Well, there will be other costs also, such as the cost of transport, for instance, which is being dealt with by another body. Labourers for forestry work are, in general, recruited as far as possible from the local employment exchanges. That is our general practice. Deputies Cosgrave, Walsh and Coburn raised questions with regard to the Department's policy in regard to land acquisition. The position is that wherever land is available we are glad to acquire it, provided the acreage is sufficiently large to enable us to start a new centre. The minimum area considered suitable for the formation of a new forest is about 300 acres in one block. Occasionally, a slightly smaller area has been acquired, but then only where it is fairly certain that eventually large areas will come in in that district. Wherever possible, derelict plantations and woodlands, which are taken over on estates acquired by the Land Commission, are handed over to the Forestry Branch, and, of course, I may mention in passing that any demands for land in the way of provision for local uneconomic holders are considered by the Land Commission before they hand these lands over for purposes of afforestation. Practically all the lands acquired by the Land Commission in that way, upon which you have woodlands and where there are existing plantations, are now the responsibility of the Forestry Branch.
The taking of areas of 300 acres or thereabouts, and building up centres to the large number that I mentioned—102 in all—has meant that forestry activities tend to be spread out over the country rather more than is desirable if considered from the point of view solely of scientific and economical afforestation. Obviously, such an extension runs contrary to the principle of concentrating our efforts on districts where we find that land is available fairly readily and where it is suitable, and where we have a good organisation and a certain number of centres already. Limitation of the price to be paid for land for forestry purposes also prevents our acquiring land which could be used for agricultural purposes; so that the position is that the type of land which we acquire lies somewhere between good agricultural land and land which is unsuitable for the growth of timber on account of exposure and infertility. We may get land almost as good as agricultural land, and also land on which it is extremely doubtful whether we would be able to grow timber at all. The total acreage of such land in the country has not been accurately determined but it has been stated—and I think the estimate is possibly correct— that 600,000 acres would be sufficient, if planted, to provide us with our total timber requirements.
I feel also, from the inquiries that have been made—although they have not been sufficiently detailed to enable me to say with complete finality that they are correct—that probably the 600,000 acres could be found if we were quite sure that we could pay the price the owners required and if there were no other obstacles. If it were the position that we could pay whatever was necessary for land and if the land were obtainable generally, no doubt we would be able to build up to the required amount, but the position is that we are proceeding rather slowly. Most of the larger estates have come in, and there is still a number of estates in private hands where a good deal of planting is carried on in a regular way. Probably some of these estates—not a very great number of them but some—will still continue in private hands and doing satisfactory work from the forestry point of view. We have nearly reached the limit, I think, so far as expecting large blocks of woodlands to come into our hands is concerned, and in future we shall have to depend on blocks of land from ordinary farmers. It is very difficult to acquire land in that way in sufficient quantities. It takes a considerable time to negotiate with the individual owners and, as I have explained to the House already, when we have the land acquired or are in process of acquiring it, we find that all kinds of grazing rights and claims, that very often we knew nothing about, begin to appear; so that, altogether, the question of the acquisition of land is rather troublesome.
Deputy Meaney suggested I should exercise compulsory powers to acquire land from parties who are unwilling to part with it for the purposes of afforestation. The exercise of compulsory powers against unwilling parties would probably result in undesirable consequences, and I would prefer to be able to acquire land for afforestation by the ordinary processes of negotiation and agreement. Deputy Meaney also mentioned the supply of timber for egg and butter boxes. This would seem to be a matter for the Departments of Agriculture and Supplies.
Deputies R. Walsh and Nally complained of the virtual closing down of the Ashford sawmill at Cong. Deputy Nally stated that 35 to 40 men were formerly employed in the conversion of timber at this sawmill, while only four to six are now employed. The sawmills accommodation at Ashford is very small, and, presumably, the numbers mentioned by Deputy Nally included men employed on felling timber and carting timber to the mill, apart from those actually engaged in the mill. If so, the numbers employed at present on the same operations are much more than he mentions, and are as much as the mill can accommodate, working at full pressure. The sawmills are driven by water power, and are subject to stoppage when the water supply is low. Arrangements have been made to transfer an oil engine from another forest to Cong, so that the mills can be kept in regular working order during the dry season.
Deputy John Flynn mentioned some difficulties about the acquisition of land in County Kerry. There are four separate offers in the Caragh Lake district, each too small to be suitable for acquisition by itself. In order to secure the necessary 300 acres minimum, we must proceed with all four offers together. Progress is held up at present until the Land Commission have settled the boundary question in regard to one of the areas offered, but the district has been listed for priority.
Deputy Cosgrave inquired as to the extent to which immature timber is being cut. No immature timber has been clear-cut in the State forests except where it is not of merchantable value and is suitable only for fuel. Clear-cutting of immature timber on private estates is restricted as much as possible and, where permission to cut young trees of pitwood size has been granted, adequate replanting conditions have been imposed. Pitwood timber is, of course, derived mainly from thinnings.
Deputy Cosgrave also inquired why trees are not uprooted instead of being cut over. He mentioned that trees were cut over up to three feet from the ground. This would seem to be very bad workmanship, as no tree stump should be higher than three inches. If the trees were properly felled in the first instance, the stumps should not be more than three inches over the ground—at any rate, not more than it would be possible to cover with clay, if necessary. Uprooting trees required for commercial purposes would be too expensive, not only because the main roots have to be severed and special tackle used for operating, but also because the trees have still to be cut off the root and such a process would be more difficult and costly than the usual method of felling. Special tackle would have to be got to detach the roots from the large trees and the actual severing of the trunk from the roots would cost a great deal more than if the timber were felled in the ordinary way.
I take it the Deputy's references do not apply to tree fellings under the control of the Forestry Branch, but to tree fellings by private individuals. My Department has no responsibility for the manner in which timber merchants or private users conduct their felling operations outside State forest lands, but the general practice in the Department's forests is as I have already indicated, and I would like to see that practice followed generally in the country because it is true that large stumps are unsightly. The Deputy also inquired what was the total number of trees planted last year. On the 6,000 acres that were planted last year the number of trees was over 15,000,000.
Deputy Cosgrave also asked whether we could not grow resinous pines in this country. I am advised that resin production and flow depend mainly on the amount of sunlight, which is much less here than in the South of France, Spain or Portugal. The pine species grown in these countries for resin production can be grown in this country only with great difficulty, but in a plantation in County Wexford, where 386 acres of sandhills were planted, a good deal of this particular pine species was used and in the course of time, no doubt, we shall be able to estimate whether the production of this species is possible and economic.
Deputy Doyle deprecated the loss and damage that is caused by fires to tree plantations, and suggested greater precautions. During the year 1940-41, 35 fires occurred on the Department's lands. Of these 14 were got under control without any damage being done. Slight damage was done in 15 other cases involving a few trees, or less than one acre of plantation. The remaining six fires resulted in the destruction of 213 acres, one fire alone destroying over 130 acres. The estimated damage was less than £1,000. The figures compare with 55 fires in the previous year, 17 of which caused damage involving 1,110 acres. We had five times as much damage in the preceding year. Fire protection methods have been developed recently and greater precautions are being taken to avoid and to deal with damage. During the year 125 acres of burnt plantations were replanted and this item was not included in the normal planting programme.
While the forestry division have to face loss and damage from fire every year, we are fortunate that our losses are not proportionately as heavy as in those countries where timber is normally grown. I have had appeals made through the broadcasting service and in the public Press warning people of the dangers of fire in forest areas from carelessneses on the part of smokers and picnic parties and persons burning gorse and whins in the neighbourhood of forests. Prosecutions are regularly instituted against offending parties. There are also warning notices against the dangers of fire placed in conspicuous places on State forest lands. Notwithstanding all these precautions, however, fires occur —sometimes, I regret to say, from the operations of mischievous youths.
Since the dangers of fire are obvious for all to see, I hope that they should in themselves be a sufficient safeguard, but I fear that we shall always have to contend with some damage from fire. The occasions on which prompt and effective action against the spread of fire was not taken locally are, I am glad to say, rare. On the other hand, there have unfortunately been cases where more prompt action to prevent the spread of fire would have saved the State considerable loss. One would expect that, normally, people attending a football match or a hurling match and seeing a fire break out on a forest nearby would at least have sufficient civic spirit to leave the match in order to put out the fire. However, I can only hope that these cases are the exception although, unfortunately, we have had some. Our general experience has been that the local people, the members of the Gárda Síochána and the military forces have rendered very valuable assistance in restricting the area of the damage to forests where fires have occurred.
