party motion on Gaza, drafted by the Sadaka organisation, which calls for Irish support for the South African case against Israel.

In 2021, this House made history when it spoke with one voice, representing the will of the people of Ireland, in condemning the annexation of Palestine by the Israeli authorities. I ask the Minister to look at the wording of the motion I have sent to the Government and Chief Whip and to work with us in the Opposition to agree a cross-party text, one which can offer a meaningful stance for Ireland against the horrors being inflicted on the people of Gaza by the Israeli Government, so that we can speak together in calling for action against Israel and to end the awful suffering in Gaza.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

I thank the Deputy for raising this important issue. We are urgently calling for an immediate and sustainable humanitarian ceasefire, the unconditional release of all hostages and full and safe unhindered humanitarian access. The protection of civilians, which is an obligation under international humanitarian law, must be paramount. There must be accountability for civilian deaths.

The hearings last week at the ICJ involved only South Africa and Israel, the parties to this case. This is not the time for intervention by other states. Deputy Bacik said she has put forward a motion. I will raise that with the Tánaiste.

Deputy Holly Cairns

We are witnessing the annihilation of Gaza. Already, tens of thousands of lives have been claimed. Those who have not been killed are essentially living in a hell on earth. Some 85% of the population have been displaced, the healthcare system has disintegrated and men, women and children are being starved and dehydrated.

Some are warning of a famine in Gaza but there is no famine. There are trucks filled with food and essential supplies within metres, stuck in Egypt. The reality is that the Israeli Government is using starvation as a weapon of war. It is massacring, torturing and brutalising a civilian population in full view of the world. The Minister's response was that we are calling for a ceasefire. What is happening is an impending genocide. Last week, the Government could have taken a strong stance against this. Ireland had another chance to match its rhetoric with actual action.

An Ceann Comhairle

Time is up.

Deputy Holly Cairns

Instead, like most of the western world, it sat on the sidelines. Is the Government ever going to match its words with actions? Will it please reconsider its position on the South Africa case?

Deputy Heather Humphreys

As the Deputy knows, discussions are taking place at EU level. As I said to Deputy Bacik, the hearings last week at the International Court of Justice involved only South Africa and Israel, the parties to the case. This is not the time for intervention by other states. We have never been afraid to intervene and have done so at the appropriate time when we judged an intervention to be warranted. I assure the Deputy we will not be found wanting.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

History will judge harshly the people who stood by while the genocide was taking place and refused to call it for what it is and do as South Africa, a country that knows about apartheid and colonialism, has done. South Africa stood up, with an Irish legal representative who did this country proud, and presented an overwhelming case that Israel is guilty of the worst crime humanity can commit, genocide. Germany has, disgracefully, formally intervened on Israel's behalf. Ireland, a former colony which was subjected to apartheid laws such as the penal laws and hundreds of years of oppression, is going to remain silent. We will not now stand with the Palestinian people in their hour of need by simply joining a legal case against what is obviously a massacre and a genocide being committed, when other countries around the world are standing with us.

An Ceann Comhairle

Thank you, Deputy. The time is up.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

The Palestinian people and the 60,000 or 70,000 people who were on the streets last weekend do not understand why the Government will not do this. Is it because it is afraid of America?

Deputy Heather Humphreys

There must be accountability for what is happening. As I said, Ireland will decide whether to intervene on the ICJ proceedings instituted by South Africa under the genocide convention at the appropriate juncture, after the court has made its order on preliminary measures.

Deputy Michael Lowry

I refer to my recent representations to the Government concerning the dramatic level of closures across the hospitality and SME sector. The figures on closures make for grim reading. The sector is reeling from the perfect storm. A huge increase in operational costs, combined with the soaring cost of living, have sounded the death knell for these small businesses. A number of Government decisions in the budget had unintended consequences and if not revisited, the shutters will fall on many more cafés, restaurants, shops and vital community hubs. It is crucial that the Government bring forward a support and survival package for the sector.

Minister of State at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Neale Richmond)

I thank Deputy Lowry. I confirm that the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment, Deputy Coveney, has just left the House to attend a meeting with representatives of the hospitality sector to discuss what we accept are increasing costs. Many of these are down to market issues, be they energy or interest rates. We accept that correct Government decisions to increase the minimum wage and access to sick pay come with a cost to employers. We are looking at all options and will continue to engage with the sector at this pressing time. No closure is a good closure. We want to make sure we can keep viable businesses in the sector open. I will continue to discuss the matter with the Deputy.

Deputy Mattie McGrath

There is a huge issue with delays in driving tests. I was contacted over Christmas by a driving tester who is one of seven due to be made redundant by the Road Safety Authority, RSA, in February and March. At this time, the average waiting time for driving tests has been as long as 28 weeks in Clonmel. In some parts of the country, the waiting time is as long as 51 weeks. It is beyond belief that the RSA would make testers redundant. It is my understanding that the RSA was to recruit 75 additional testers. We were told that in this House. Only 43 were recruited and with seven being let go, that brings the increase back to 36 testers. Will the Minister explain why the RSA is letting go competent, professional driving testers who have been operating for a number of years when it is supposed to recruit 75 testers? What is going on? Young people, not-so-young people and newcomers to the country cannot get their tests.

An Ceann Comhairle

I thank the Deputy.

Deputy Mattie McGrath

It is affecting work, businesses, education and schooling.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

I understand how important it is to get a test, especially when living in rural Ireland. It is important for transport. I take the Deputy's point and will raise it directly with the Minister for Transport and have him reply directly to the Deputy on the matter.

Deputy Thomas Pringle

The recent announcement that Donegal's only child and adolescent counselling service has been forced to close because of a lack of funding has sent shockwaves through many Donegal communities. It is an absolute disgrace. Not only has the counselling service been used, it has grown hugely with more than 15,000 counselling sessions provided in the past six years alone. There are 26 counsellors across seven outreach centres, including in Letterkenny, Dunfanaghy, Stranorlar, Buncrana and Creeslough. The Government cannot say in its budget press releases that mental health is a priority while allowing Tusla and the HSE not only to refuse funding but actively to strip away a vital service providing young people with counselling. Who decided that such an essential service was not worthy of funding? Will the Minister reverse that decision straight away, knowing that the cessation of the service will create a dangerous void in the provision of mental health services for young people in Donegal?

Minister of State at the Department of Health (Deputy Mary Butler)

I thank the Deputy for the question. I became aware of the impending challenges in Donegal through the Raphoe diocesan pastoral services and of the impact its closure could have. I understand it is an excellent service. It crosses through mental health, primary care, social inclusion and Tusla. I spoke with the assistant national director for services in regard to this issue this morning. I also spoke with a former Leas-Cheann Comhairle, Pat the Cope Gallagher, who was instrumental in setting up the service many years ago. I am awaiting a briefing from the community healthcare organisation in the area, CHO 1. I will engage with the service to see what we can do. I believe it was to the fore during the Creeslough tragedy when it helped many people with counselling. My understanding is that the service has been in place for more than 30 years. It has grown and now needs a full-time director. The person who was in place is due to retire in March. We will see what we can do to resolve this issue.

Deputy Aindrias Moynihan

Gabhaim buíochas leis an gCeann Comhairle agus guím athbhliain faoi mhaise dó. Táim ag fiosrú faoin mBille maidir leis an toghchán d’Údarás na Gaeltachta. Cuireadh stop le toghchán Údarás na Gaeltachta roinnt blianta ó shin agus is mór an chailliúint a bhí ann. D'oibrigh sé sin nasc idir mhuintir na Gaeltachta agus an údarás agus tá contaetha nach bhfuil aon ionadaíocht acu ar feadh roinnt blianta. Thosaigh an tAire Stáit deireanach ar Bhille nua a thabhairt chun cinn agus tá an coiste Gaeilge tar éis é sin a phlé le breis is sé mhí anois an samhradh seo caite. Tá muintir na Gaeltachta ag tnúth go mór lena vóta a bheith acu chun bord an údaráis a roghnú arís. Mar sin, cathain a bheidh muintir na Gaeltachta ábalta vóta a chaitheamh agus a bheidh an Bille nua do thoghchán d’Údarás na Gaeltachta tagtha chun cinn?

An Ceann Comhairle

Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aite Stáit agus glaoim ar an Teachta Stanton anois.

Minister of State at the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform (Deputy Patrick O'Donovan)

Gabhaim buíochas leis an gCeann Comhairle agus leis an Teachta. Mar is eol don Teachta, tá an-chuid oibre déanta ag an Roinn agus ag Comhchoiste na Gaeilge, na Gaeltachta agus Phobal Labhartha na Gaeilge ar an ábhar sin agus, go háirithe freisin, ina measc, leis an údarás féin chun na toghcháin a thabhairt ar ais arís. Tá sé socraithe ag an Rialtas go mbeidh na toghcháin ar siúl in 2024 ach ba chóir dom dul ar ais go dtí an Rialtas go luath maidir leis na ceannteidil don Bhille sin. Beidh mé ar ais arís ag an gcoiste Gaeilge go luath ina dhiaidh sin chun an scrúdú réamhreachtach a phlé amach leis an gcoiste sin. Tá súil agam go mbeidh mé in ann é sin a dhéanamh chomh luath agus is féidir ach, maidir leis an toghchán, beidh an toghchán d'Údarás na Gaeltachta ar siúl in 2024.

Deputy David Stanton

Three months ago, almost to the day, Storm Babette hit the country, affecting in particular my own area in east Cork. I thank the Minister, her Department and the community welfare officers, CWOs, for all the help they have given to households.

It has been really appreciated and they have been very good, as have the Department of enterprise and the Irish Red Cross, for businesses. However, the issue of road funding remains and I understand that the county council sought up to €50 million in support. When will the Government be able to release some of that funding to the county council in order that roads, some of which are still closed, as well as bridges, can be repaired?

Deputy Heather Humphreys

I thank Deputy Stanton. I know Storm Babet caused extensive damage to the road infrastructure in the likes of Midleton and other parts of east Cork last November. I am informed that the Department of Transport is engaging with Cork County Council at the moment and will continue to do so with a view to providing assistance.

Deputy Pauline Tully

I want to raise an issue that was highlighted in news reports last week resulting from a report by the Child Law Project and Dr. Niall Muldoon, who is Ombudsman for Children. It highlighted the case of a teenage girl with a disability who was held in a hospital room off the emergency department for two months in 2021 because Tusla - the Child and Family Agency and HSE disability services could not work together to ensure that the proper supports were put in place to support this child and her family. The young girl was living in a dark room. She was not outside for two months. She had no access to education, no physical activity for the two months and even limited access to television or Wi-Fi for a period. It is not an isolated incident. Unfortunately, there are many families facing this stark choice and who feel they have no option because they do not receive the supports they require from the disability services in the community. What steps has the Government taken to ensure co-operation among State agencies such as Tusla and the disability services for families with children with disability to ensure the children are put first?

Minister for Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth (Deputy Roderic O'Gorman)

I thank Deputy Tully for raising that important issue. She is absolutely right. The situation and the conditions that this child and her family found themselves in are unacceptable and it is important that these are published and publicised by the children's law reporting project. Since then, Tusla and the HSE have agreed a protocol for addressing the needs of children who are in care but who also have a disability. The two agencies were not co-operating well in these areas but a protocol is now in place that also has financing behind it to make sure appropriate pathways of care can be identified for those children. Now that the disability services within the HSE also report directly to my Department, as does Tusla, we have a more joined-up approach in our response to these particularly vulnerable children.

Deputy Pádraig O'Sullivan

Like many areas around the country, Cork has experienced a succession of business closures in the last few weeks. Many businesses have cited the increase in costs, energy inflation etc. The increased cost of business grant was announced as part of budget 2024. In December, the Minister, Deputy Coveney, signed off on an increased package of €257 million. When will the increased cost of business grant be operational and when can businesses start applying for it? I have contacted both local authorities in Cork and they have advised that no detail has been provided to the LEO network regarding the timeline on the process as of yet. If the Minister could provide clarity, it would be much appreciated.

Minister of State at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Neale Richmond)

I thank the Deputy for a very timely remark. The increased cost of business scheme will be paid out to all businesses that paid commercial rates last year of up to €30,000, with a maximum pay-out of €5,000. It will all be completed by the end of the first quarter in 2024. The Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment is working with the Department of housing and local government to make sure there is a system. We are hoping this will not require application. It will just be a payment directly into the accounts of businesses that paid commercial rates in the previous year.

Deputy Brendan Griffin

I ask the Minister about local improvement schemes. I acknowledge the effort she has made to provide funding over recent years to try to clear the lists nationwide but almost one in five of all roads that are awaiting improvements nationwide are in County Kerry and we need substantially more funding to try to clear the list. As it currently stands, there are more than 600 roads for which people are waiting. These are people who paid their taxes and who are trying to travel these roads in their cars, on bicycles and with prams day in, day out and the roads are in appalling condition. They are non-council roads, are not strictly private roads and they need to be improved. In this year's allocations, I ask the Minister to particularly look at counties where there is a huge waiting list and see whether something better could be done for those counties to try to eat into the list in 2024.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

I thank the Deputy. I have provided €100 million for local improvement schemes since 2017. I know we are making inroads into the long list and some counties have opened up their schemes for new applications. I do not know if that is the case in County Kerry. Some counties kept them closed until they got the list reduced considerably. I will be announcing the LIS schemes at the end of January and have no doubt, like every other year, that Kerry will get more than its fair share.

Deputy Marc Ó Cathasaigh

I draw the Minister's attention to an issue we are encountering around recruitment of qualified bus and haulage drivers. It is a real constriction point within the economy. We have access to an excellent pool of qualified bus and haulage drivers from abroad but some of the quirks in the system mean that the people who are coming in are sitting around for three months without being able to get into work. There is a delay in drivers getting appointments for their Irish residency permits and then a delay in processing the card once the appointment is complete. This delay sits in the Department of Justice where the Minister served herself for a while. Then, on the other side of the coin, there is the National Driver Licence Service, under the Minister of State, Deputy Chambers, which cannot process the licence until it has the physical Irish residence permit in its hands. It just means qualified drivers who are sitting here ready and available for work, and who are much needed, are being left to sit around for in excess of three months. It is something that could easily be resolved and I ask the Minister to have a look at it.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

I thank the Deputy. This is an issue on which I know the Deputy has been very proactive. I agree with him there is no reason we would not just get this sorted. The whole area of work permits for bus drivers from non-EU and non-EEA countries has been the subject of engagement between the Departments of Transport and Enterprise, Trade and Employment. In December 2022, as Members will know, the Minister, Deputy Coveney, announced changes to the permits system to help ease the recruitment challenges being faced in the transport sector with the establishment of a quota of 1,500 employment permits for bus and coach drivers. However, we all know there are still challenges out there. We need more bus drivers. I will ask that the Deputy be given a comprehensive reply from the relevant Departments on the important matters he raises here. At the end of the day, we want to get this sorted. As what the Deputy is suggesting makes sense, let us get on with it.

An Ceann Comhairle

We have four remaining Deputies and we are out of time. We will take 30-second questions from each.

Deputy Catherine Connolly

I am returning to Gaza on which the Ceann Comhairle and Minister have expressed their horror. The Minister has said it is horrible to watch. However, we can do something; that is why the International Court of Justice is there. We can join South Africa and stop playing politics and waiting for the big boys to make the decision. We can act ethically and morally and can support South Africa in the case it has before the court. I am filled with despair, despondency and disgust at the attitude and the behaviour of the Government to date. Once again, I ask that the Government state, or at least go back to the Taoiseach and confirm, that we will support the very strong and courageous stance taken by South Africa.

Deputy Bríd Smith

It is worth this House noting that tomorrow, over 200,000 public sector workers will take strike action in Northern Ireland to secure a pay increase. They have traditional been very badly paid and so I salute them. We should note this because these workers are in our country. We may not have jurisdiction over them but it is a very important strike. Also important are the pay talks with the public sector that are happening here. I note that the Minister, Deputy Donohoe, has put a colouration on it that the Government made a very generous offer to the public sector. However, when we consider that the rate of inflation was up in December and that over the past year it was at 6.3% while public sector workers got less than 4% of a pay rise, there is a lot of catching up to be done. It behoves the Government to sit down again with the public sector unions and revise the offer-----

An Ceann Comhairle

I thank the Deputy. Time is up.

Deputy Bríd Smith

-----to take account of inflation over the last two or three years and those ahead.

Deputy Thomas Gould

Just before Christmas, I had a meeting with Bus Éireann in Cork to discuss major problems there with the bus service. People have been contacting me about buses being late, delayed or not turning up, and there are major problems with the app not being accurate and people waiting at bus stops. I have been contacted by a bus driver who has given us proof that last week, 14 bus services in Cork were short of drivers. We have people who have been delayed going to school, to work or to college or who cannot make appointments. We listen to the Government talking about getting people out of their cars.

An Ceann Comhairle

I thank the Deputy. The time is up.

Deputy Thomas Gould

How can we get them out of their cars if they cannot get a bus? The last point I will make is to ask whether the Minister will provide funding to Bus Éireann in Cork to take on additional drivers, because otherwise this service will be a laughing stock.

Deputy Cathal Crowe

At the start of this week, I met with a number of schools in my constituency, particularly the special education teams. They were bemoaning the fact, and we have heard it everywhere, that children in their schools cannot get assessed quick enough and cannot get therapeutic supports quick enough.

The National Treatment Purchase Fund, NTPF, works well for thousands of people, mostly older people who have problems like cataracts and varicose veins. Sometimes, they travel outside their jurisdiction for treatment and sometimes they get treatment privately. It is, however, a very fluid, successful mechanism. I ask that this mechanism be considered for advancing children's needs, for therapeutic supports and, if it applies, for some psychological assessments.

An Ceann Comhairle

I thank the Deputy. Time is up.

Deputy Cathal Crowe

If it just allowed the child and adolescent mental health services, CAMHS, and National Educational Psychological Service, NEPS, to clear the backlog, surely it is worth considering.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Minister, please. We have four questions.

Deputy Heather Humphreys

First, in reply to Deputy Connolly, I said earlier that Ireland will make a decision on whether to intervene at the appropriate juncture, after the court has made its order on preliminary measures. In the past, we have never been found wanting. The Tánaiste is very much involved in this. Any of us who watch our televisions see what is happening in the Middle East. It is awful. It is heart-wrenching and sickening. We have done everything in terms of our diplomatic efforts at both the UN and EU and in the International Court of Justice and International Criminal Court. We are in contact with the regional partners. Our focus is on the core aim of seeing the fighting stop. It is something about which we all feel very strongly.

Deputy Bríd Smith raised the issue of the pay talks. The Minister, Deputy Donohoe, is engaging with the unions and will continue to do so and, hopefully, we will find a resolution there.

Deputy Gould raised the issue of Bus Éireann. I will bring up that with the Minister, Deputy Ryan.

The Minister of State, Deputy Butler, will take the final question.

Deputy Mary Butler

I thank Deputy Crowe for his question. We have explored that issue previously. It was in the programme for Government to explore the NTPF being used for such therapies. The NPTF works really well for stand-alone operations such as cataract removals or hip replacements. Children have to go for appointments and do not know whether it will be four, six or eight appointments. We did look at it and it would prove very problematic. We would also have to change the legislation, which can be done.

I had a meeting this morning with the Minister, Deputy Donnelly, regarding waiting list initiatives, CAMHS and primary care psychology. The Minister of State, Deputy Rabbitte, is also working on waiting list initiatives.

An Ceann Comhairle

That concludes the Order of Business and a whole lot of other things as well, which allows us to move to the next business.