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JOINT COMMITTEE ON EUROPEAN AFFAIRS díospóireacht -
Thursday, 14 May 2009

General Affairs and External Relations Council: Discussion with Minister of State at Department of Foreign Affairs.

We have received apologies from Deputies Pat Breen, Thomas Byrne and Mary O'Rourke and Senators Paschal Donohoe and Maurice Cummins.

No. 1 is a discussion in advance of the General Affairs and External Relations Council with the Minister of State with responsibility for European affairs, Deputy Dick Roche. I welcome the Minister of State and his entourage. I understand the Minister of State has other pressing appointments, so we will not detain him other than in the normal fashion. I understand the GAERC will be attended by the Minister for Defence and the Minister of State with responsibility for overseas development as well as the Minister for Foreign Affairs. Such meetings are called "jumbo" GAERC meetings and are held once in each Presidency to discuss the European security and defence policy and the EU development aid policy in addition to the usual general affairs and external relations issues. There will be a long agenda.

I now hand over to the Minister of State for his opening remarks.

I thank the Chairman and agree it will be a long agenda.The Minister of State, Deputy Peter Power and I, will attend. At the last or perhaps second last meeting of this committee it was suggested we should report on the previous GAERC as well as looking forward, and I will do that today. I apologise as it makes the address a little longer, but it is important.

I thank the Chairman for the opportunity to discuss the agenda for the upcoming GAERC but before the preview I will provide a full account of the April meeting of the Council. The principal item discussed during the general affairs session of last month's meeting was the current state of play in the Croatian accession negotiations. This, incidentally, was also discussed at the Gymnich which preceded that meeting. The main feature of the discussion was Croatia's border dispute with Slovenia, which involves a small sliver of sea to the front of Izola and Piran. Ministers supported Commissioner Rehn's mediation efforts and hoped that issue could be resolved soon to allow the accession process to move forward.

The Presidency also briefed the Council on the summits which were held last week in Prague. These were the eastern partnership summit, which was attended by the Taoiseach and which successfully launched the eastern partnership initiative of the European neighbourhood policy, and the southern corridor summit, which dealt with the issue of the gas transit. In an important development, Turkey signed up to the southern corridor, thus advancing the prospects of diversification of energy supplies into the EU. Members will recall the dispute that took place earlier this year over the passage of gas through Ukraine.

The Presidency also briefed Ministers on the arrangements for the employment summit, which was held in Prague on 7 May and was attended by the Prime Ministers of the Czech Republic, Sweden and Spain, the President of the European Commission and the European social partners. The summit agreed a general strategy aimed at alleviating the worst effects of the present economic crisis as well as maintaining employment and promoting job creation, including measures to increase access to employment for young people, upgrade workforce skills, match labour market needs with skills and promote mobility in the labour market. At the meeting, Malta raised the issue of illegal immigration and the particular problems faced by it — which are significant, given Malta's size — and other southern Mediterranean states due to illegal migration flows from north Africa. Malta, supported by Italy, called upon the EU to intensify its efforts to address, in particular, the issue of illegal immigration in the region. No conclusions were reached.

Discussion of external relations issues began with the prospects for the Middle East peace process, particularly in the context of the formation of a new Israeli Government and the recent EU-US informal summit which took place in Prague in early April. This was followed by a presentation by Commissioner Ferrero-Waldner on the communication and progress reports on the European neighbourhood policy recently prepared by the Commission. Ministers then agreed the renewal of the EU's Common Position on restrictive measures in the case of Burma and adopted Council conclusions. Recognising that there is not yet sufficient political progress which would justify changes in the Common Position at this time, Ireland proposed that the roll-over of this Common Position be accompanied by forward-looking conclusions. These conclusions reflected the fact that while there has been no political progress to date, the EU remains willing to review the Common Position and to consider positive incentives in the event that genuine political progress is made. Members in the committee will be aware that the situation in Burma has, if anything, deteriorated in the past 24 hours after a foolhardy action by a representative of an American NGO in swimming to Aung San Suu Kyi's lakeside home. As a consequence, she is now in difficulties. That person should have curbed his enthusiasm.

The Council also briefly discussed Sri Lanka and issued comprehensive conclusions. These expressed deep concern at the continuing conflict in Sri Lanka, the mass civilian casualties and the deteriorating humanitarian situation there. In particular, Ministers urged an immediate humanitarian ceasefire to allow for a UN-assisted evacuation of those still trapped in the conflict zone and urged the Government of Sri Lanka to co-operate fully with the UN and to allow international oversight of all internally displaced persons as soon as they have left the conflict zone. Ministers repeated their call on the Sri Lankan Government to proceed urgently towards an inclusive and peaceful political process.

Unfortunately, the humanitarian situation in Sri Lanka has not improved since the last meeting. Members will have read daily reports of continuing violence in the north of the country, including the terrible assaults which took place over the weekend in which hundreds of innocent civilians are reported to have been killed and injured. As a result of the exacerbation of that situation over the weekend this item has now been added to Monday's agenda. I very much commend the interest members of the Joint Committee on Foreign Affairs have taken in this issue.

At Belgium's request, there was a brief discussion on ways to enhance the effectiveness of the EU naval operation against piracy on the Somali coast. This item will be discussed in greater detail at the Council this month and I shall return to it in more detail later.

Over lunch, Ministers discussed future steps following the recent meeting of Heads of State and Government with President Obama. The discussion focused on areas of shared interest such as Iran, Afghanistan and Pakistan and the situation in the Middle East. The Council also discussed Moldova, focusing on events in that country after the recent elections. Ukraine was also discussed, particularly with regard to the political crisis there which has been compounded by the energy and global economic crises. At a meeting in Madrid last Monday I had a bilateral meeting with the Ukrainian Minister for Foreign Affairs.

There was a brief discussion of the approach adopted by the EU at the Durban review conference on racism, racial discrimination, xenophobia and related intolerance.

Concerning next week's meeting of the General Affairs and External Relations Council, GAERC, there are several significant items on the agenda. As the Chairman noted, it is a jumbo council. As members of the committee may be aware, it is the practice for development co-operation Ministers to attend one meeting of the Council per Presidency and this month the Council will consider a range of issues relating to development and co-operation policy. My colleague, the Minister of State with responsibility for development co-operation, Deputy Peter Power, will represent Ireland during these discussions.

With the Chairman's permission, I propose to address the GAERC items in turn, as they appear on the agenda.

The only item for discussion during the general affairs session is the Presidency's current version of the annotated draft agenda for the European Council on 18 and 19 June. The Council's rules of procedure require the GAERC to draw up an agenda at least four weeks ahead of a European Council. Although the draft agenda, which was circulated on Tuesday, is very much an outline, it is clear that a key issue to be dealt with will be the legal guarantees for Ireland in respect of the Lisbon treaty. We are working actively on these guarantees and hope they will be agreed at the June European Council. The scope of these guarantees was set down in the conclusions of the December European Council, which were very specific. We were very happy with them and are working on them. The process in which we are engaged at present involves turning these commitments into legally robust guarantees that will provide our people with genuine reassurances on the key issues that caused concern last year.

Only when we are fully satisfied with the form and content of these guarantees will we proceed to consult the people on a new Lisbon treaty package which will be adjusted in Ireland's case on foot of these guarantees. We will be engaged in intensive consultations in the coming weeks as we prepare for the June Council. I know members present today are particularly anxious about this. This work will include discussions with other Oireachtas parties aimed at ensuring maximum political support for this process, the success of which is a national priority. I believe, and am sure most people in this room believe, it transcends all political party issues in this nation. It is in our best interests as a nation to resolve the uncertainties surrounding the treaty sooner rather than later. For that reason, we are determined to press for agreement on our legal guarantees in June.

The summer European Council will also address the current economic, financial and social situation. The crisis currently affecting all EU member states has served to underline the value of working together as Europeans and, in Ireland's case, of belonging to a strong currency like the euro. If there ever were any doubts about that they have been dispelled by what has happened here and elsewhere in Europe in the past 12 months.

The meeting will also deal with the vital issue of climate change and sustainable development, which is a major priority for the Union in the run-up to the Copenhagen summit later this year.

Concerning external relations, the Presidency has indicated that the European Council may have an exchange of views on two or three relevant international issues. I shall deal with these now.

The first item on the external relations agenda is the preparations for the EU-Russia summit, which will take place on 21 and 22 May. The summit will be hosted by Mr. Dmitry Medvedev, President of the Russian Federation, who will be accompanied by Mr. Sergey Lavrov, Minister for Foreign Affairs. The EU will be represented by the Czech President, Mr. Václav Klaus, the Secretary General and High Representative, Dr. Javier Solana, and the President of the Commission, Mr. José Manuel Durao Barroso. It should be a very interesting meeting. This will be the third occasion on which President Medvedev has represented Russia at an EU-Russia summit. The meeting will take place at a less tense time in the relationship than was the case during last November's summit, which was overshadowed by the August crisis in Georgia and its aftermath.

The EU and Russia share very important economic, political and security interests and remain interdependent and essential partners on many issues. We also have points on which we disagree. This is normal in any relationship as broad as that between the EU and Russia. Our ongoing dialogue with Russia is very important in that it allows us to discuss all aspects of the relationship. The summit is an important opportunity for the EU to interact with Russia at the highest level. The meeting is expected to focus on EU-Russia relations, the financial crisis, and international relations. On EU-Russia relations, the two sides will assess developments on the four "common spaces", namely, economic freedom; security and justice; external security; and research and education. They will review progress on negotiations on the new EU-Russia agreement and will underline the need to work together on a co-ordinated response to the current world economic crisis. The need to pursue a peaceful resolution of a number of protracted conflicts in the common neighbourhood will also be discussed. There are many so-called frozen conflicts in the space between the European Union and Russia and it is in everybody's interest that they be thawed out and resolved. Having a more normalised relationship between Russia and the European Union is a priority.

Over lunch, other international issues of concern will be raised. There may also be some discussion of Russian proposals for a new European security treaty.

As members of the committee will be aware, the May Council traditionally includes a joint session with Ministers for defence, to review significant developments in respect of certain aspects of the EU's European Security and Defence Policy, ESDP, operations. At this joint session, Ministers will consider the future of Operation EUFOR ALTHEA within the evolving political context in Bosnia and Herzegovina. It is generally acknowledged that EUFOR has substantially accomplished its mandate, in particular the completion of the military and stabilisation tasks provided for by the Dayton-Paris Agreement. Six months ago, at the November 2008 Council, it was agreed that the transition of the existing ALTHEA mission to a support and training operation should be explored in greater detail. Next week the Council may approve this concept and ongoing planning for the possible evolution of Operation ALTHEA into such a mission. This is very welcome in that it recognises there has been normalisation of issues in that part of the world. However, the transformation of Operation ALTHEA can occur only within a broader context of stability, in particular the stability which would be achieved by a transition from the Office of High Representative to an enhanced EU Special Representative presence. If this transition is decided upon at the June meeting of the Peace Implementation Council, the drawdown of ALTHEA could occur within the following six months. Ireland fully supports the view that the transition to a support and training operation is the most appropriate EU position once a decision has been taken on the transition from the Office of High Representative to that of an EU Special Representative.

We will also consider the situation in Somalia, specifically the progress being made by the EU naval operation, Atalanta, which was launched last December to counter the increasing threat of piracy. Although Ministers are expected to commend the mission's achievements to date in protecting World Food Programme deliveries of aid and other vulnerable vessels in the Gulf of Aden and off the Somali coast, they are also likely to express concern at the surge in piracy acts occurring at distances increasingly remote from the coastlines of east Africa. Ironically, this geographical shift in the focus of the piracy threat is being read, at least in part, as evidence of the success of the EU naval force, EUNAVOR.

In its conclusions, the Council is expected to reiterate the importance of co-ordinated action by the international community in tackling the threat of piracy, including co-operation between Operation Atalanta and other naval forces active in the region. With regard to Somalia, Ministers are also expected to agree Council conclusions welcoming the new Somali President's commitment to dialogue with political and military groups currently outside his Government. Ministers will also reiterate the EU's support for security sector reform as a key element in the long-term reconstruction of Somalia. After these joint sessions, Ministers for defence will then consider the EU's co-operation with partners such as the United Nations, NATO and the African Union.

Meanwhile, Ministers for foreign affairs may be asked to discuss Moldova, which is currently listed as a possible agenda point. Any discussion is likely to focus on the relationship between Romania and Moldova in the aftermath of the 7 April post-election demonstrations and, specifically, the introduction by the Moldovan Government of visa requirements for Romanian nationals. No conclusions have been drafted.

Ireland fully supports all efforts to ensure political stability in Moldova. We remain concerned by reports of possible human rights abuses that occurred during the post-election demonstrations. We commend the work of the Council of Europe Commissioner for Human Rights, Mr. Thomas Hammarberg, on this issue. We support an independent inquiry into the events surrounding the protests which should reflect the recommendations of Commissioner Hammarberg, once issued. We also support efforts to persuade the Moldovan Government to reverse its recent decision to impose visa restrictions on Romanian nationals.

Over lunch, GAERC Ministers will discuss relations with Iran.   No conclusions are anticipated because the Council adopted conclusions on Iran last month. The April conclusions reaffirmed support for the twin-track approach of incentives and sanctions, which the EU has been pursuing for some time in respect of Iran's nuclear programme, and once again called on Iran to comply with the relevant UN Security Council resolutions and cease uranium enrichment.

Iran is currently in the midst of preparations and planning for the presidential elections scheduled for 12 June. In these circumstances, it is unlikely that there will be any response on the part of the Iranian Government to the overtures for greater engagement and a more constructive relationship which President Obama recently outlined in his Iranian new year address to the people and Government of Iran. All the indications are that the Iranian authorities are still contemplating how best to respond to the US President's overtures and are unlikely to be rushed into any premature response in this regard.

The efforts to promote a diplomatic resolution to the major international concerns regarding Iran's nuclear programme continue to be led by the EU 3, that is, France, the UK and Germany, working alongside the United States of America, Russia and China. The USA has now stated that it will be prepared to sit down directly as part of this group to discuss the nuclear issue with Iran. There has been no formal response on Iran's part as yet to this invitation, although this is not unexpected in view of the elections which I mentioned previously.

At this very sensitive juncture, it is obviously of great importance that the European Union and the United States of America continue to co-ordinate and work closely together on and with Iran. President Obama has extended an olive branch to Tehran and we must hope and continue to encourage the Iranian Government to respond positively. The European Union can perhaps best serve and complement this approach by making clear that it would be prepared to impose sanctions, including economic sanctions, if Iran does not respond to the very deep concerns, not least within the Middle East, which now exist about its nuclear ambitions.

Discussion of Iran at the Council is also likely to cover the continuing very serious human rights situation in Iran, which has witnessed the recent appalling execution of a young woman for offences committed as a minor. The EU has made known to the Iranian authorities its strong condemnation of such actions in addition to its concerns over other current human rights cases, including the journalist, Roxanna Saberi, who was released yesterday, which I welcome. Ireland and our EU partners will continue to speak frankly with the Iranian authorities on these and related issues, including the Iranian President's unacceptable comments regarding Israel at the Durban II conference last month which prompted those EU delegations present, including the Irish delegation, to leave for the duration of his address.

There will be a discussion on Georgia which would be a follow-up to the extraordinary European Council on Georgia held on 1 September last, in the aftermath of the fighting between Georgia and Russia. The extraordinary Council made a commitment to build relations with Georgia and to contribute to its reconstruction. It decided to step up relations with Georgia, including through visa facilitation measures and the possible establishment of a full and comprehensive free trade area agreement. Since the Council on Georgia on 1 September, the EU has significantly increased its role in the country, sending a monitoring mission, to which Ireland has contributed four personnel to monitor the ceasefire, organising a donor conference and convening,with the United Nations and the OSCE, peace talks in Geneva, the next session of which will be held on 18 May and 19 May.

Progress has continued on implementing the EU-Georgia European neighbourhood policy which is intended to support the reform process in the country. Georgia is now a participant in the European neighbourhood policy partnership, which was launched at a summit in Prague on 7 May, attended by the Taoiseach. Progress on a free trade agreement and on visa facilitation have, however, been slow. On Monday at a meeting in Madrid I met the Georgian delegation and I spoke to it, especially on issues in respect of Ireland and Georgia and developments to which we can look forward in that regard. Ireland fully supports the EU's actions in Georgia, which have sought to help the country following the August crisis and further develop its links with the European Union.

That concludes my observations on external relations issues. The last part of my presentation today will deal with development issues. Ireland will be represented by the Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs, Deputy Peter Power, at Monday's meeting. Inevitably, the central issue for discussion will be the effect of the global financial and economic crisis on the developing world and the response of the EU. Developing countries are being severely hit by the global economic crisis, a crisis which is not of their making. It is a crisis which originated in the financial markets of the developed world, among some of which there has been scandalous behaviour. There is a strong recognition across the European Union that we have an obligation to ensure that the poorest people in the world do not become the chief victims of misbehaviour in the developed world. The reality is that economic growth and social progress achieved in many developing countries in recent decades is, in many cases, now being reversed. Progress on the UN millennium development goals is endangered and millions of people face poverty and hunger. It is clear, as confirmed by the G20 summit in London in April, that the developed world and the developing world must work together to deal with these developments. The global crisis requires a global solution and response. The EU is the world's largest provider of official development aid and it is the number one trading partner for developing countries. We need to act in partnership with the developing world, in our common interest.

At the Council on Monday, Ministers will discuss the actions and instruments we can use in response to the crisis. Ireland has strongly supported the view that these measures must have a quick impact and that their benefits must be felt in the short term. In line with the central priorities of our aid programme, we will emphasise that measures taken should protect the lives and livelihood's of the poorest and most vulnerable. We will wish to ensure that the focus of the response is on sustaining poverty reduction and maintaining the provision of basic services for the poor. In this context, we cannot avoid the reality that with national income falling across the developed world aid budgets everywhere are now under pressure.

In Ireland, we have had to adjust our overseas development aid budget for 2009 as part of the Government's determined effort to restore the public finances. We have made a firm commitment to resume expansion of the aid programme as soon as the conditions for sustainable economic growth have been restored. In the meantime, it is important to recognise that with a budget of €696 million this year and with a firm focus on global poverty and hunger, Ireland is again expected to be the sixth most generous donor in the world in per capita terms and the fifth most generous in the European Union.

It is expected the Council will reaffirm the European Union's collective commitments to support developing countries in meeting the millennium development goals and to achieve collectively the target of 0.7% of GNP on overseas aid by 2015. We are continuing to work towards meeting the target in 2012 and Ireland remains ahead of most of the member states, including all the large member states, in our progress towards fulfilling EU commitments.

However, the discussion at the Council will rightly cover more than the volumes of ODA. Development aid, while crucial, will not be enough to help developing countries overcome the crisis. The EU must use all the sources and instruments available to leverage assistance aimed at stimulating growth, investment, trade and job creation.

The global response should support and facilitate the development and implementation of developing countries' own strategies for dealing with the crisis. In addition, it is important that support should have a direct counter-cyclical impact. We consider that measures are needed at the EU level to adapt priorities, to disperse aid more quickly and where necessary and feasible, to front-load assistance. Action on the economic front should be to sustain productive activity and to maintain productive capacity.

An important aspect of the EU's support will be to revitalise agriculture. While the food price crisis has abated somewhat in recent months, Ireland has been to the fore internationally in highlighting the growing impact of the global hunger crisis. There remains a serious lack of infrastructure and investment. In line with the priorities outlined in the Government's hunger task force, we will advocate particular attention for food security, focusing on small-scale farming and the crucial role of women in agriculture, in particular in Africa.

The Council will also discuss what measures can be taken to increase the effectiveness of aid, with a stronger focus on measurable and clear development results. This is an area in which the OECD development assistance committee last week singled out Ireland's aid programme as the world leader. The EU's code of conduct on the division of labour in aid represents a significant contribution to improving aid effectiveness. In current circumstances, the implementation of that code of conduct needs to be strengthened.

On Tuesday morning, Ministers will take stock of progress in the negotiation of the EU's economic partnership agreements with the ACP countries. They will hear a report from the trade Commissioner, Catherine Ashton, and the issues involved are very complex. However, Ireland has consistently argued that the EU must ensure the agreements are focused on supporting the development needs and plans of the partner countries. In particular, we have highlighted the concerns of some developing countries that the agreements could undermine progress towards regional integration. Together with several other member states, we have advocated the full use of the flexibility, which is allowed under current WTO law, to take full account of the different development levels and needs of the ACP countries and regions. That concludes my presentation.

I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Roche. We have several other speakers, including Deputies Joe Costello, Billy Timmins and Senator Feargal Quinn, and we will take more.

I am delighted to see the Minister of State, Deputy Roche and his staff. I compliment him for giving us a report on the previous GAERC meeting. It is very valuable to have a report. We should establish this on a regular basis, so not only do we see the Minister before the meeting starts, but also when it finishes. He can report back, particularly on the area of Croatian accession, although it is not on the agenda today, on future meetings and summits which have taken place.

As the Minister of State said in his opening remarks, the key issue is likely to be the legal guarantees for Ireland regarding the Lisbon treaty. That may well be the key issue, but I am none the wiser as to what will happen at the meeting. Perhaps the Minister of State could outline to us in some greater detail how those key issues will be addressed. What agenda has he outlined? Does he have a formal agenda? If it is the key issue, surely there is some breakdown in the manner in which he will address it.

Does he have a draft document on the legal text and guarantees? Does he have any information on the socio-ethical issues, workers' rights or defence? The Government is divided over what to do with the European Defence Agency. We would all like to hear in advance how the Minister of State proposes to agree to deal with those issues with the 27 member states.

Those of us on this side of the House would like to have some consultation before everything is tied up. It is not good enough for the Minister of State to say in his remarks:

It is only when we are fully satisfied with the form and content of these guarantees that we can proceed to consult the Irish people on a Lisbon Treaty package that will be adjusted in Ireland's case on foot of these guarantees.

We had no input, good, bad or indifferent, into the text, formula, timing or methodology of dealing with the legal guarantees from the Government to date. More than four months have elapsed since the broad scope of the legal guarantees were agreed by the 27 member states.

The Minister of State said he will consult us some time in the future. This is only a month away. The Minister of State must realise time is passing. Four months have gone by and one is left, when he intends to fully tie up the matter. There is not much room for consultation unless he begins the process soon. I would like him to outline today when he will begin the consultation process with Opposition parties. He stated he wanted to see everybody rowing in strongly behind the campaign for the ratification of the Lisbon treaty.

The Minister of State is not exactly preparing the way to ensure there will be maximum support for his efforts by keeping us all in the dark. We do not know what we vote on at this point regarding the legal guarantees. We do not know how he proposes to tie up the legal guarantees. Will we have a protocol? What is the format and content? What are the proposals? What is on the table? There are methods of letting us know about this, but so far nothing has happened. The Minister of State's contribution indicated this will be the most important issue on the table, but he has not given us the slightest indication as to what exactly the agenda will be and how it will be addressed.

Regarding the other part of the jumbo meeting taking place, that is, the development and European defence issues, will the Minister of State present our position on the European Defence Agency to the defence Ministers? Will the Minister for Defence, Deputy Willie O'Dea, or the Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs, Deputy Peter Power, and the Minister of State, Deputy Roche, be there? If there is disagreement between the Government partners, whereby the Green Party says it does not want the European Defence Agency and Fianna Fáil says it does, could we have a preview of what will be put to the meeting? Will the Minister of State operate by the seat of his pants at the meeting? What does the Minister for Defence, Deputy O'Dea, have to say about these matters?

On the other issues, we in the committee are particularly concerned about the Middle East process. We raised it again and again and there has been quite a good response from the Minister for Foreign Affairs, Deputy Micheál Martin, to the crisis that occurred over the Christmas period and the invasion of the Gaza Strip.

The committee, and the Minister, have called for an international inquiry and investigation into the breaches of human rights. Nobody has taken up that call or instituted an international inquiry. The United Nations, the European Union or another third party has not done it. There have been hollow hand-wringing expressions of concern about the massive number of fatalities and injuries that took place. We began that process in this committee to examine the state of play in the Euromed trading agreement between Ireland and Israel and our preferential treatment of Israel, to see whether the link between human rights violations and the trading agreement had been broken. We are disappointed that we have not received much response from the European Union to our invitation. Will the Minister of State raise that issue to see whether the European Union will co-operate, and ask the Commissioner to come here to give the Union's version of what transpired on that occasion? We also want the United Nations representative from the Palestinian Territories to come here and we await a response to that invitation. We are waiting for a positive response from the Commissioner. The Minister of State might help us so that we are not forever using rhetoric around these tables but examining the issues and deciding whether we are satisfied that breaches and violations of human rights have taken place.

I would have thought that piracy in Somalia was an issue for the United Nations and the African Union. The European Union needs to concern itself too. If we are in a position to send a peacekeeping mission to lands where there is conflict surely it should be possible to send a mission to help international shipping on the high seas. The principle should extend there and we should deal with this problem. It is almost laughable that there seems not to be a co-ordinated attempt to deal with piracy off the Somalian coast.

Sri Lanka and Pakistan are the areas where there has been the greatest escalation of violence which could spill over. I imagine that the Pakistan-Afghanistan conflict is even more dangerous than the Iranian one which is taking up so much of the Minister of State's time because Iran has nuclear weapons. Pakistan has nuclear weapons and there is a direct threat to the future of Pakistan from the Taliban which is on its borders and moving closer. The conflict in Sri Lanka should also be addressed.

We have always prided ourselves on being a country that would uphold its level of overseas development aid and the work of the NGOs in the Third World and developing countries. The last budget was disappointing because there was a greater drop proportionately in development aid than there should have been. The Minister of State's remarks today suggest that he has resigned himself to not meeting the target of 0.7% of GNP set for 2012 and the best he can hope for is the EU target for 2015.

With the recession biting throughout the European Union are we in grave danger of dumping agricultural and other products?  The Minister of State talks about revitalising agriculture but agricultural products are available from the developing world. If the European Union implements a protectionist policy will the developing world be negatively affected?

Deputy Costello covered many issues. I thank the Minister of State for his comprehensive report on the April meeting. Feedback is welcome. A group from Fine Gael went on a trip to Israel and Gaza a few weeks ago. Our policy on a solution to the problem, like that of the Government and the European Union, is comprehensive, inclusive and fair, and can be achieved. I regret, however, that we have done nothing to move it forward to make it achievable. More than terrorists or Hamas, the infrastructure in Gaza was clearly targeted, for example, the American international school. It was unoccupied save for the caretaker who was killed in the attack. We met his father. The school served the future brains of the Palestinian people and the only reason one would bomb it would be to try to suppress people. It was not a defensive action, or a protective action but was clearly designed to cut off the educational future of the Palestinian people. It was a reprehensible act.

I visited Jerusalem in the mid-1980s and the mid-1990s when many Palestinians and Arabs walked casually on the streets of the new Jerusalem. The population was 50:50 Arab and Israeli. I was struck on this visit by how few Palestinians were walking about in the new city. A process of resettlement is taking place there which one cannot stand over. Europe and the international community must act on it.

While the security forces maybe had reason to construct certain barricades to cut down the access for suicide bombers the United Nations presented statistics on the mechanism by which the wall has been built and the barriers put in place which showed this was not only a security measure. There is a time when there is very little relationship between the security measures being put in place and the reduction in attacks and atrocities. There is a strong correlation between the effort to suppress the people and cut off their economic lifeline when one sees the line of the wall. The West Bank has become an open prison. That is totally unacceptable. While the Hamas rocket attacks must also be condemned, when one sees the wall one can see that there is an orchestrated campaign to suppress a people. It is important that we say this is unacceptable.

The Israelis have little regard for European political or public opinion. That is understandable because Europeans not only stood idly by but in some cases assisted in and contributed to the Holocaust. That is a separate issue and there is no correlation between what happened then and what is happening to the Palestinians now. We should not be afraid to say that and irrespective of whatever hammering we get through e-mails or diplomatic pressure we must keep pushing that point. Sweden is doing it and Ireland should be to the forefront in pushing that policy. Our policy is sound but the actions taken to implement it need to be thought out.

It is quite clear that this Government has decided to inflict a disproportionate burden on the world's poorest people through its aid cuts. We can dress it up however we like but a political decision was made to cut the aid by a greater proportion than should have been done. It was probably done because it reflected Irish public opinion. The time has come for us to have a debate on whether we are going to let the poorest people in the world suffer in order to help ourselves or to take more pain to ensure that those who are more vulnerable receive assistance. We must strive to hit the target. The Minister of State mentioned that the EU is the world's largest provider of overseas development aid. That is welcome but we must remember that the countries that make up the EU are the very countries that, for centuries, plundered what is now the developing world. Some small payback is all we are giving.

A clear decision has been made by the Government with respect to the actual trading partnerships. There is concern that Europe is seeking a greater return on trade agreements than is equitable, specifically in regard to the Caribbean, African and Pacific agreements. In his contribution the Minister of State mentioned that Ireland is taking a certain position on that and I hope we continue to advocate it and not seek to give with one hand and take with the other.

With respect to the Lisbon treaty I welcome the Minister of State's newly aligned staff. I note he has nine staff. The Government gave a commitment to keep in contact with the Opposition parties in respect of the guarantees. No matter what way it is dressed up again, responsibility lies with the Minister for Foreign Affairs and the Taoiseach in this regard. Opposition parties have not been consulted and we have not been kept posted. Five and a half months have passed since the leader of Fine Gael, Deputy Kenny, was consulted on the legal guarantees but we know nothing about them. At the eleventh hour we will be hit again with comments such as "Here is what we have done, this is the policy, let us buy into it." It is difficult for us to buy in, notwithstanding the fact that we believe the Lisbon treaty is good for Ireland, is good for Europe and is the only game in town. However, the approach of Government to take the Opposition for granted, and not have the common courtesy to consult it for ten or 15 minutes and brief it on the position, is unacceptable.

The Irish Forum for Peace in Sri Lanka appeared before the Joint Committee on Foreign Affairs last week. The actions of the Government in Sri Lanka are reprehensible but by the same token, if memory serves me correctly, at that meeting the impression was given that the general public was fleeing in front of the government forces, which may be true to a degree, but what was lacking on the day was the failure to point out that people trying to get out from the enclosed area are being murdered by the Tamil Tigers. It is not just one group that is involved; there are two groups involved. It is important to acknowledge that the people who are trying to get out of the enclave are actually being murdered by Tamil Tigers who are trying to keep them in as a human shield protection. I do not know what our Government can do from this remove. Neither do I know what Europe can do from this remove other than to issue statements on the situation. I do not know if there is any tangible action that can be taken to solve the problem.

The Minister of State mentioned the southern corridor summit and the agreement whereby gas can come through Turkey into the EU. Does the Minister of State have a view on Turkey's application for membership of the EU? What is the Irish approach?

I received a circular recently, as I am sure other members did, from the Armenian group seeking our view on its joining the EU. Do we have an official position?

I commend the action of Ambassador Daithí Ó Ceallaigh in leaving the Durban II conference. The utterances and policy as enunciated by Iran, with respect to Israel, are reprehensive and unhelpful. I commend him on the action he took. On the other hand, as the sane fiddler on the roof, the over-emphasis on trying to demonise, notwithstanding that it is probably deserved in some respects, Iran and portray it as a big bad superpower is incorrect. Iran does not have the capability to withstand attack from some of the western countries. The idea of portraying it as being all powerful — I hope I am correct — is incorrect. I accept Iran uses certain leverages with al-Qaeda, Hizbollah and Hamas to try to seek power in the area. It is vitally important that President Obama and the Iranians speak. The Iranians are central to solving the problem in the Middle East as are the Syrians and we have to engage with these people and look through their eyes. We cannot cut off ties. We cannot continue to demonise them because they are all part of finding a solution to the conflict which centres on the Palestinian question.

I welcome the Minister of State and his team. I join the others in welcoming the fact that he has given the committee such a comprehensive report of the last meeting. It is something I look forward to in future.

I will turn to the issue of development aid. While the Minister of State, Deputy Roche, is very welcome I am disappointed the Minister of State, Deputy Peter Power, is not present also because it appears we have some very definite questions to put to him in respect of overseas development aid. When we cut our ODA by €100 million in April and by €95 million in February, following cuts in July and October 2008, I had not realised our percentage had dropped to such an extent. Was that intentional? Having set a target of 0.7% by 2012, and a target of 0.6% by 2010, it is clear they will not be reached. I could understand taking a cut in money but I did not realise we were taking a cut in percentage in our objectives of helping the poorest people in the world. More than 1 billion people out of the 6 billion in the world go to bed hungry each night. Ireland had set a standard but is now losing its ability to influence the rest of Europe if it does not maintain the percentage level. I urge the Minister of State to do what he can to ensure we have the moral authority of the past in regard to the poorest.

I wish to raise two other points. In regard to the June EU meeting, in respect of our guarantees for the Lisbon treaty, with whom do we negotiate? I was stunned to discover the name Václav Klaus in connection with the Russian meeting. He is the non-executive President of the Czech Republic and suddenly he is in an executive role. Will the Minister of State explain? I realise there has been an upset in the Czech Government but I do not understand how a non-executive president, who clearly has very strong views and is a close associate of Mr. Declan Ganley and Libertas had a connection with the Russian meeting. I hope he has no say and no involvement in the negotiation of our guarantees in respect of the Lisbon treaty. His name was mentioned in connection with Russia.

We in Europe have adopted an anti-Russian attitude in many areas in the past, even during the Georgia-Russian conflict last year we automatically stepped in on the side of Georgia. Russia and Europe have a huge future in trading together and Russia is very important to us. We in Europe, not necessarily Ireland, have not recognised the relationships we need with Russia. That is something we have to work much harder on rather than automatically assume that Russia is the big bad wolf.

The other issue is in regard to Iran. Our delegation was correct to leave the conference when the Iranian President talked about the existence of Israel and refused to recognise the right of Israel to exist. We have to take a strong hand. Perhaps the Minister of State will give us some idea of how he sees the overture from President Obama to Iran in regard to the nuclear question being responded to and if we can help in any way.

My final question seeks explanation. The Minister of State referred to ALTHEA and moving from a High Representative to an EU Special Representative. Will he please explain what that means because in the whole area of ALTHEA we want to ensure we do not find that another war sparks off in eastern Europe?

I warmly welcome the Minister of State and his excellent team and thank them for attending. I thank the Minister of State for the detailed address he gave and wish him and his colleagues well in the meetings on Monday and Tuesday next week.

I note that the Croatian accession process is moving at a very slow pace. I hope the work by Commissioner Olli Rehn can expedite that and ensure Croatia becomes a full member as quickly as possible. The Minister of State might tell us if he has information on the Icelandic application. Has any official documentation been lodged and will it receive consideration? He might also indicate if any tangible progress was made at the employment summit on 7 May and if there is some stimulus for the Lisbon Agenda to assist the creation and sustainability of jobs throughout the Union.

I note that at the last GAERC meeting Malta raised the issue of illegal immigration. That is a very serious issue for the Union. I recall at Easter 1990 an emergency meeting of all justice Ministers was held pertaining to that issue, and I am not sure much progress has been made in the intervening years. The effort to address that problem is moving at a very slow pace. It is important the Union is clear on its borders and its rules for entry, protection is provided for the Union and its citizens and nobody risks their lives to gain illegal entry into the Union. If we do not clarify the position in a de facto legal way, that will continue to be the position.

That brings me to the issue of the EU naval operation against piracy along the Somali coast, a problem that has bedevilled the Union for a long time. That is serious for global trade.

On the position pertaining to the EUFOR Operation ALTHEA in Bosnia-Herzegovina, our military people have done excellent work. The Irish Defence Forces have played a major role in various missions and I hope we will be able to continue to do that.

That brings me to the current restrictions on the European Defence Agency. It is important that Ireland, as a nation and as a political entity, is able to speak with one voice on the importance of the European Defence Agency and a global counterbalance within the European Union to the conflicts that have bedevilled mankind throughout the centuries. I hope common sense prevails and that we can give sustainability to whatever Government representatives represent Ireland in the negotiations because in any of these situations it is important to ensure that counterbalance in global affairs be sustained through the European Union which, as far as I am concerned, is the one positive unified force for peace and sustainability for the world. It does not have any hidden agendas that are obvious in other areas throughout the world. I hope we can support it.

The Aung San Suu Kyi case continues to occupy the discussions. The lack of progress on that issue is very disappointing.

I wish the Minister of State well with the discussions on the Lisbon treaty. The Chairman and colleagues here can tell the Minister of State that we are under constant pressure from other member states in the Union that interact with this committee about this issue. No later than yesterday a delegation from Greece was before the committee and at the top of the agenda was how we could reach agreement on ensuring the Lisbon treaty is ratified as quickly as possible in the interests of the European Union. That is critical for the Union and for Ireland.

I am aware the Minister of State, his colleagues, our outstanding team at COREPER and our outstanding diplomats in the capital cities throughout Europe are playing a major role in these negotiations. They are difficult, sensitive, complex and very important, not just for the future of Ireland but for that of the Union. We wish the entire Irish team well in the negotiations. I hope there can be interaction and discussion with our colleagues in the Opposition parties to ensure that when there is an opportunity for the Irish people to validate this treaty, we will give a consolidation, as we did in 1972, not just to Ireland's position at the heart of Europe but also to Europe's position as a united, unified force in a political effort to ensure that we have a Union that is solid, sustained and legally based. In that way we can respond and react to the different demands that will be placed on the Union, be they financial, militarily or from a humanitarian point of view. That is very important as we go forward together.

Members deeply appreciate all the points the Minister of State made and we wish him well with the negotiations. I hope we can go forward knowing that the Government and the team representing us, permanently and politically, has the full support of this committee and this Parliament in the best interests of our country and the Union.

I ask the Minister of State to bring to the meeting the urgency regarding the need on the part of most right-thinking people to get the guarantees in place as quickly as possible, preferably under a full protocol arrangement. I am not concerned about those people who under no circumstances will accept reason, but for the majority of people these guarantees underpin the reasons Lisbon II should be voted upon and accepted. The need to get that done quickly and with accord from our European partners is vital.

I refer to what was spoken about previously, namely, our representative at the Durban review conference. It is ironic that, while the conference dealt with racism, racial discrimination, xenophobia and related intolerance, our representative had to walk out because a Holocaust denier effectively undermined the work of the conference. That is very serious and it must be dealt with on the international stage. A firm line must be held to ensure that is not tolerated at any international conference in the future.

I agree with my colleague, Senator Quinn, regarding the EU-Russian summit. As the Union's nearest and by far biggest neighbour, relations with Russia in the future are essential. I refer to the article by the Prime Minister of Ukraine, Yulia Tymoshenko, who suggested in The Economist 2009 annual review a Rome treaty type arrangement with Russia looking at free trade and related matters to ensure we go forward together and progress. I suggest that part of that progress would be acceptance of the new European security treaty.

In the past Tzar Alexander went as far as Paris, and Stalin got as far as Berlin. Unfortunately, the Soviet Union gave Russia a dreadful reputation, one that it is attempting to shake off. It is worth remembering that it was in response to Napoleon invading Russia and, unfortunately, the Nazis invading Russia, that these terrible events took place. In light of the history of Europe, it is essential that we move forward positively and strongly and give the security guarantees the Russians seek.

Members have raised many of the issues that have engaged the committee in recent weeks. The COSAC meeting took place in Prague over the weekend at which many of the issues were aired, including the Croatian accession that was mentioned earlier and the dispute between Croatia and Slovenia. The eastern partnership was mentioned also and the southern corridor summit was reported upon.

On the Middle East peace process, Commissioner Ferrero-Waldner has agreed to meet representatives of the committee. The committee sought a meeting to discuss the position in Gaza. She was unable to attend here but we hope to be in a position shortly to appoint a group to meet her.

Reference was made to the Burma position. The committee met representatives of the peace people in Sri Lanka where a full report was given and certain recommendations were made, to which we will refer later.

We also had a discussion on the position in Moldova. References were made also to the Durban review conference. As other speakers have said, emotive language leading to and likely to generate racism should be abhorred, particularly at this time.

Members have referred to the need to develop better relations with Russia. This was also discussed at the COSAC meeting and there is general agreement on that. It was also mentioned that developing good working relations with Russia and Ukraine is not incompatible. They could both be developed. There is a need for the European Union, as a body, to become much more deeply engaged in promoting trade and good relations with Russia and at the same time with Ukraine.

On the points raised about the forthcoming referendum and the legal agreements to be entered into between the European Union and the other member states, other member states are inquiring as to the precise nature of the arrangements to be made with this country as a result of the defeat in referendum on the Lisbon treaty last year. As the Minister of State will know better than anybody else, that can have implications of a positive and negative nature. Most other countries have expressed their solidarity, but there is a tendency for concern as to whether there might be conflict with some of the interests of the other countries. It is a matter with which we have to engage as a matter of urgency.

Regarding EUFOR and ALTHEA forces, members of the committee visited the region they are based in during the past few months. Senator Quinn and Deputy Treacy made the point that the current operation there has been successful in keeping the peace and in identifying issues that might arise to aggravate — for want of a better description — the situation. The general impression was given that any diminution in that activity could perhaps lead to a weakness in the peaceful influences that EUFOR and ALTHEA have been instrumental in bringing to the area. We were impressed with the knowledge and the operation of the LOT houses in particular, which have proven very effective. Particular emphasis was placed on the structure of the LOT houses, whereby information was readily available to the peacekeepers and peace enforcers well in advance of where a difficult situation might arise. We were asked to bring that to the attention of members.

Another point concerned development aid. From time to time I and other Members table questions on the full extent of the debt write-off that was entered into a few years ago in respect of which a major announcement was made at a famous golf course in a certain elevated region. While the Minister of State, Deputy Roche, and the Minister of State, Deputy Peter Power, have done this in the past, it would be helpful for the work of the committee and for the Minister if we were to review occasionally the extent to which commitments entered have been fully delivered on during the past three or four years.

I thank the Minister of State for the comprehensive nature of his report on the previous meeting. It is a worthwhile exercise and we look forward to the next one.

I want to deal with the Chairman's last point on debt relief which ties in with a number of questions raised by Senators Quinn and Hanafin and others. Good progress has been made, particularly by Ireland, on debt relief. I will convey to the Minister of State, Deputy Peter Power, that the committee would welcome a note on that.  It would be useful if we did that. There is a degree of misunderstanding about Ireland's position on ODA. I will refer briefly to what the OECD stated last week. It described Ireland's aid programme as "cutting edge". It said that "Ireland is a champion at making aid more effective". It called on us, as have members of the committee, to adhere to the targets. The targets were mentioned by Senators Quinn and Hanafin, Deputy Timmins and the Chairman. We all know the EU ODA target is 0.7% of GNP by 2015 and Ireland's is 0.7% by 2012. Members of the committee will welcome the fact we will continue to work towards achieving the 0.7% target; we are not moving back from that. We all recognise the budgetary situation, but we will continue to work towards achieving that target.

In spite of the recent supplementary budget, Ireland is ahead of all but four EU member states — Sweden, Luxembourg, Denmark and the Netherlands — in regard to that target. Given the current situation, that is fairly commendable by an objective standard and position, and that is as it should be. We should work to achieve that target. I agree with the comments made by members. In terms of this target, we are ahead of all the bigger member states, which reflects well on the Irish people. This is in terms of official aid. The Irish people are extraordinarily generous in terms of their personal capacity for donations. On the matter of the proportion of our national income we devote to aid, we are ahead of every one of the bigger countries in Europe, all the very large countries and international players. We expect to reach the level of almost 0.5% this year. It is disappointing it will be below the 0.58% target we were working towards.

I will cite some figures to contrast our contribution with that of other countries. The United Kingdom's contribution is 0.43%. I want to take up a valid point made by Senator Hanafin, which was also referred to by Senator Quinn, namely, that large countries in Europe caused many of the difficulties in Africa and in other parts of the world. These are the countries that built their great empires, great resources and individual and familial wealth on the backs of the colonies. We were never a colonial power, we were in fact a colony. In contrast to our contribution, the contribution of the UK is 0.43% of GNP, that of Spain is also 0.43%, that of France is 0.39%, that of Germany is 0.38% and that of Italy is 0.2%. I am not saying we should aspire to work towards the bottom, but we should stop flagellating ourselves because we are still an exemplar in this respect. It would be marvellous if we could reach the target ahead of the timeline set, but given all the other situations, our contribution level is good.

I expect that the General Affairs and External Relations Council members will strongly re-affirm the commitment to achieve collective ODA targets of 0.5% of GNP in 2010 and 0.7% in 2015. I put those points on the record because although there is always room for perfection, we are certainly not at the bottom of the barrel in this context.

All the speakers mentioned the Lisbon treaty and the current position. Senator Quinn presented me with a great point on which I will commence my reply. If there was anything that illustrated the need for the modest changes in the Lisbon treaty, particularly in terms of internal institutional changes in Europe, it is the reality that there has been a change of government and a difficulty in the Czech Republic. I have said that I had full and tremendous admiration for Karel Schwarzenberg and Sasha Vondra, the Minister for Foreign Affairs and the Minister for European Affairs, respectively, who tried to drive a very ambitious Presidency programme. I happened to be in the Czech Republic on the day in question. Through no fault of theirs a motion made validly by the Opposition, but supported surprisingly by some members within the ODA, brought the Topolanek Government to its knees. That illustrates the necessity of institutional continuity, particularly at European Council level, which is included in the Lisbon treaty. If we needed from any person in Europe an example of why we need continuity and certainty, it was what happened on this occasion. This was not the first time this happened. Negative comments have been made about the Czech Republic. It has happened on several occasions that during the course of a Presidency a government has collapsed. When that happens it is bad and disruptive but when it happens in the teeth of a roaring gale, when we have the perfect storm in economic terms, it illustrates more than anything else could and certainly more eloquently than I could do so, the necessity for the Lisbon treaty change. The change is that we will have a Presidency for two and a half years, elected by the European Council. Far from being despotic, as some people on the extremes of euroscepticism in this country have tried to portray it, it conveys common sense. Senator Feargal Quinn ran a very significant business empire, if I may say so, but in his wildest dreams he would not have considered changing the board or the top man in that empire every six months. One would not run a chip shop the way Europe has been run. What has happened there illustrates the necessity for us to continue with the Lisbon process. Members will be relieved to hear that we will not be negotiating with President Klaus, we are actually negotiating with the other 26 member states. While the change in the Czech Republic has not been helpful, it would be wrong to say that the Czech Government has, in any way, done anything other than its utmost. It is a very good Presidency. I will be meeting with the Czech Minister this afternoon to discuss the issues that will arise in advance of 12 June.

Deputy Costello and others raised the issue of legal guarantees. As I have said privately to Deputies Costello and Timmins, as well as the Opposition party leaders, I can fully understand the frustration of being outside the negotiating process. This is particularly so as Deputies Costello, Timmins, Kenny and Gilmore are committed to the European project. As I have said privately, I am quite prepared to sit down with any Deputy and, to the extent that I possibly can, brief him or her on the issues. That goes for any Member of the House, whether for or against the Lisbon Treaty.

We are building on the conclusions of the December European Council, which made clear where we are going to go. The conclusions of the December Council are unusually specific. They are well drafted and give us negotiating space. Basically, they say that the Lisbon treaty has no effect on tax. That was a concern Irish people had, and particularly small and medium enterprises, so the guarantee will be there. Similarly, our neutrality and constitutional provisions on the right to life, education and the family are not affected by the attribution of a legal status to the EU Charter of Fundamental Rights. As I have said before on many occasions, I regard that charter, which was part of the negotiation package, as one of the most uplifting documents we have ever produced in Europe.

Some people say they cannot read such documents, but anybody can read the charter. When one reads it, one sees that far from being a threat it is a wonderful addition. I was listening to one of the leading trade unionists from Europe who described the arrival of the charter on the scene as something that trade unionists from all over the world, myself included, had striven for for 100 years.

Since the December Council we have been working to give shape to the legal guarantees. Part of this process is producing internal legal texts. We have to produce texts that we regard as appropriate. There have been detailed negotiations with the Council secretariat, its legal services and the Czech Presidency. The work is advanced and I am pleased with what has been achieved. Given all the other concerns the Czech Presidency had, good work has been done and we are still very much on track with the timeframe. The idea would be to reach agreement in June with a referendum before the end of the current Commission's term. I wanted to put that on the record because Deputy Costello raised the question on a number of occasions, both privately and in the House. That referendum would provide for the entry into force of the Lisbon treaty. It will also provide one of the great prizes for the Irish people who said they wanted a Commissioner per member state. It is not just the Irish people who will gain from that, but also those of the other 26 member states. We have already won due to the generosity and solidarity of our fellow member states. It must be remembered that there are coherent arguments against a large Commission, but those arguments have been put to one side. Provided the Lisbon treaty is ratified, we can use the treaty to trigger a Commissioner per member state. Last year, there were posters up all over the country — we still have not found out who paid for them — saying "Vote ‘No' to protect Ireland's Commissioner". The irony in the Irish debate last year was that the only way we can protect Ireland's Commissioner, since we ratified the Nice treaty, is to ratify the Lisbon treaty and use that mechanism, which Ireland was instrumental in drafting. By the way, it was not just the Irish Government that was instrumental in drafting that, but also the Irish team at the Convention on the Future of Europe who argued strongly for a more flexible arrangement. All parties in this House were involved, as were Proinsias De Rossa, MEP, and Mr. John Bruton, the EU ambassador to Washington. I am simply saying that we all worked towards that.

We have engaged, and will engage, in dialogue with this committee and with others. It is difficult because we are dealing with a dynamic situation that has still not been finalised. However, we will advance our work on the legal guarantees and we will be happy to discuss them with the Opposition. I recognise that some fundamental mistakes were made by us on the "Yes" side last year and I think we should not make those mistakes again this year. If there was ever a need for us to roll up our sleeves collectively and put partisan considerations to one side, it is on this issue. We should do that in a way that demonstrates to the Irish people that we have worked collectively to achieve what they want. They want to be at the heart of Europe in a way that does not threaten some fundamental issues of concern to them.

Last December, we secured firm commitments from our partners and are now working on those. Deputy Costello has made the point on a number of occasions that there are eurosceptics out there. I heard one eurosceptic candidate from the Dublin region recently proclaim that these guarantees are not worth the paper they are written on. I do not know what sort of prescience the lady in question has, but as a trained lawyer one would certainly have expected a more mature attitude towards international agreements that will be binding in their effect. If that trained lawyer, or the people who are spending hundreds of thousands of euro on posters in Dublin, care to try the truthfulness of the assertion, they will have an opportunity to do so because these guarantees will be legally robust and capable of withstanding any challenge in any court.

In his capacity as President of the European Council, President Sarkozy set out the position. He said that the legal guarantees will ultimately be enshrined in protocols attached to EU treaties at an early date. From the solidarity within the Union, we already have agreement on the scope of what we must achieve and we also have agreement on what will happen next. We must be aware, however, that the other 26 member states have an interest in this and that it is simply not an Irish preoccupation. Other countries have preoccupations too and we must be conscious of their concerns. As the Chairman said, I have recently been in Finland and the Czech Republic. I had bilateral meetings with eight or nine counterparts over the last ten days. We must do so to ensure that no only are we dealing with our concerns, but also that in making progress we are not in any way trespassing on any other member state. I will be delighted to talk with members at any stage on any issue.

Deputy Costello also raised the EDA issue. Ireland's position on the EDA is not on the defence Ministers' agenda. Discussions are continuing on the overall package at government level.

Questions were asked about the collapse of the Czech Government, but the Czech Presidency is continuing. I will be meeting the Czech Foreign Minister this afternoon, as will the Minister for Foreign Affairs, Deputy Martin. As it happens, I have a good relationship with my Czech counterpart, who worked actively during the Convention on the Future of Europe.

As regards the Middle East, the Chairman mentioned that Commissioner Ferrera-Waldner has been asked to co-operate with the committee, and I am pleased that she will do so. The reference to COSAC and also to this initiative illustrates yet again the significance and importance of what will happen in democratic terms when and if the Irish people vote "Yes" to the Lisbon treaty. We will have a network of national parliaments and the European Parliament operating in Europe. The day it is ratified Europe will be a much more democratic place than it is. As Pöttering, the President of the European Parliament stated in an address to Seanad Éireann, when he became a Member of the European Parliament in 1979 it had virtually no powers other than as a talking shop. Now it is a full democratic assembly with very real powers.

On the Middle East, it is a good idea that the Commission will meet the committee. Deputies Timmins and Costello made a number of specific comments. Europe is committed on the issue. Deputy Timmins stated that we should perhaps follow the Swedish lead. Ireland and Sweden are regarded as the two most advanced countries on this issue in Europe and they operate closely together on it. Deputies also made the point that to have peace in the Middle East, one does not want to create a situation where one excludes any party from it.

Deputy Costello raised the issue of Somalia. In the absence of an effective law, there are real law enforcement problems there. There is another real problem, that is, that the pirates are now operating further and further offshore and it disrupts the World Food Programme, for example. The issue, as the Deputy stated, illustrates that we need a better and more co-ordinated approach between the various agencies. The European Union is active there. There are other agencies that need to come together as well.

Deputies Timmins and Costello and Senator Quinn all mentioned that Ireland was correct to walk out of the conference when effectively a Holocaust denial was being made. I also agree with the difficult counterpoint made, that the demonisation or exclusion of Iran is not healthy and there must be dialogue. If we have learned anything on this island it is that we solve problems through dialogue. It is counterproductive to exclude a country such as Iran, which has its own proud history and has made a significant contribution to the development of civilisation.

Deputy Treacy asked what has happened with Iceland. Iceland has not applied yet but its government is in the process of forming. I had a bilateral conversation with the Icelandic representative at the Committee of Ministers of the Council of Europe on Monday last and progress is being made. It seems that Iceland will decide to apply for EU membership and as Deputy Treacy knows well, at that stage the Commission will make an assessment and a report will come back to the Council. What will happen eventually one does not know. There are concerns in Iceland and there are certain divisions within the political spectrum there.

On Bosnia, there was a high representative appointed in the mid-1990s to represent the broad international community. The EU Special Representative will be a specific European Community representative.

I agree with Deputy Treacy's comments on the European Defence Agency. People portray the European Union as somehow or other a militaristic adventure, which is nonsense, untrue and a disservice to intelligence. The European Union is a positive force for peace.

I agree with the comments on Russia. The European Union and Russia have a special relationship and we need a special relationship. If there are disputes involving Russia and other parties, we should not get involved in them. Russia, from the time of Peter the Great, has looked to the west. As was stated, there have been historical disruptions in that relationship, but it is in the mutual interest of all of the European Union's 27 member states and of Russia that we have a normal relationship, and I hope that will be developed. There will never be a time when we will all agree on everything, but if anything illustrated the need for a normal relationship, it was the breakdown in the energy issue where an argument between Ukraine and Russia had a dramatic effect, particularly on Bulgaria and Romania, and would have a knock-on effect on the rest of Europe. We need to sit down with Russia. The upcoming meeting could be a very interesting meeting although it is not quite as certain as I may have said that President Klaus will represent the European Union.

I forgot to mention earlier that at the COSAC meeting at the weekend ongoing discussions with Turkey were again positively mentioned.

I beg the Chairman's pardon. He asked that question on a number of occasions. On Turkey, Ireland has always adopted the position that any country can apply for membership of the European Union and the criteria which will establish whether a country becomes a member or goes into negotiations will be the Copenhagen criteria. That applies to several other countries also. There is no special consideration applying.

The committee yesterday met parliamentary representatives of Greece and Ireland's ratification of the Lisbon treaty and their concerns in that regard were discussed. We also met yesterday with the Serbian ambassador who made the case for membership of the European Union for the Balkan states in general, and particularly for his own state. That issue has arisen repeatedly. In that context, Turkey has been raised on more than one occasion as a positive influence in the western Balkans.

I stated earlier that the Irish Forum for Peace in Sri Lanka addressed our last meeting. The main message from the representatives was that they wanted our support and they asked us to raise the matter with the Minister of State. They require EU support for a halt to the Sri Lankan Government's military onslaught in Vanni, to allow immediate humanitarian aid about which there is a serious problem, to halt internment camps, forced evacuation of the people, ethnic cleansing, and so on, and for establishment of parity of esteem and promotion of a negotiated settlement. The joint committee agreed to follow up as appropriate, including raising the matter with the Minister of State today. We hope the Minister of State will continue with this matter at the European level.

I did not touch on that. The Government would agree with many of the points made by the forum, and expressed in the committee. The point was made that we are at a distance and there are many different prisms through which the story of Sri Lanka passed before we set eyes on it, and we need to be careful. It is clear there is a major humanitarian catastrophe in the area and it would be in everybody's interests at this stage, because there is only a small strip of territory involved, if both sides could now decide to cease hostilities, and particularly allow humanitarian relief.

The point was well made that there is evidence that some of those who want to flee the war zone are being prevented from doing so. If that is the case, and people are being used effectively as human shields, it is not acceptable no matter who is involved.

I thank the Minister of State. I wish him well in the discussions at next week's meeting. I thank him for his attendance with his attendant official entourage.

The remainder of the meeting to deal with housekeeping business will be in private session.

The joint committee went into private session at 2.30 p.m. and adjourned at 2.50 p.m. until 2.30 p.m. on Tuesday, 19 May 2009.
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