Joint Committee on Agriculture, Food and the Marine díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 22 Nov 2023

Horse and Greyhound Racing Fund Regulations 2023: Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine

An Cathaoirleach

Before we begin, I remind members to please turn off their mobile phones. I bring to everyone's attention that witnesses giving evidence from within the parliamentary precincts are protected by absolute privilege in respect of evidence they give to the committee. This means they have a full defence against any defamation action relating to anything said at a committee meeting. However, witnesses are expected not to abuse this privilege and may be directed to cease giving evidence on the Chair's direction. Witnesses should follow the direction of the Chair in this regard. They are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that, insofar as is reasonable, no adverse commentary should be made against an identifiable third person or entity. Witnesses giving evidence from a location outside the parliamentary precincts are asked to note that they may not benefit from the same level of immunity from legal proceedings as a witness giving evidence from within those precincts. They may consider it appropriate to take legal advice on this matter. Privilege against defamation does not apply to publication by witnesses outside the proceedings held by the committee of any matters arising from those proceedings.

Members are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that they should not comment on, criticise or make charges against a person outside the Houses or an official by name or in such a way as to make him or her identifiable. Parliamentary privilege is considered to apply to utterances of members participating online in the committee meeting when their participation is from within the parliamentary precincts. Members may not participate online in a public meeting from outside those precincts and any attempt to do so will result in the member having his or her online access removed.

The purpose of today's meeting is to examine the Horse and Greyhound Racing Fund Regulations 2023. The committee will hear from the Minister for Agriculture Food and the Marine, Deputy McConalogue, Mr. Gordon Conroy, assistant secretary general, Ms Caroline Ball, principal officer, State bodies, and Ms Louise McAlavey, principal officer, State bodies. They are very welcome to today's committee meeting.

The Minister's opening statement has been circulated to members. I will allow him five minutes to read his opening statement. We will then proceed to a question-and-answer session.

Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine (Deputy Charlie McConalogue)

I thank the Cathaoirleach and members very much for facilitating this engagement. Ensuring that the horse and greyhound racing industries achieve their maximum potential and in so doing, contribute to economic and social development over a wide geographic distribution, is an important aspect of Government policy. The valuable contribution to a balanced regional economy made by both the horse and greyhound industries is well recognised. It is estimated that the thoroughbred industry has an annual economic impact of €2.46 billion with direct and indirect employment of 30,000 people and that the greyhound sector benefits an estimated 10,000 people.

The importance of these industries has been acknowledged by successive Governments and they are supported through legislation and policy initiatives. The world-class reputation for excellence in horse racing, greyhound racing and breeding that Ireland enjoys today has been enabled by the support provided through public funds. The thoroughbred industry, in particular, brings a high level of international investment into Ireland. We are truly world class in this space with the success we achieve on the track, as well as the continued excellence we achieve in breeding.

The Irish equine breeding and racing industry is extremely competitive at an international level with our excellence in this space well acknowledged globally. Ireland is the second largest producer of bloodstock in the world by value sold after the USA. We are the world’s third highest producer of thoroughbreds foaled each year after the USA and Australia. The thoroughbred sector is very much a firm part of our identity. We look forward to working with Rásaíocht Con Éireann, RCÉ, and its newly appointed chief executive as it develops a new strategic plan. It is important to acknowledge the significant strides made by the industry in the areas of integrity and welfare in the last few years. My Department supports RCÉ in its progress and ongoing work in these important areas.

Government funding, in addition to supporting these key industries, presents an excellent opportunity to yield a high return for its investment leading to a flow of income through many levels of the economy, thereby providing widespread benefits to society. The sectors are crucial in driving a geographically balanced economy throughout our country.

The horse and greyhound racing industries receive financial support from the State through the horse and greyhound racing fund under section 12 of the Horse and Greyhound Racing Act 2001. Payments are made from the fund to Horse Racing Ireland, HRI, and RCÉ. In the period 2001 to date, a total of €1.64 billion has been paid from the fund to the horse and greyhound racing industries in accordance with the provisions of the Act. The cumulative upper limit on payments from the fund provided for under the relevant regulations has been reached.

Exchequer support provided from the fund is crucial to the survival and continued development of the horse and greyhound racing industries. To give effect to the provisions of budget 2024, the cumulative upper limit must be increased by regulation. The Estimates for my Department, passed by both Houses as part of budget 2024, include an allocation of €95 million for the horse and greyhound racing fund. This will be distributed in accordance with section 12(6) of the 2001 Act with 80% or €76 million going to HRI and 20% or €19 million going to RCÉ.

In order to allow my Department to provide the moneys allocated in budget 2024, it is necessary to comply with the technical requirement under section 12 (13) of the Act to increase the cumulative limit on the amount payable from the horse and greyhound racing fund by €95 million to some €1.735 billion. This is achieved by way of the regulations submitted to this committee today. The aggregate limit on the horse and greyhound racing fund has been increased in this manner in 2004 and in 2009 and each year since then until now.

With regard to the horse racing industry, according to the Deloitte report in 2023, the Irish thoroughbred industry has an annual economic impact amounting to €2.46 billion and supports direct and indirect jobs of some 30,000 people. The total value of Irish foaled exports sold at public auction last year amounted to more than €293 million. Horse racing generates a significant return to the rural economy. Of course, behind all the facts and figures are the thousands of people who, directly and indirectly, make the Irish racing and breeding industry what it is today.

Statistics released by HRI for horse racing and breeding in Ireland for the first six months of this year point to a continued resilience in the industry. Many figures compare favourably to the first six months of 2019, which was the last full year before Covid-19. As proven this year to date, Irish owners, trainers, jockeys and horses are continuing to set standards globally and their exceptional standards and achievements and enduring influence underscore our international prominence in this sector. The Irish equine breeding and racing industry is extremely competitive globally. The incredible passion and commitment to excellence displayed by everyone in the sector, from yard staff to jockeys to owners, allows us to consistently punch above our weight.

The importance of a strong welfare and integrity foundation to this highly successful industry is crucial and this is well recognised throughout the industry.

We continue to work with HRI, the IHRB and other relevant stakeholders to ensure the highest standards of integrity and welfare are maintained. In that regard, in November 2021, the committee published a report on horse racing in Ireland. At the committee’s request, an international equine anti-doping expert, Dr. Craig Suann, was commissioned to conduct an independent review of the IHRB’s anti-doping programme. This review concluded that the programme does “at least match international best practice in most respects and has made significant advances in recent years.” It is worth noting that the Government's funding, in addition to supporting this key industry, also presents an excellent opportunity to yield a high return for its investment leading to a flow of income right through the economy.

The EU-UK Brexit trade agreement reached in December 2020, which included the Northern Ireland protocol and, more recently, the Windsor Framework agreement, were welcome for the sector in seeking to facilitate movement between us and deal with the impacts of Brexit. However, the facility to move horses freely without veterinary certification between Ireland and Britain under an agreement known as the tripartite agreement, unfortunately, no longer applies, and this has added to cost and is a significant administrative burden to such movements. The global nature of major breeding operations illustrates that while Ireland arguably now has leadership position within Europe, its pre-eminence is not guaranteed.

I will touch briefly on the greyhound racing industry. As highlighted in the 2021 Power report, the industry supports 4,000 full-time jobs with 6,000 active greyhound owners. The total number of people deriving economic benefit from it is 10,000. Greyhound racing is very much part of the social fabric of many parts of our country. The fund provides to the sector the capacity to sustain a long-standing tradition and underpins economic activity throughout the country.

The future of the industry is dependent on a strong governance platform, and on the industry having the highest standards of integrity and welfare, founded on a robust regulatory system. Provisions in the Greyhound Racing Act 2019, which came into effect in May that year, will make a real difference in this regard. That legislation will strengthen the legal basis for the industry, with a view to fortifying the integrity of the greyhound racing sector and improving provision for greyhound traceability. The new Act also improves the governance of Rásaíocht Con Éireann, strengthens regulatory controls in the industry, modernises sanctions and improves integrity within the sector. It provides the industry with the real tools it needs to effect fundamental change and reform. It facilitates the board in focusing on its priority objective of achieving the highest standards of care and welfare of greyhounds. Further commencement orders for the small number of remaining sections will continue to be phased in as expediently as possible and, as implementation continues, enable RCÉ to ensure the important heritage associated with the greyhound racing sector in Ireland can continue under appropriate rules and regulations.

My Department, along with the sector itself, is committed to the continued strengthening of welfare standards in the industry. A key element of the new legislation is the provision, for the first time, for a full IT traceability system for racing greyhounds. This system traces life stages, including birth, registration, racing career and all changes of ownership and location through to end of life. Data from the system at the end of September indicated that 42,600 greyhounds were subject to traceability. Phase 2 of that tracing system, RCÉTS, is currently in development and will include additional functionality to facilitate the recording of injuries at RCÉ-licensed stadia during racing and official and unofficial trials. It will also capture details relating to euthanasia of a greyhound by a veterinary surgeon, medical records and health checks carried out by veterinary surgeons. In addition to its care and welfare programme, RCÉ has a comprehensive range of activity in the areas of regulatory, integrity and laboratory functions.

Given the wide geographic distribution of both these industries, I strongly recommend the adoption of the increase in the ceiling. I look forward to engagement with committee members. I again thank the Cathaoirleach for taking the time to facilitate this.

Senator Paul Daly

I welcome the Minister and his officials. As required, I put on record that I have a racehorse in training, which I bred myself, so I am an owner and a breeder. I am a director and former chairman of Kilbeggan Race Company Limited. It will be no shock to anybody that I welcome the fund.

There is a lot of debate about this fund annually. It has to come before us annually and that triggers the debate. This year, more than any, the fund has been under the spotlight because of the study done by the Football Association of Ireland and the comparison being made between its funding and the betting tax. I ask the Minister for clarification that this fund is not directly related in any way to the betting tax, as was inferred. While many people make that correlation, it is correct to say there is absolutely no correlation between the two. The take from the betting tax and the spend on the horse and greyhound fund are similar-sized sums, but I seek clarification to clear up the point that this fund is not paid from the betting tax.

I will make another comparison. As I said, as a director of a small rural racetrack, we have to do a lot of development, as do all racetracks, to maintain our animal welfare standards, in particular. For example, in our situation in the past couple of years, we had to upgrade stabling, rubberise the ground in the parade ring, and put in a watering system to keep the ground safe, again, from an animal welfare point of view. We also had to install CCTV, as has been mentioned at committee meetings. When we are mandated to do that, it is a mandate. We cannot apply for sports capital funding. That is why it is the Minister for agriculture who is present. Horse racing and greyhound racing come under the Department of agriculture. Again, to make the comparison with special funding, it almost looks like racing and greyhound racing, which are industries as much as sports, are getting this special treatment. Some €150 million was given out last year in sports capital funding but Kilbeggan Races could not apply for one penny of that. We depend on grants from HRI to part fund all those developments, which we have to do or we will not get our racing licence. This fund is used by HRI to part fund all our capital developments. That is akin to the sports capital grant application that is available to other sporting bodies. It is important that is said too. A myth is out there that all this money goes towards prize money, but it filters down to rural tracks through grants and capital grant allocations.

On that note of it filtering down, what input does the Minister and his Department officials have on where the money is spent? I would like to see, and many people have contacted me about this, some way that some portion of this money could be used as an incentive scheme for small breeders. Racing is like soccer. Everybody talks about the premiership and the great international success we have. For the premiership to work, there have to be leagues one, two and three. There are people in racing who are in the equivalent of league three. Without them, there would be no premiership, but they are struggling. It costs as much to have a horse that is competing at the lower level as it does to have one that can be successful and go to the top. Many breeders out there cannot afford to go to the big stallions and are struggling. We saw the sales figures last week. Many a foal was sold for less than the cover for the stallion cost. We could lose those small breeders with one or two mares, in particular, farmers who might just have one or two horses running with their cattle. If they cannot get some support, we will start losing them. As I said, to use the premiership analogy, if we start losing the lower divisions, it will eventually filter through and while we may not lose the top, it will not be as strong as it is currently.

The Minister said it all in his statement regarding the number of jobs, and the amount of financial spend through tourism and people attending racing. We are getting a very good return for this investment. The old saying is "You have to speculate to accumulate". The big plus from this fund is that the majority, if not practically all, of the money is going into rural areas, where there are not that many other opportunities for jobs. The racing industry creates a lot of jobs. Be they stable staff, trainers, trainers' assistants or farriers, it is keeping many small, local, rural merchants going through feed, whether it is haylage or whatever. It is money going into an area where there are not too many other opportunities. For that reason, it has to be very welcome.

I compliment HRI and Rásaíocht Con Éireann on the work they have done to date with this money from an animal welfare and integrity point of view.

I stress, to paraphrase a former leader of our party, that a lot is done, but there is a lot more to be done. We need to keep our finger on the pulse of animal welfare and integrity. As I say, a lot has been done. There have been many improvements in the last few years. I know the Minister and Department have put stipulations on the two organisations to improve their lot in that area. It is an area in which we can never take our eye off the ball. I stress that the Minister and the Department need to closely monitor that and that, every year, a certain proportion of the money needs to be directed towards animal welfare and integrity.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

I thank the Senator. First, I confirm that it is not tied to the betting tax. It is dealt with separately in the budgetary envelope. When it initially commenced, over 20 years ago, it would have been tied to it, but it has not been for a long time. The Senator is right that it is not just a sport. It is an industry, and it is very different from others because of that. There is a whole ecosystem and industry underneath the sport that drives the sport. The sport can be seen at racetracks, at point-to-point races, and at some of our premier racetracks at weekends. There is a breeding industry and a worldwide industry that is very much part of that. That creates significant employment and economic return. State funding is central to that. It makes sure that our racing sector is competitive and that we are attracting horses into the country from internationally. It makes us competitive compared with other countries that also invest in their industries through various means and mechanisms. If we want to stay at the top end of this across the globe and to maintain an industry that was built up in collaboration with the talent, skills and graft of the people in the sector over many years, working with the State, then this fund is important.

The Senator is right about the horse-racing sector, the thoroughbred sector, bloodstock, sport horses and so on, as well as greyhounds. Welfare and integrity are important. We take them seriously and attach conditionality about them to the funding.

Regarding how the funding is distributed, we have statutory boards in place, which are HRI and Rásaíocht Con Éireann. They are tasked with the stewardship of the sector and with engaging and collaborating with stakeholders in the sector to set the best possible course to make sure that we have effective spending. For example, in the horse racing sector last year, 70% of all horses that would have run at any level would have won prize money. It was quite broad, to different extents.

Senator Paul Daly

I am in the 30%.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

Maybe next year.

Senator Victor Boyhan

I will be brief. I thank the Minister for his presentation. It is a good news story for Horse Racing Ireland. It is €76 million. The Minister has set out the reasons and logic for increasing the top-up funding, because that is what it is. It is effectively a requirement for the Minister to bring this proposal to both Houses of the Oireachtas to get approval for the top-up ceiling. I will not talk about the dogs today. I will concentrate on the horse racing sport and the €76 million, which is to be welcomed.

The Minister briefly touched on the tripartite agreement. That no longer exists with Great Britain, because of the EU Brexit trade agreement and so on. That is a major challenge. If one looks at taking bloodstock or horses into Ireland, equines can only travel from Great Britain to the border posts of Dublin Airport, Shannon Airport, Dublin Port and Rosslare Europort. They are the only four places where they are permitted to come into Ireland. There are significant issues depending on the type of equine, the type of movement, minimum duration of residency and segregation, which may apply under the regulations. There are challenges relating to that.

Look at the reverse, with equines moving from Ireland to Great Britain. Movements of live animals from Ireland to Great Britain must be notified to the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs in the UK before they happen. There has to be 24 hours' notice. There are time-lapses. Other veterinary health clarifications are required for the movement of equines between the two jurisdictions. This poses challenges. I raised the matter with the Minister last year. Does he see any resolution to that? Of course, we have an arrangement or protocol regarding equines going from the North to the South. That is an added complication. Of course, things are moving on and may change. We have the Windsor Framework and so on, which is to be welcomed, as the Minister said in his opening statement. Can he touch on the tripartite agreement and the challenges that presents to the industry? Is there any negotiation and dialogue? We would commonly have many equines going to France and Great Britain. Are any developments or negotiations going on? Clearly, there have to veterinary and health checks. Those are vital. We cannot compromise on that and it would not be right to compromise on that, but, pre Brexit, the arrangement was very different. We had a much freer flow of equines. That added time is causing some complications. Is anyone monitoring that process? What feedback is coming from the people on the ground who are involved in the movement of very valuable equines and the necessity of turning them around to get them heading home again? There are many challenges with that.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

I thank Senator Boyhan. It has become more challenging. The tripartite agreement that was in place before Brexit worked well and smoothly. Like everything else, the decision about Brexit made life more difficult and more complicated. Our objective as a Government throughout has been to try to make sure that that can be unknotted as well as possible to continue the flow and engagement between us and Britain, and with Northern Ireland, in every way we could. Brexit has made things more difficult and challenging. There are no two ways about it. There is still good travel and good traffic, both from a breeding point of view and racing point of view. The tripartite agreement that had been there been us, France and the UK was replaced by a bipartite agreement with France specifically. There has been good flow and engagement with France through a derogation that allows for easier movement of eligible high health status thoroughbred horses on a commercial document validated by the industry rather than Government health certificates. That is flowing well between us and France.

On movement from Northern Ireland into the Republic, a North-South bipartite agreement was put in place from 1 January 2021 to continue to facilitate the movement of horses. There has not been any change regarding the movement of horses between Northern Ireland and Britain. In short, it is more challenging but we are still operating in any way we can. Obviously, these are, more broadly, competencies between the EU and UK.

Senator Victor Boyhan

I have one final question, which I know was put to the Minister last year. If he looks at the debates going back over a number of years in both Houses, he will see that this issue has been raised again and again. It is the decoupling of funding for greyhounds as opposed to horse racing. The focus of most of the critics tends to be on the dogs. That is not what I think. That is what the debates are showing us. I know it is tied up legislatively at the moment. Is there any reason to, is it possible or is it desirable to decouple the funding and have two separate strands? I know this is governed by some legislation. They are very much intertwined, yet they are very different in many ways. What is the logic behind it? Has it been considered? Can it happen? Should it happen? What would the Minister recommend?

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

It could happen. Obviously, the Oireachtas can decide to change the law if it sees fit. I do not see a necessity for it. I think that balance was struck when the fund was set up back in 2001. I think the ratio is 80:20 for the engagement we have with HRI compared with Rásaíocht Con Éireann. It is factored into both industries. I do not see a need to adjust that but it would be possible to adjust it if the Oireachtas decided to.

Senator Victor Boyhan

The Minister is happy that it is working, manageable, clean, and relatively tidy to administer.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

Both funds have increased by just under 4% this year.

For the orderly support of any sector, that is reasonable and to be expected. Both sectors are able to maximise the impact and utilisation of the funding we are giving them for the benefit of the industry and to make sure they are as strong as possible. Any adjustment that could see reduction for either sector would have an impact. I do not see a need to address that.

Deputy Claire Kerrane

I thank the Minister for his opening statement and the briefing document. First, it is important to acknowledge the sector and the importance of it to our rural communities, for which sometimes there is not much more than greyhound and horse racing and all that. It is very important to those communities and I want to acknowledge that. At the same time, €95 million is an awful lot of money. No one in this room would say otherwise. What is the rationale for the €95 million? How does the Minister arrive at that figure of €95 million for this year?

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

It is a 4% increase on last year. As with any sector, it is growing and dealing with inflationary challenges and the challenges that evolve from year to year. To be clear, like every other sector, most will be looking for more of an increase than what we can provide. For both the thoroughbred industry and the greyhound industry, the horse and greyhound fund is important to make sure they operate under the structures they have. Were we not to give reasonable increases year on year, it would leave them at a disadvantage compared with any other sector in society that avails of public funding.

Deputy Claire Kerrane

I understand the increase of 4%. That is fine. If the figure was €90 million, €85 million or €80 million I would still have the same question. How does the Minister arrive at that figure? Do the sectors come and look for a specific figure? Has the Minister given them exactly what they have looked for? Have they looked for more and has he given less? How was the figure of €95 million arrived at for this year?

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

Generally it is fair to say that they would be looking for more and getting less than what would be looked for. As with all of the State agencies, they would come to me with prebudget submissions laying out their plans for the year and their asks and their ambition levels. That would then form part of the prebudget engagement. I would meet them to discuss their asks and across all Government agencies I would do the best I could to try to support them for the year ahead. It would be based on their submissions, what they would like to do and achieve and how State funding, in this case the horse and greyhound fund, would contribute to that.

Deputy Claire Kerrane

The Minister will be familiar with the amendment calling for an analysis or review of the funding under different headings that my predecessor, Deputy Carthy, brought forward for a number of years. Has there been an analysis by the Department of the money that is provided every year and where it is going? Do the sectors provide a breakdown of what they spend it on, line for line? It is taxpayers' money at the end of the day. For transparency and accountability, is there something given back to the Minister showing how they spend it, line for line?

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

There is an annual report. There is ongoing engagement between my Department and each of the agencies. That is an important ongoing relationship over the course of the year. They have that opportunity and this committee has the opportunity to engage with each of the organisations and hold them accountable as well. We have conducted a review. We are tendering shortly for an independent review of the fund, to do an external review as a matter of course, in terms of just getting further assessment and oversight on the value of the fund and its impact.

Deputy Claire Kerrane

That is due to go to tender shortly and it is an external independent review of the fund.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

Yes.

Deputy Claire Kerrane

Okay, great. That is positive and welcome. Regarding the 80:20 split, can the Minister give me the rationale as to how that is determined? How does he decide that one gets 80% and the other gets 20%?

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

That has been the case since the fund being set up in 2001. Both sectors have been availing of that fund year on year. Both would be ambitious in terms of how they support their industries. Both are always looking to push that, as you would expect with any other agency. This year it is a 4% increase for both.

An Cathaoirleach

There is a vote in the Dáil. We will suspend and resume after the vote.

Sitting suspended at 6.15 p.m. and resumed at 6.34 p.m.

An Cathaoirleach

We will resume now in public session. Deputy Kerrane has another ten minutes speaking time.

Deputy Claire Kerrane

I thank the Minister and want to ask him about animal welfare, which is very important in terms of the funding being provided. On page 4, the Minister talks about the high standards of integrity and welfare and ensuring that those are maintained. Can he give the committee a little more information as to who determines that those welfare standards are as high as he says they are? Where does that information or oversight come from?

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

The board of Rásaíocht Con Éireann is doing very significant work on this and I have also made it a requirement and made it clear that the future funding is dependent on continued progress in welfare standards. There has been very significant progress on the tracing system over the past while and there has also been significant work by Rásaíocht Con Éireann on the rehoming of dogs. It is spending more than we have set out as a minimum threshold. The sector, overall, is very clear on the absolute imperative for good animal welfare standards being the foundation upon which the industry will continue to be sustainable and have a strong future, and the board takes that very seriously. I am confident that the work in this area is very strong and I am insisting on that.

Deputy Claire Kerrane

I suggest that the Minister might consider requesting that there is a breakdown, where the Minister is giving €95 million, and I do not believe it is much to ask both bodies to come back to him and tell him what these bodies spend this funding on in the year. For accountability and transparency, that should be asked of them. It is not a big deal and that should be provided on an annual basis. I know that there is an annual report but we should have a breakdown, line for line, of that €95 million, which it is a great deal of taxpayers' money, and we should know exactly what it is spent on. I will leave it at that.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

There is very strong monitoring and end of year reporting also on all of the expenditure.

Further, on the requirement for expenditure on welfare, including integrity, we also require quarterly reports on progress on the continued implementation of the care and welfare programme.

Deputy Claire Kerrane

I thank the Minister.

An Cathaoirleach

Okay. I call Deputy Kehoe to speak now, please.

Deputy Paul Kehoe

I have only a small number of questions. I first want to welcome the Minister and his officials. This is a fund I very much support and welcome. There is a fantastic return for the Government’s investment into the industry.

On the greyhound sector, I am aware that there was an issue a number of years ago about the closure of a number of greyhound tracks around the country and there were some recommendations. I know that our own track in Enniscorthy, which is a private track, is washing its face well financially and is doing a very good job. Not being parochial about this but it is recognised within the greyhound sector that that is the case.

Is the Minister aware of any track closures or what feedback is the Minister getting back from the greyhound industry or board?

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

The greyhound board is to sign off on its strategic plan for bringing the industry forward and it has just had a new CEO appointed there in the past couple of weeks. He was a former CEO of Cork County Council, Tim Lucey, who is a man of great background, experience and capacity. My Department has been engaging with Rásaíocht Con Éireann on finalising that strategic plan. This will be a statutory matter for the board to fully consider how to bring this sector forward and to fully consider also the sustainable future of the tracks under the remit through which they are funded. We will be engaging further with Rásaíocht Con Éireann on its strategic plan.

Deputy Paul Kehoe

I thank the Minister very much for that.

In his statement on page 3, the Minister states that the total value of Irish foal exports sold at public auction in 2022 amounted to over €293 million. Last week Horse Sport Ireland appeared before the committee here regarding passports for foals and their sale.

I do not believe Horse Sport Ireland falls under the Minister's responsibility. but is he aware of this? There is a delay of months for passports for the sale of foals. The €293 million is of extravagant value to the horse industry. Will the Minister look into it to see what is the delay and whether his Department or the Government can do something to resolve any issues that exist?

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

I am aware of the issues. Those involved are working to try to resolve the issues in relation to delays. It is important that there be timely issuing of horse passports.

An Cathaoirleach

So it is under the Minister’s remit, is it not?

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

It is under my remit, yes. There is joint funding of Horse Sport Ireland activities by my Department and the Department of sport, but it comes under my remit in terms of the board and reporting structures. We need timely management and issuing of passports. It is something I am aware of and that my team are engaging with Horse Sport Ireland on.

Deputy Paul Kehoe

I was not inspired by the replies from the officials from Horse Sport Ireland last week. This is a huge issue to many breeders who depend on the issuing of passports. I encourage the Minister and his Department to get on top of this, bring them in and meet them to tell them this is causing huge concerns to many breeders. The Minister rightly said that this realised €293 million in 2022. The foal industry is part of the breeding process and important for exports and the good name of the Irish breeder. I ask the Minister to look into that.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

I will have my team follow up with them further on it and work to ensure it is addressed.

Deputy Joe Flaherty

I thank the Minister and officials for coming in. To follow on from Deputy Kehoe, I do not intend to-----

An Cathaoirleach

It is the horse and greyhound fund tonight.

Deputy Joe Flaherty

That is all right. I do not intend to go into the horse sport sector too much but we had Horse Sport Ireland in here and there are significant issues. I understand there is a day scheduled for the Minister to come before us to address that. I will be raising those issues at that point. I put him on notice that there are serious concerns with passports and the formation of the new board. We look forward to having the Minister back. In compliance with the Chair, I will stick with the agenda for today.

An Cathaoirleach

When you have said what you wanted to say.

Deputy Joe Flaherty

I commend the Minister’s commitment to horse racing. He will be in no doubt that the committee is hugely passionate about horse racing. It is a calling card for us across the world and we are proud of it. This is a €2.5 billion industry that supports 30,000 jobs. The third highest number of foals were foaled in Ireland last year, after Australia and America, with total sales of €293 million. It is a massive industry.

I will make two points in the context of echoing what other members stated. On the integrity of the sport and anti-doping, the findings of this committee’s report was that we at least match international best practice in both respects. We should impress upon the industry not to match but to be the benchmark for all other sectors. To protect the integrity of the €2.5 billion industry, that is critical. I hope in future deliberations with the sector, the Minister reminds it of that.

Horse welfare is important, and that fact needs to be to the fore when moneys are being provided. We need to insist on it at all times but we forget sometimes a horse is only as good as the jockey, support staff and stable staff. I have increasing concerns about general welfare in the industry. Many people go in very young with the best of intentions, see it as a potentially great career and it does not, unfortunately, work out for them, particularly in relation to jockeys. Many struggle to find a role within or outside the industry. There is an onus on the committee, the Minister and the Department to impress upon this valuable industry that it needs to be more responsible towards its staff, particularly those who fall out of involvement with the industry. I would look at what is happening in the UK for footballers who do not make the grade. Significant efforts are made to provide future education paths for them. I would like to see something like that coming from the horse-racing industry.

Aside from that, I welcome the Minister’s continued support. It is important and will always get a warm welcome from the committee.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

I absolutely agree with the Deputy on integrity and welfare being central to the success of the horse industry, as well as to the greyhound industry. That is something I am clear on at all times. It is a key part of our funding that those standards be met. I take the Deputy’s point on careers in the sector and the importance of supporting people to have as many viable careers as possible. Good progress has been made on supports around education. It is important we continue that.

Deputy Johnny Mythen

I thank the Minister and his officials for being here. The Minister said he was interested in balanced regional economic growth. How is he going about that? What is the process? Often in rural areas, the regional breakdown is not very good.

On the equine anti-doping programme, the review concluded the programme does “at least match international best practice in most respects and has made significant advances in recent years”. In what respects did it not do so?

The tripartite agreement was mentioned. Brexit brought major problems to the country as regards animals. The Windsor Framework is now in place. Can the Minister approach his counterparts in Europe? Can Ireland be given a derogation in respect of the tripartite agreement? As the Minister knows, our major racing industry is in England as well.

Deputy Kehoe raised that many people in the greyhound sector are unhappy about how private tracks like our little track in Enniscorthy are left to fend for themselves. It is like the industry has left the smaller tracks behind. These are very important but do not seem to get the same funding.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

The tripartite agreement is something we have engaged proactively on but it is a Brexit impact and therefore a matter between the EU and UK. It is symptomatic of many things that have changed. Any way in which we can smooth the pathway and work, through the EU, with the UK, we will. It is-----

Deputy Johnny Mythen

Has the Minister asked for a derogation? Has he approached-----

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

We have raised the issue with the EU at different times. We have also looked at its functionality to make it work as smoothly as possible.

Deputy Johnny Mythen

It seems to be a win-win situation for the two sides.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

I agree, but if we were going with win-win situations, we would not have had Brexit in the first place.

Deputy Johnny Mythen

I know that. I understand that, but-----

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

Any further flexibilities around that, we would be open to pursuing and would pursue.

The report the IHRB commissioned from international expert Dr. Craig Suann outlined how we at least matched international best practice in most respects. There were 18 recommendations from Dr. Suann coming out of that; 14 of those recommendations have been addressed or implemented with additional funding and collaboration needed for the remainder. Plans are now in place to operationalise the remaining recommendations when resources allow.

The IHRB stated that the key recommendations from Dr. Suann's report had been implemented by the end of June. Those included, for example, enhancing the body's race-day sampling, out-of-competition strategies and the introduction of CCTV sampling units. We now have CCTV functional across all IHRB sampling, and the IHRB veterinary team also received training in its operation in June 2023. There were other recommendations, which are being stepped out.

Deputy Johnny Mythen

What about the local tracks?

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

Is the Deputy talking about the horse racing sector in particular?

Deputy Johnny Mythen

No, greyhounds. I apologise.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

As part of its statutory function, the Rásaíocht Con Éireann board is putting together its strategic plan, and finalising it at the moment. Its objective is to make sure it is supporting tracks that are sustainable, and making them sustainable to ensure the sector is as strong as possible. The strategic plan will be considering that and looking at the footprint across the country and how it can be supported.

Deputy Johnny Mythen

I will say that I very much welcome the external independent review. It is important.

Deputy Michael Fitzmaurice

When money is given out, are there provisos to make clear that smaller tracks around the country have to be looked after? We saw all of that especially for the smaller racetracks earlier in the year. I know it was not directly in relation to moneys, as that side has television rights and so on. Second, is the testing of horses part of that budget? I presume it is with all the talk about alleged doping and new systems to make sure we test horses. My third question is about something that is part of the budget, whether or not we want to talk about it today. As part of the registering process, contracts on stud books have been given out to different people. It was stated clearly here the other day that the Department had stopped the manual and the new system running together. The Department was blamed for not allowing that and for being the reason there is such a logjam with the books. What are the Minister's thoughts on that? The Department should be giving advice to these people who are getting fair lumps of taxpayer money, which is needed because it goes to a lot of rural areas and helps out. There is bickering and court cases and the Minister has to move in to put in place new committees or new people to look after things. It is not doing the industry any favours, when it is getting the amount of money it gets from the taxpayers. It needs to realise that.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

Is the Deputy talking about the horse sport sector?

Deputy Michael Fitzmaurice

Yes.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

On small tracks, there is an obligation through HRI to try to ensure a healthy sector across the board. This is an ecosystem. We have small trainers, small breeders and smaller tracks. All of that needs to be healthy for the overall sector to be healthy. That is something we expect HRI to work to, in terms of the parameters set out for it. We expect them to work to ensure a good spread. A lot of this comes through prize money and supporting prize funds at the different tracks to make sure they have horses running and to attract them in, as well as working with them from a capital investment point of view. Last year there were more than 388 fixtures, with total of just above 8,000 individual runners. Some 26% of these horses won at least one race across different race types. Approximately 5,500 individual runners won prize money at some stage. That equates to approximately 70% of individual runners. Of the 2,800 individual races, more than 2,400 had prize money of less than €25,000, with 113 having prize money greater than €100,000. There is a spread across the funding.

On capital investment, it is an obligation and part of the role of HRI to work with the different tracks on how they can partner to support the development and facilities of the different tracks. We will be having another engagement on Horse Sport Ireland in the coming weeks. The new board is in place there for more than a year. I am happy to go into that in more detail the next day.

Senator Eugene Murphy

I welcome the Minister and his officials. I welcome the money for horse racing. I will not go into greyhound racing. I come from County Roscommon, and we have a racetrack there. Between April and October we have meetings. It is such an important part of the local economy. We should never lose sight of that fact. We talk about budgets and the amount of money. I think Deputy Fitzmaurice or somebody else has mentioned that we have 30,000 people employed in this industry. There are 26 racecourses, so there are 26 little businesses running from March and April right up to October and November every year. If that were not to be supported, or if it were not in a pretty healthy state, the parts of rural Ireland where they have those racecourses would be an awful lot worse off. It is a huge benefit to the local economy. You will hear this if you could talk to somebody in a filling station or a restaurant in Roscommon, Kilbeggan, Ballinrobe or Galway. Deputy Fitzmaurice and Senator Daly would know about this. Those racing events, dates and festivals are really important to local employment and the local economy. I was looking back on the history of County Roscommon. As far as I know, and I stand to be corrected, many of those racecourses are there since 1840 - approximately 180 years. It is a sport that was loved. It is also important to note that people want good standards. They want everything to be above board. Irish people enjoy racing quite a lot. It is an important sport, in particular for rural Ireland.

I will turn to funding. Considerable work has been done in Roscommon in recent years. I presume all of that comes out of a budget like this. Racecourses do not qualify for lottery sports grants or anything like that. Is all of the work being done funded by what is allocated to them out of this budget?

I will also say something about prize money. I like a bit of racing myself, and I think our race prize money is quite generous in this country. There is quite a lot of money for a number of races. However, the important point for me with horse racing is that it is a business with 30,000 jobs, which for most of the year benefits the local economy. It is really important we look after that, apart from the horse breeding and exporting in that area, which is really important. I just have that question on the fund raising.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

The prize money certainly does. That is important for races operating on tracks like Roscommon, to attract horses and ensure prize money is spread across horses of all grades and types. The capital funding will also come through this fund to HRI. Since between 2015 and 2023, the total capital grants through HRI were just above €35 million. Through partnering with local tracks, that would have seen some investment of approximately €150 million overall across different types of tracks. That also comes through the fund.

Obviously, that is really important for tracks such as that in Roscommon mentioned by the Senator.

An Cathaoirleach

On the prize money, it is very important that we keep the level of prize money we have because we have managed to attract major owners from other countries to keep their horses here and there is a huge benefit from that. The quality of racing here has improved dramatically and that obviously boosts attendance etc. There was a time when we struggled to win two or three races in Cheltenham or Aintree; now, we win the majority of our races there. Our level of prize money is important. If you look across the waters at the UK, especially in the national hunt scene, which is in a very poor place, the owners are deserting it in droves. The prize money here is a lot of it. Some people say that the big owners get the lion's share of prize money but they go to the store sales and they buy the winning point-to-pointers, and pay very big prices for them on a lot of occasions. Therefore, the money filters down. It might not filter down in the prize money. We could see the prize money going to the likes of J.P. McManus and Rich Ricci but they are often investing hugely. There was a sale of point-to-pointers in Cheltenham last week and the vast majority were Irish horses. Most of them come back here to race and that is as a result of the infrastructure we put in place. When something is going well, we definitely do not want to interfere with it and I know the Minister is not going to.

The other question I ask, and I have not heard it mentioned for a while, is on harness racing. If you think back to the previous committee here, the association was lobbying very hard to get seed funding to establish harness racing. Is that still on the Minister's radar, has it gone off the boil, or what is the situation with it?

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

First, I agree with the Cathaoirleach on the prize money. It really is a key anchor and fulcrum around which the industry revolves and which really supports it. It supports the industry through different levels as well. As I said in my earlier contributions, internationally in other countries, racing is also supported by the Exchequer so it is important we compete and we have done. It has been no accident that we have built up the world-leading position we have and we tinker with that at our peril. We do not plan to tinker with it. We plan to continue to build on the strong collaboration we have which is seen as successful and has been rebuilt.

Regarding the Irish Harness Racing Association, I made an allocation in budget 2023 for the sector. There has been engagement between my team and the association on an ongoing basis regarding the best way to support the sector and utilise that funding. Alongside that, from 2016 onwards, we have seen grants totalling €175,000 paid to the IHRA, under the equine infrastructure scheme operated by the Department. There was €27,000 allocated under the scheme as well to the Irish Harness Racing Association for 2022. There is ongoing engagement with my Department and there has been a funding commitment there as well to help support it in taking the sector forward.

An Cathaoirleach

I want to make one final point. We talked about a report being done into the greyhound industry and in the past we had recommendations to close certain tracks. If we close a track in any part of the country, the dog pool in that area will disappear because dog owners will not travel significant distances to trial or race their dogs. Any track closures will have a significant impact on the greyhound industry. I know the attendance some of the smaller tracks get would not be huge but they are feeder tracks for the likes of Shelbourne Park and the tracks in the UK. Greyhound racing has recovered significantly in the UK and new tracks have opened in England which are being supplied by great Irish dogs but those provincial tracks are very important to keep the breeding industry going. I will not mention one in case I will be accused of prompting the closure of any track, but if a track closes, the pool of dogs in that area will disappear.

Deputy Charlie McConalogue

I take the Cathaoirleach's point.

An Cathaoirleach

On behalf of the committee, I thank the Minister and his officials for assisting the committee in the consideration of the Horse and Greyhound Racing Fund Regulations 2023. In accordance with Standing Orders, a message will be sent to the Clerk of the Dáil and the Clerk of the Seanad to say the committee has completed its consideration of the motion.