I welcome the Minister of State, Deputy Burke, to the House.
Nithe i dtosach suíonna - Commencement Matters
Historical Artefacts
Cuirim fáilte roimh an Aire Stáit chuig an Seanad. Tá mé ag lorg an scéal is déanaí maidir leis na pleananna do chathaoir Sheáin Uí Dhubhaí, an Finín mór le rá, a thabhairt do chontae Chill Dara. Deirtear gur scríobh Seán a chuid cuimhní cinn agus é ina shuí sa chathair sin. D'fhill sé go dtí a chontae dúchais 100 bliain ó shin agus tá candle ar leith ag muintir Bhaile Eoin, Kill, agus muintir Chontae Chill Dara agus muintir na hÉireann ar fad freisin, le John Devoy.
On 17 April 1876, a whaling ship, the Catalpa, spirited away six Fenian prisoners from a desolate prison on the other side of the world, in Fremantle, Western Australia. The jailbreakers arrived in New York city on 19 August 1876. There were wild celebrations there and back home in Ireland. Professor Joe Lee called it one of the greatest prison escapes of world history. It was the Fenian John Devoy from County Kildare, who was in exile in New York and who had the great help of John Boyle O'Reilly of Dowth, County Meath, who secured the approval of Clan na Gael in America to plan and undertake this audacious jailbreak. Incredibly, they pulled it off with no loss of life. For many, Clan na Gael effectively became Ireland's government in exile and John Devoy its leader. He was not afraid to depart from republican orthodoxy, as can be seen from his adoption of the new departure with Charles Stewart Parnell and Michael Davitt in 1878. The new departure was, of course, a model for the peace process in the North over a century later. Every Republican leader from James Connolly to Joseph Plunkett made a pilgrimage to Devoy in New York, and there is now a wonderful statue of him in the centre of Naas.
In 1924, when Devoy was 82 years old and in deteriorating health, Clan na Gael asked two Irishwomen from Castleblayney, Alice Carragher Comiskey and Lily Carragher, to look after Devoy and allow him to live with them in their apartment in Manhattan. In that apartment, Devoy wrote his memoirs, Recollections of an Irish Rebel, and did so in a chair bought for him. That chair has been in the continuous possession of the collateral descendants of Alice Comiskey since. Before she died, she gave it to her grand-nephew, Irish lawyer Frank MacGabhann. Frank and his family have kindly agreed and are willing to donate it to Ireland. The State, through Kildare County Council, has expressed a desire that the chair rightfully go to Devoy's birthplace in County Kildare. Mr. Frank MacGabhann hopes Kildare children will be able to sit in the same chair that this heroic Kildareperson sat in and from which he wrote his memoir. It would be appropriate to have a national, as well as a County Kildare, celebration to commemorate the historic Catalpa prison rescue, to be held in 2026. Right now, our concern is to get the chair home safely to Ireland.
Official preparations for the 150th anniversary of the Catalpa jail escape are beginning in Australia. Ideally, the two countries could do something together. One hundred years ago this year, in 1924, after many years in exile, the then elderly John Devoy returned to his beloved Kildare to visit friends and his childhood sweetheart, Mrs. Kilmurry. She and the people received him with open arms.
It was very well received by W.T. Cosgrave's Free State Government. It would be wonderful to get this chair safely to Ireland. I ask for an update on its current status and whereabouts, and whether we are on course to have the chair back in its rightful place in Naas. John Devoy was very proud man from the Johnstown-Kill area of Kildare.
Before I call on the Minister of State, I welcome our visitors to the Public Gallery. In particular, I welcome Councillor Bob Quinn from Kildare County Council.
I thank Senator Martin for raising this matter, to which I am responding on behalf of the Minister, Deputy Catherine Martin.
John Devoy was an important historical figure. Born in Kill, County Kildare, in 1842, he went on to become an active member of the Irish Republican Brotherhood, IRB, before arrest and penal servitude for treason against Britain led to his exile in America in 1871. He spoke on behalf of the Irish cause to the US House of Representatives, became a journalist with the New York Herald and was active with Clann na nGael, the successor of the Fenian Brotherhood and sister organisation of the IRB. In 1875, he helped to organise the daring escape of six Irish prisoners from Freemantle in Australia aboard a ship called the Catalpa.
In 1879, John Devoy helped to bring together the leading republican leaders and the lrish Parliamentary Party leader, Charles Stuart Parnell. who was an MP from 1846 to 1891. The result was that the Irish National Land League which campaigned successfully in the 1880s and 1890s for the rights of Irish Catholic tenant farmers. Following the Irish War of Independence, Devoy supported the Anglo-Irish Treaty, believing it was a sound foundation for future Irish freedom and eventual reunification of the Irish Free State with the Unionist Northern Ireland created in 1921. In the aftermath of the conflict, John Devoy was able to visit Ireland in 1924. He died in New York in 1928, and was later laid to rest in Glasnevin cemetery in Dublin.
The Department of Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media received an inquiry regarding the possibility and offer of official assistance to facilitate the return of John Devoy’s chair from the USA to Dublin. The chair is in the possession of Irish American community members in New York and was due to be sent to Kildare in 2014 to mark the year of the centenary of John Devoy’s final visit to Ireland in 2024. The chair is of significance because John Devoy used it while writing his memoir, Recollections of an Irish Rebel. This memoir was first published in 1929 and is an account of John Devoy’s long career as an Irish nationalist republican revolutionary from the 1850s until the 1920s. This important historic record is his narrative account of the Fenian movement and its origins and progress.
As members will be aware, the Minister and her Department, in conjunction with the Department of An Taoiseach, were responsible for the decade of centenaries. The latter was envisaged as a comprehensive exploration of the events in the turbulent period of Irish history that shaped the progress of Ireland in the 20th century. From the agitation of the Home Rule movement, the emergence of armed resistance, the economic and social conditions, including the 1913 Lockout, the descent into the First World War, the Easter Rising 1916 and its aftermath, the armistice, the general election of 1918 and the renewed assertion in arms of the Irish Republic that led to the Anglo-Irish Treaty of December 1921.
In the final phase, the commemorative programme addressed the tragedy of Civil War in Ireland. Nonetheless, it was noted that an abiding memory of special interest would be reflected in a special commemoration organised by the County Council in Kildare in the aftermath of the national programme. The Department is currently engaged with both Kildare County Council and the Irish Consulate General in New York in relation to the transfer of the chair, which I understand is to take place in the coming weeks. Members may be aware of the planning currently underway in Kildare to commemorate the centenary of the final visit of John Devoy to Ireland, which I expect will be of interest not only to the local community but to many across Ireland and the United States.
I thank the Minister of State for attending and for his very encouraging and positive words. As he said, the campaign to bring this chair home started in 2014. So many people in County Kildare will be delighted to learn that the chair will be home in Ireland in the coming weeks, in time for the centenary of John Devoy's final visit to Ireland.
County Kildare has a rich tradition of appreciation of history. A particular group has been working on this matter.
I acknowledge their vibrancy, dedication and passion for this topic. I do not want to name anyone in case I leave out others, but they will be so delighted that this chair will take its rightful place in, I hope, the library in Naas. I thank the Minister of State for that.
Finally, I acknowledge the generosity of Frank MacGabhann, his brother and the rest of his family, who kindly donated this chair. It is something we can all look forward to celebrating. He was a renowned native son of Kildare and, indeed, of Ireland.
It is appropriate that the achievements of John Devoy be commemorated on the centenary of his visit to Ireland. His lifetime coincided with the most remarkable period of modern Irish history and he was prominent in reflecting the changes that carried the nation from devastation and the edge of annihilation to restored autonomy and a pathway to peace and prosperity. He is particularly important in that he represents the connection between the Irish people in Ireland and the Irish diaspora, most especially the emigrants of the Famine era who established themselves in the US. The goodwill and support of the Irish diaspora in the United States have been a great resource for the people of Ireland. As we gather here today in the aftermath of the celebrations of St. Patrick's Day 2024, we are conscious of the ties to our family and culture around the world, especially in the US.
I thank the Senator for bringing to this Chamber's attention the planned special recognition of John Devoy and the return of the chair to County Kildare. It is important that John Devoy's remarkable life, extraordinary commitment and historic achievements be brought to mind, not least for our younger generations and new citizens. Furthermore, he should abide in the consciousness of the many of Irish descent in the United States. On behalf of the Minister, Deputy Martin, I offer my thanks to those involved in preparing the commemorative programme in Kildare and send our best wishes for the success of the programme in County Kildare.
Hospital Facilities
I thank the Minister of State for attending. I am here to speak about the investment in Portiuncula University Hospital and Roscommon University Hospital, and the reason I am here is that our Taoiseach, Leo Varadkar, nominated me to represent my region, Roscommon-Galway. As somebody who is quite new to public life, I have had the opportunity to fight for our region and make sure it is represented and stands out when it is fighting for balanced regional investment. That is the mark of the man who nominated me to be able to speak here about these hospitals.
In February 2023, the Taoiseach met the senior clinical team at Portiuncula University Hospital and had an opportunity to walk about the hospital and see the emergency department and the pressures the hospital is facing, but he also had the opportunity to see more than €34 million of investment in a 50-bed ward block that was allocated in 2019 during the tenure of the then Minister for Health, Deputy Harris. It is important we see this investment in our hospitals and for the future.
I acknowledge the Minister of State is taking this matter on behalf of the Minister for Health, Deputy Stephen Donnelly, but I am here to speak about the expansion requirements around the emergency department. When the Taoiseach visited Ballinasloe last year, he very much saw the improvements, development and progress of the investment in the hospitals up to that point, but he also saw the pressures that are in the emergency department. Among all the hospitals in the Saolta University Health Care Group, this is the one emergency department that has not seen any work over recent years. I know there was strong support from Saolta, and now from the new regional executive for the north and north west, in seeing investment into the department. Currently, under the HSE capital plan, it is listed as being at design stage. Last year, we worked hard to ensure that project would be moved forward. I now want to see this project being treated as a priority and moving forward because it is for the more than 400,000 patients in four counties who use the hospital and call it their own.
I am also here today to speak on behalf of Roscommon University Hospital. There has been magnificent investment in the Mayo Roscommon Hospice Foundation and many volunteers came together to open this facility, with more than eight beds in the area. Roscommon University Hospital is giving palliative care staff for this. The hospital has seen a reduction in waiting lists.
I know there are specialties in Portiuncula University Hospital in terms of plastics and reconstructive surgery. It is using leading edge and innovative technologies but what we also see here is a real increase in day surgeries. There has been more than a 15% to 20% increase in minor injury unit activity, and also in day surgeries. The challenge here is that people cannot get parking because the hospital is so busy.
We had an update from the Saolta University Hospital Health Care Group general manager there, Marie Doorly, who spoke about how they need what is basically a spatial development plan. I ask the Minister of State what needs to drive the spatial development plan because nothing else can happen in this hospital until we see the likes of improvements in the day surgery ward and the rehab unit planned for Roscommon University Hospital. We see new, unique skill sets and jobs being provided in the Roscommon area through this hospital but we need to make sure there is a plan for expansion. None of this can happen unless there is a HSE spatial development plan.
We have never seen a larger budget being allocated by the Government to the HSE capital plan and the Department of Health What we need to see is balanced regional development so that everyone on the island of Ireland receives the same care and services. That should be happening under this Government. That is what I want to see in terms of Portiuncula University Hospital and Roscommon University Hospital within the Saolta University Hospital Health Care Group.
I thank Senator Dolan for all of her work on Portiuncula Hospital. I know she has been a very strong advocate in government, with the Taoiseach and the Minister for Health, Deputy Stephen Donnelly. The Minister, Deputy Stephen Donnelly, acknowledges the work of Senator Dolan and thanks her for the opportunity to provide an update on the progress on the emergency Department expansion in Portiuncula University Hospital and the Roscommon University Hospital spatial development plan.
Portiuncula University Hospital is part of the Saolta University Hospital Health Care Group. Portiuncula University Hospital is a model 3 hospital operating a 24-7 emergency department with more than 26,000 emergency department, ED, attendances per year. Portiuncula University Hospital provides acute surgery, medicine, critical care, day care oncology, maternity, neonatal and paediatric services.
The capital plan 2024 is with the Minister for Health, Deputy Stephen Donnelly, for review and approval. The capital plan 2024 will be published in line with established procedures once it is approved. A capital submission for the expansion of the emergency department at Portiuncula University Hospital was submitted for consideration by the national capital and property review group in March 2023 and was approved by the group in May 2023. This project will increase the number of bays in the emergency department by nine. Currently there are 14 treatment bays and two resuscitation bays. This will provide capacity to deal with children in a segregated area of the department. Support facilities shall also be provided.
I can confirm, on behalf of the Minister, Deputy Stephen Donnelly, that the emergency department expansion is in the capital programme 2024 and the design team was procured in quarter 1 of 2024 and is currently progressing with the initial stage one design of the project.
Other developments ongoing in Portiuncula University Hospital include the construction phase of the new 50-bed ward block which is due to be completed by quarter 2 of 2024. Following handover to the HSE, the new 50-bed ward block is expected to be in service and occupied in quarter 4 of 2024 upon the completion of the following: equipping, fit-out and furnishing of the unit; familiarisation training of medical staff on newly installed systems; and registration of the new building with the Health Information and Quality Authority.
Roscommon University Hospital is a model 2 hospital also within the Saolta University Health Care Group. HSE capital and estates has confirmed it is liaising with Roscommon University Hospital and the Saolta University Hospital Health Care Group on the recommencement of a spatial plan for Roscommon University Hospital. An updated spatial plan is required to allow for a 25-bed rehabilitation unit, new clinical programmes and associated outpatient clinical space at the hospital.
The design process for the 25-bed rehabilitation unit will be progressed in parallel with the updated spatial plan for the entire campus at Roscommon University Hospital. A meeting has been arranged for early April 2024 to commence this process.
All capital development proposals must progress through a number of approval stages, in line with the infrastructure guidelines which supersede the public spending code, including detailed appraisal, planning, design and procurement before funding for each stage can be confirmed. The successful completion of the various approval stages will determine the timeline for delivery of the capital projects.
I thank the Minister of State. That is indeed welcome news. It is fantastic that we will see the 50-bed ward block open by September of this year, I hope. It will be fantastic for the teams, managers, patients and families who rely on that hospital. As the Minister of State mentioned, access to additional space in the ED is particularly crucial.
We are seeing the expansion of the ED. This will involve the provision of additional bays that will allow more space for paediatrics. We are seeing more families coming to live and work in the west. It is wonderful to see so many families expanding. More than 1,300 babies have been born in the maternity unit at Portiuncula hospital. Many people speak about how they were born in Portiuncula hospital in Ballinasloe. It is important that our paediatrics space is fit for purpose. This is very welcome news.
I welcome that it is in the HSE capital plan for this year. I know that we will be working closely with the teams and that the teams will be working closely with the HSE and the Department of Health in the context of equipping and fitting out the facility. The updated spatial plan is really necessary, with the 25-bed rehabilitation unit, the new clinical programmes and clinical spaces. I thank the teams for organising the meeting that has been arranged for April, which will be absolutely crucial.
I thank Senator Dolan for all her work in the context of healthcare at both hospitals. As I said, a meeting has been organised for April 2024. That will commence the process, which is very important. As I pointed out, the project has been included in the capital plan for 2024. The design team was procured in quarter 1 and is currently progressing with stage 1. Like the Senator, I will keep the pressure on the Minister. Hopefully, this will lead to the delivery of first-class healthcare for the people of the area.
Housing Policy
The Housing Commission has completed its work on a referendum in respect of housing. I commend the work of the commission. I tabled this matter to give the Minister and the Government an opportunity to discuss the right to housing being enshrined in the Constitution, which the Seanad supported by way of a motion earlier this term. Often, Private Members' referendum Bills in the Dáil from Sinn Féin and others have been defeated by Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael. I understand that a majority report of the Housing Commission was delivered to the Minister in September and that a minority report representing the dissenting views of two members of the commission was delivered in November. Will the Minister of State please outline why there has been such a delay in publishing the report? Can he offer a timeframe for its publication? Will he confirm that it is indeed a recommendation of the Housing Commission to insert a right to housing into the Constitution?
I want to convey the apologies of the Minister for housing to the Senator.
In line with programme for Government commitments, the Minister for Housing Local Government and Heritage established the Commission on Housing in December 2021 as an independent body to examine and evaluate Ireland's housing system, including issues such as tenure, standards, sustainability and quality-of-life issues in the provision of housing. At the same time, the Minister also tasked the commission to advise the Government, in an independent and objective manner, on the critical factors to be considered regarding a referendum on housing and, if appropriate, to recommend wording for a constitutional change. Importantly, the commission was not tasked with considering a constitutional change vis-à-vis a right to housing. However, this was not precluded by the commission’s terms of reference.
The commission’s official referendum report was submitted to the Minister last summer. It sets out recommendations regarding a proposed constitutional amendment on housing. In reaching its conclusions, the commission examined, among other things, the range of complex constitutional questions arising. It undertook a comprehensive consultation, researched international experience, evaluated various proposed wordings and considered other critical factors involved with introducing an amendment to the Constitution. At this time, the Minister was also advised by the chair of the Housing Commission that a minority referendum report would likely be submitted by a smaller group of members, reflecting an alternative view to that presented in the commission’s official referendum report. Unfortunately, this minority report was not received until mid-November.
Given the expectation at that time that the commission would report imminently on its broader examination and evaluation of the Irish housing system, a decision was taken to delay bringing the commission’s official and minority referendum reports to Government, and to bring all three reports to Government at the same time.
Unfortunately, submission of the commission's broader report to the Minister has been significantly delayed in the meantime, though it is expected to be submitted to the Minister in the coming weeks. Once received, and following due consideration given by the Minister, he plans to bring the commission’s official and minority reports to the Government shortly thereafter. The Minister will outline the proposed next steps vis-à-vis the holding of a referendum at that stage. However, it is not a straightforward matter of accepting the commission’s report and simply scheduling a referendum. The range of issues at play, including the scheduling of a referendum, require careful examination before a definitive direction of travel is agreed. Regard must also be had to the need for a referendum in the first instance, as well as the scale and complexity of work required to consider implications of any agreed amendment to develop policy proposals for Government approval and to conclude the parliamentary process and referendum campaign. Ultimately, the holding of a referendum on housing will be a matter for the Government to decide.
I am somewhat confused. My understanding was that two reports had been furnished to the Government but I will bring the response away and consider it further. Back in early November, the Minister, Deputy O'Brien, said he expected in quite a short space of time to be able to bring a report and recommendations to Cabinet. The Acting Chair is a member of the housing committee. I am sure members of that committee are also keen to see the report. As my colleague, Deputy Ó Broin, has said in the Dáil, we hope it is not the intention to refer the report to the joint Oireachtas committee because that would be a terrible waste of time. The committee has considered the issue and a majority of its members are also on record as supporting a referendum. I disagree, however. The Minister and the Department should draft legislation and then allow the joint Oireachtas committee to scrutinise that legislation. We should enshrine the right to secure appropriate and affordable housing in the foundational law - the constitutional law - of the State. People should be given an opportunity to decide that and if they want the status quo in housing to remain or to finally move on from a broken housing system.
It is a Government policy to hold a referendum on housing and, to this end, the Housing Commission was tasked with examining and reporting on a referendum on housing. As I said, the commission submitted its official referendum report to the Minister for housing last summer, with a minority referendum report submitted some considerable time later in November. While the delay is regrettable, the Minister hopes to bring both referendum reports to Government, together with the commission's broader report on recommendations, to the housing system once the latter is received in the coming weeks.
That said, it is clear from the commission's comprehensive analysis that there are complex matters to be considered. The matter is made no less complex with the submission of the minority report and alternative views expressed by certain commission members. However, given the importance of the matter and the significant public interest in it, the opportunity the minority report affords for a fully informed consideration on the complex policy and legal issues arising is welcomed. While it will be a matter for the Government to decide, the Minister also considers the joint Oireachtas committee will have an important role in this regard and believes how we move forward on the matter from here is something which should be agreed with the committee members.
Schools Building Projects
Our next Commencement matter is in the name of Senator Tim Lombard regarding Ballinspittle National School. It is a lovely part of the world. I was there at the weekend. The Senator has four minutes.
The Acting Chair should have told me as I would have met him.
It is great to have the Minister of State in the Chamber. I am discussing the issue of Ballinspittle National School, one which I have continuously raised since I entered the Seanad. We have been looking for a new school since 2018 and the timelines are quite frightening. In June 2018, a design brief was approved for this and it has being going through different stages from stage 1, 2, 2A and 2B. Last year, we received information that it was going to tender in April 2023 but we have been trying to work out where we are since then. At the moment, we are looking at the bizarre scenario where we have children who came into junior infants who will not see the new school by the time it is finished due to the time it is taking to deliver this project. It started in 2018 and has worked all the way through.
It is a significant project involving 12 classrooms. There are special education rooms as well. There are only 200 students in this school and it has a very committed management team who work really hard to make sure the school provides great education in Ballinspittle. However, the real issue is the timeline and the time delays in particular.
We have been looking for movement on this project since the new school was first mooted. There have been significant delays, including due to Covid and everything else in between. We are looking for an update on the tender process. This is my fourth time raising this national school in the Chamber. It is a really dynamic part of the world and it needs to get the educational campus that the majority of the villages around it have received in recent years. There have been significant school developments in recent years in places like Kilbrittain, Nohoval and, in particular, Kinsale, but, unfortunately, this village and parish have not seen any development, which they have been seeking for so long. The principal has done so much in respect of this matter.
I hope the Minister of State will give me an outline of where he thinks the tender process is and the timeline for a new school. My understanding was that the tender process should take six months and after that a new school would be delivered within a 20-month period on the campus. I realise that the build is very complicated because the work will happen while educational activities are ongoing. The construction process has been split. We need to get moving and to get a date and timeline for when the school will be delivered on the ground.
I thank Senator Lombard for raising this very important matter in regard to Ballinspittle National School. I apologise on behalf of the Minister for Education, who is unable to attend.
Since 2020, the Department of Education has invested in the region of €4.5 billion in schools throughout the country, involving the completion of more than 800 school building projects, with construction currently under way on approximately 300 other projects, including 31 new school buildings. The 300 projects currently at construction involve a total State investment of more than €1.2 billion. This is a record level of investment in schools and highlights the Government's very strong track record of delivery in providing additional capacity and modern facilities for school communities. There are also approximately 90 projects currently at the tender stage, including a further 28 new school buildings. All of these new school buildings are flagship projects in their area and transform the education infrastructure for those school communities.
As part of the supplementary budget in 2023, €405 million in additional capital funding was provided for the school building programme. This helped to alleviate capital funding pressures that arose in 2023. These pressures reflect the strong delivery by the Department of Education of school building projects, including to support additional school places aligned with housing growth, special education provision, and also the accommodation of students from Ukraine in the school system. This is a significant roll-out of the school building programme that is being delivered in a challenging construction sector environment.
The Department of Education's overall capital outturn for 2023 was €1.264 billion. The major building project for Ballinspittle National School is included in the Department's construction programme, which is being delivered under the national development plan. The project brief is a completion contract for a new 12-classroom school and three classrooms for children with special educational needs and ancillary accommodation, together with all associated site works.
The invitation to tender issued in April 2023. Recent experience has demonstrated that a tender stage can take between eight and 12 months from the initial invitation to tender, subject to no issues arising. A tender report has been received from Ballinspittle board of management and the design team, and is currently under review by the Department. Following this stage, a letter of intent will be issued to the successful contractor and subsequently, there is a minimum 14-day standstill period before a letter of acceptance can be issued. Only when the letter of acceptance has issued is there a contract in place and all the contract terms and conditions apply. The due diligence by the Department is a critical part of the overall completion of the stage 3 process and is critical to ensuring quality and value for money, and that projects are progressed within overall programme parameters. It is estimated that it will take approximately 22 months to complete the Ballinspittle National School project.
I raised this Commencement debate last April and I got an interesting response regarding the tender process. There is a real slip in the timelines outlined. Last April, I was told that it would take six to eight months for the tender process to happen. Today, I am told it will take eight to 12 months. For some reason, the timeline for the tender process has slipped in comparison with what was outlined in the Commencement debate on this matter 12 months ago. At that time, I was also informed that it would take 20 months for the construction process. This has now slipped to 22 months. That is the core issue.
We started this project in 2018. Kids who went to that school on their first day will not see the new school finished because of the timelines. When you have slippages, months become years and years become people's lives when they are waiting for a new school to be delivered on the ground. We need the Department to issue the tender papers, to approve the tender and get the letter of acceptance out to the contractors. The way the market is going at the moment, prices will only go one way. The longer we wait, the higher it gets. I estimate that, from where we were in 2018 when this was mooted, the cost of this school has probably doubled. That is a significant issue. Timelines are killing us with projects like this. I appreciate that we have had huge investment, but we cannot have the slippages we have seen. The Minister might come back and let me know when the letter of intent will be issued from the Department so that we can get boots on the ground.
I again thank Senator Lombard for raising this important issue of Ballinspittle national school. I will go back to the Minister for Education about the timelines, specifically the tender process and the 22-month construction process. I will raise the Senator's concerns relating to his commencement last April where he pointed out the slippage of the timelines. I will ask the Minister to reply directly to the Senator.
Grant Payments
I welcome the Minister, Deputy McConalogue, to the House this afternoon. I appreciate that the senior Minister has taken time out of his busy schedule to deal with this Commencement matter which states that there needs to be a review of the grant reference costings from the Department when it comes to the allocation of TAMS grants, in particular as they relate to building projects. I raise this because of one instance I am aware of where a farmer is developing a shed. The Department estimates the price, on which the farmer will get his grant, is in the region of €63,000. After a lot of negotiation, price comparison, haggling and so on, the cheapest he can get that job done for is €93,000. That is a massive gulf. The difference in the 60% grant on the Department costing and what the farmer will spend means it is more like he will be getting a 41% grant. There is a difference for him in what he will spend of more than €17,000. It is an issue for another day, but you can couple that with some of the VAT implications that have arisen recently because of the view Revenue has taken. That is along with the fact that when farmers go to the banks to get their investment side of these projects, most banks do the stress test based on a 170 stocking rate. In a worst case scenario, even if a farmer has a higher stocking rate they are looking at a potential reduction in the future, but we will not go there. They are doing that stress test based on 170.
When I heard those figures it was hard for me to believe there could be such a gap between the actual and reference costings. I did some research yesterday with a concrete company. The last time these prices were reviewed, one could buy a cube of 35N concrete for anywhere between €65 and €75. That is now coming in at between €120 and €130 per cube. That is an increase of 80%. Again, when I inquired on pricing in the steel side of things, which would be the second biggest component in any shed development project, the increase since the last review in 2021 is anywhere between 25% and 30% for cladding, steel and all of the major inputs.
The Minister can see there is a massive gulf. My problem is I think this might be inhibiting a lot of farmers from doing necessary development, which in fairness they are on the whole doing for the betterment of the environment.
We do not want a situation where necessary development that will improve the lot of farmers and the welfare of their flocks and that of the overall environment is delayed. Projects could be shelved because of the extra cost. As I said, based on the costings relating to this particular job, the 60% grant equates to 41%. For a person getting a 40% grant, it equates to 28%. While the spend on the job I mentioned should be €36,000, it will actually be €54,000. That is a massive gulf.
I hope the Minister has good news for me. There is a need for an immediate review because it is becoming too onerous a task. It is too expensive and is not feasible for many farmers to carry out necessary projects which, as I said, will benefit not only their lifestyles and workloads but also the environment and the welfare of their animals.
I thank Senator Daly for raising this issue. The Senator is a strong advocate of the targeted agricultural modernisation scheme, TAMS, and has been in touch with me on a regular basis with regard to the development of this particular TAMS. This issue regarding reference costs is one on which he has been advocating very strongly. I will first give a general overview of the scheme for the House, much of which the Senator will know.
The Department's reference costs for the target agricultural modernisation scheme are developed as a maximum ceiling that can be paid for grant-aided equipment under the suite of ten schemes that are open to farmers. In all, there are more than 400 investment items that have a reference cost. I increased that under this Common Agricultural Policy, CAP, by 60 additional items compared to what was available in the outgoing TAMS. The costs are targeted as being for a good standard but not the best standard. For equipment that is required to be installed to operate, the reference cost calculated must also cover the cost of installation. It is also important that the reference costs are set at a level that does not drive inflation or building materials, labour or farming equipment costs. The reference costs are kept under review and are normally reviewed on an annual basis, with the latest review having been undertaken in the lead-up to the launch of TAMS 3. Any revised reference costs are developed and only applied to applications that are submitted after the completion of a review. That has always been the way it has operated with regard to TAMS.
These new reference calls are in place for all TAMS 3 applications to date, and the first payment claims under TAMS 3 were submitted in the past few weeks. The review of my Department's reference costs for the TAMS involves a number of steps, the first of which is a review of all the receipted costs submitted in support of claims, as downloaded from the TAMS computer system, to compare the actual claims costs for the relevant items over the preceding year with the reference costs in place. Once this has been completed, the Central Statistics Office, CSO, construction index figures are obtained for the period being reviewed to act as a guide for the potential expected increases in the prices of equipment and buildings.
Meetings were organised with reputable supplier companies to obtain quotes for the different types of equipment and buildings being evaluated, with quotations obtained from at least three separate companies for each item for which reference costs are being developed. This is to ensure that the average obtained is reflective of the true market costs of the items. Once the quotations have been received, the average cost is then calculated for each item. When revised reference costs are finalised and approved, they are uploaded to the TAMS 3 computer system to go live in conjunction with the beginning of the next tranche. A further review will be commenced later this year when there are sufficient claims submitted by applicants under the scheme to enable evaluation of the actual costs being incurred by farmers with regard to building works and equipment purchases. It is also important to be aware that the applicants avail of the reference costs that are in place at the date they make an application under TAMS, as I said, and any revision of reference costs only applies to future applications. That is the structure that is in place and operational under the scheme.
Obviously, costs change and evolve. It is important that they are considered and reflected. They do apply to future TAMS applicants going forward, however. We are only now getting into the stage where we are opening up tranche 3, with tranche 1 of TAMS having closed last June and the majority of those applicants having received their approval. The claims are starting to come in for those now as well. It is something I will closely monitor as those claims come in to ensure there is an updated reference assessment in order that it can be applied subsequent to that concluding.
I appreciate the Minister's response and his outline of how the system works. I plead with him to consider a more immediate review. I will not rehash the figures I mentioned other than to say they are genuine. There is a big gulf in funding at the moment, particularly on the concrete, steel and building side, more so than in terms of equipment. A number of farmers with live applications are only now beginning to realise the difference. They were using the Department's reference costs to calculate their potential outlay. It was only when they received price quotations from contractors that they realised the massive gulf in funding. It is putting some of these necessary jobs in jeopardy as farmers have second thoughts as to whether to complete them. I plead with the Minister to initiate an urgent and up-to-date review and to try to bridge the gap between the estimated costs and the actual costs for farmers. There has been an 80% increase in the cost of concrete, which is the major component of any development, since the previous review of building costs by the Department.
I thank the Senator again for raising this issue. It is the first time it has been raised with me on the floor of the Seanad or Dáil. It is no surprise it is the Senator who has done so, given his commitment to the scheme and to the importance of on-farm investment.
The structure of the scheme and the way it operates are about going forward. It is my understanding that this is what we have approval to do. I accept the Senator's point that as we move forward with the scheme, it must be reflective of costs. The costs are coming in for those who were in tranche 1 and were assessed and updated before TAMS 3 was launched. We are just starting to get the cost assessments from those who got grant approval and proceeded with work. As those returns come in, they will be assessed to see what the evolving situation is on the ground, with a view, as the year moves on and as we receive more returns, to updating the reference costs, as has been done previously over the long history of TAMS.
I will give the Senator's feedback to the TAMS team in my Department. Looking forward, any change that may be made over the next couple of months, including updated reference costs, will apply into the future for future applicants only.
Enterprise Support Services
I welcome the Minister of State, Deputy Richmond.
It is great to have the Minister of State in the House. I highlight the importance and the successes of the THRIVE programme and ask that his Department engage directly with the management of the programme to ensure it receives funding and can continue beyond this June. I emphasise the crucial importance of continuing to fund this truly innovative initiative that is specifically designed to support women who are striving to bring new products and services to the market within the science, technology, engineering and mathematics, STEM, sector.
The programme is delivered by the regional development centre in Dundalk Institute of Technology, which has a hugely successful track record of delivering entrepreneurship programmes across the region. STRIVE serves as a beacon of empowerment for women in STEM, providing them with the necessary resources, mentorship and guidance to navigate the complex landscape of product development and innovation. By offering a platform where female entrepreneurs can flourish and bring their ideas to fruition, THRIVE is not just supporting individuals. It is fostering a culture of inclusion and diversity within the traditionally male dominated fields of science, technology, engineering and mathematics.
As the Minister of State knows well, we are standing on the cusp of major technological advancement. Society is moving on. It is imperative that we harness the full potential of the talents and perspectives of our people. Women have long been under-represented in STEM fields. Initiatives like the THRIVE programme are instrumental in bridging that gap and creating a more equitable playing field. By investing in the programme, we are not only investing in the success of individual women but also investing in our economy and in the future.
The ideas and solutions that emerge from the programme have the potential to revolutionise industries, create jobs and drive economic growth. I hope the Minister of State and his Department can engage with the THRIVE management and Lavina McGahon, who is the manager of the programme in Dundalk.
It has been given national recognition. It was the national winner of the European Enterprise Promotion Awards - Promotion of Entrepreneurship Spirit, which took place in Bilbao in Spain in November of last year. It has been getting the results and it would be a real shame to let this programme fall off a cliff in June.
I sincerely thank Senator McGreehan for bringing forward this very important issue. At the outset, I will take the liberty to address my response not just to Senator McGreehan, but to the school kids who are in the Visitors Gallery because this is really important. We are dealing with a very important issue for every one of them and they are very welcome to the people's House and the Parliament.
As the Senator knows better than any of us, the increased participation by women in STEM, but also in the workforce and politics is vital for the economy, the Government and our society. This Government is committed to ensuring that women are able to realise their full entrepreneurial potential.
The THRIVE programme the Senator mentioned is supported by the local enterprise office, LEO, in Louth, which has paid out €10,000 in funding over the past three years, but also by attending and supporting events that have been of great benefit to LEO clients in Louth. The Senator and I were in the Carrickdale Hotel ten days ago and we are really taken by the enthusiasm for business in the region. I had a good chance to talk with the head of the LEO office and officials from DKIT, alongside the Senator that morning. As the Senator will know, I was lucky enough to visit the Louth LEO on what I believe was my first LEO visit as Minister of State more than a year ago and I was really taken by the quality of the clients. In fact, last year, 212 companies were supported by the Louth LEO, and that created 154 jobs alone.
STEM is a vitally important sector of our economy, but it is crucial that we, as a country, have as many women in STEM as possible. I understand the Louth LEO, as well as the Cavan LEO, have done great work with the THRIVE programme, but a request for the continuation of this funding has not yet been made. It is crucial that we promote and support women entrepreneurs and women in STEM because it is frankly the right thing to do.
Ireland has the third highest rate of early-stage female entrepreneurs across European countries, but we still have much room to improve. Growing the number of women entrepreneurs and women in business more generally is a key objective of this Government. I feel very strongly about the need to step up our efforts to make progress in that area. Officials in my Department are actively engaging with our agencies and all 31 of our local enterprise offices to examine what can be done to progress equality, diversity and inclusion. This includes looking at the data and statistics that are currently collated regarding women in business and identifying where there may be gaps so that we can have greater insight into our performance in this area. I met with a group called TechFoundHer in recent months to discuss how we can improve here.
Enterprise Ireland has an ambitious target to increase the number of women-led companies growing internationally by 100% by 2025. As well as that, year on year, the LEOs are celebrating increasing numbers of women in business through the National Women’s Enterprise Day, which takes place each year in October. This past year, the theme was Empowering Business Together, with events taking place nationwide. I had the privilege of launching it in Tallaght with a range of inspiring speakers and with topics covering everything from leadership to developing a strategic mindset to meeting the challenges of digitalisation and transforming a business in a low-carbon economy.
I can assure the Senator that much work is under way to support women in STEM and indeed between the Louth LEO and the THRIVE programme. Funding has been provided for the past few years, and I hope that any request for funding would be viewed positively.
I thank the Minister of State. He has made several fantastic visits to County Louth, and north Louth in particular. He is always very welcome. I am very grateful for his response and his Department's recognition of what we all want to see succeeding, namely, improving entrepreneurship for women and across all the sectors.
What I am hearing from the Minister of State, and forgive me if I am wrong, is that no application has been put in. The THRIVE programme should apply to the Louth LEO. That is where the funding should come from, and where I should direct it regarding where the funding should come from. If the LEO has that funding earmarked for something else and if that funding is not possible, or if there is not enough funding, I would hope that we can engage again. There is so much going on within LEO offices and we have a really good one in County Louth. It does fantastic work. I would like the Minister of State's office to be open to me and to the THRIVE programme in case that funding of €10,000 is not an option for the THRIVE programme in Dundalk.
The Minister of State has one minute to conclude.
My office is always open to the Senator. I mean that sincerely. Last year, we increased national funding for local enterprise offices by €9 million. We gave them additional funding so they can not only maintain current programmes but can do more programmes. However, if the team in County Louth feel they do not have sufficient resources, the Department will of course be more than happy to engage directly. I expect any application to be viewed positively and, more importantly, I would like to see at least another three years of the THRIVE programme.
Cuireadh an Seanad ar fionraí ar 1.10 p.m. agus cuireadh tús leis arís ar 1.30 p.m.
Sitting suspended at 1.10 p.m. and resumed at 1.30 p.m.