asked the Minister for the Co-ordination of Defensive Measures if he will state whether it is proposed to issue regulations dealing with the black-out, whether these regulations will discriminate in respect of the severity of the black-out between different localities, and the purpose for which in different localities a black-out may be necessary.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Black-out Regulations
A Draft Order is in course of preparation to provide for the regulation of public lighting, lighting in factories, essential undertakings and private houses, and for lighting on vehicles. The order will affect public lighting, advertising lighting and lighting of outdoor entertainments throughout the State. It will provide for more rigid restrictions in defined areas which are mainly on the east coast and around certain large towns.
The purpose of the order is to prevent the glare of the lights of our larger cities from being a guide to belligerent aircraft; to help to reduce our vulnerability to attack from outside; to accustom our citizens to the precautions which commonsense dictates and which other neutral States have found to be necessary so that in case of an aerial attack the damage done to life and property may be as light as possible, and to work up to the position that when the necessary preparations have been made it will be possible to have a complete "black-out" at short notice if such were required.
Would the Parliamentary Secretary make it clear that, pending the issue of regulations, motorists at all events have got to comply with the law as it exists at the moment and that motorists who dim or turn down their lights during lighting-up hours are breaking the law and, in the event of an accident, are automatically liable for heavy damages for any death or injury caused? Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that fatal accidents have occurred already through motorists driving without their full headlights and that they have been found to have no defence in law?
I should like the Depute to understand that this question of lighting restrictions is a very difficult one, particularly in regard to motor cars. Again, I should like to point out that apart from a sort of prediction made on the radio as to what might he the actual conditions later, and an appeal for co-operation to achieve the desired object when orders will be made, no orders were given to anybody in regard to lighting except that we did get in touch with tramways and bus companies to ask them to make certain trials of their lighting for the purpose of affording aid to the aerial survey made by the military. A number of people throughout the country affected, I think, by radio broadcasts from outside the country, and by newspapers from outside the country, took it upon themselves to consider that an order in another country was requisite or applicable in this country, and in this matter they passed out our expectations. The whole question of motor lighting is most difficult. We are having it examined by a number of experts: motor traders, engineers and lighting engineers, and we are hoping to produce something that will be reasonable. In regard to people being killed, I did notice a report in one of the papers, a statement to the effect that a man was killed as a result of "a black-out." That was the heading to the paragraph published in the newspaper. The actual information in the paragraph was that the man had his lights fully on, and immediately put them out after the accident.
I do not want to get into an argument on matters of that kind that one hears about. What I do want from the Parliamentary Secretary is a clear statement that, at the moment, there is no order to any motorist driving at night to drive otherwise than with his full lights on. In other words, that at the present moment every motorist driving at night must comply with the law, and that there is no regulation amending or altering the law as it stood a month ago so far as motoring is concerned. Is that so?
That is correct. In that matter I have broken the law myself. That may be because I have had to experiment with the lights on cars to see exactly what was the best manner in which I could have a reduction in lighting suitable to the condition that we want to bring about in the defined areas.
The Parliamentary Secretary is in a privileged position. I take it that he is entitled to break the law by way of experiment provided that, when doing so, he does not break anybody's neck. What is happening at the moment is that thousands of people are breaking the law every night in the belief that they are complying with the law. Whatever danger there may be from bombing, there is far more danger for anyone who has to drive a motor car, say a distance of 30 miles, on an Irish road at night. I am speaking as one who has had to do it.
Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that, at an early date in September, a telegram was sent to certain local authorities in the name of the Minister for Defence calling for a, complete "black-out" in certain provincial towns and in other places?
Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that there is a state of general confusion throughout the country over this whole question of a black out? Is he aware that there is a complete black out in the most remote mountainy villages, while at present the best illuminated centre in the country is also the most vulnerable, namely, the City of Dublin? Is he further aware that, in provincial towns and small remote villages, the Gárda Síochána have gone round and told the people that they win have to black out their lights completely? Is he also aware that, as a result of his own broadcast, plus the orders of the Gárda Síochána, the people of the country have been put to considerable expense in providing materials for their houses in order to comply with the instructions given to have a complete black out? As I have said, at the moment the whole position seems to be in a state of confusion.
A telegram was sent to various local authorities asking them to reduce their lighting to 25 per cent.
The Electricity Supply Board cut off all lights in certain towns.
Twenty-five per cent. was the order in the telegram. I have been told that the Gárda have issued orders. I think that is a matter for the Department of Justice. I do not know what the Gárda are doing. I have also heard that people have gone to a good deal of expense, but, as I pointed out to Deputy O'Higgins, a lot of people did that on their own initiative because of broadcasts, what they saw in the papers and so on.
No.
As I pointed out in my reply, the order "will affect public lighting, advertising lighting and lighting of outdoor entertainments throughout the State". That is to be general in certain defined areas where there must be more rigid restriction than generally throughout the country.
Mr. Brennan
Would the Parliamentary Secretary say in what category he would place the lighting of public hospitals? I am aware that public hospitals in the remotest parts of the country have been ordered by the Minister for Local Government to black out. On whose instructions was that done?
The Deputy says it was done on the instructions of the Minister for Local Government.
In view of the fact that the black out is reported to have been relaxed in Berlin because of the number of driving accidents that have taken place there, as well as in English industrial towns because of the damage done to industrial life in those towns, will the Parliamentary Secretary not consider relaxing the black out in Dublin in view of the inconvenience that it is going to cause? Further, will he see that industrial concerns and business concerns are not put unnecessarily to any great expense in providing a black out where they normally close down at 6 o'clock or 7 o'clock in the evening? Will he endeavour to make the black out bring as little hardship as possible to the ordinary residents of the country, particularly those in the smaller towns?
Will the Parliamentary Secretary say if, in fact, we are a neutral country, what is the necessity for a black out at all?
Is it not a fact that there was a definite statement in the daily Press as well as a broadcast to the effect that the Government requested that persons would take steps to black out their lights, and that motorists would drive with side-light only? Are we now to, understand from the Parliamentary Secretary that all the expense which householder in Dublin have been put to in erecting black curtains, painting their windows and in using other devices, has been a sheer waste of money? Is it also to be taken that the difficulties we have all experienced in driving motor cars with sidelights only through badly-lighted streets, have been a sheer waste of energy and time: that, in actual fact, we have not been expected to do anything of the kind? If that is so, why was not an intimation given to us sooner so that people might enjoy the usual amenities of full lighting on their cars, in their homes and on the streets?
I would be in a far better position to answer these questions if I were allowed to answer one at a time. Deputy Mulcahy put one question which I would like to answer. He asked that we should try to cause the least inconvenience possible to ordinary residents in the State. I may say that is our aim. These regulations in relation to driving have been drafted after a good deal of thought and consultation, and I put it to the House that if we are given two or three more days I think everyone will feel quite satisfied that everything was done in the most reasonable way.
But, meantime, there is no order?
No.
The Chair hereby notifies Deputies that there will be a black out of questions at 5 o'clock.