It is proposed to take the order of business, as on the Order Paper: Nos. 1, 5, 6, and then Nos. 2, 3 and 4.
Order of Business.
Would the Minister kindly say when it is proposed to take No. 11?
It is possible that it will be taken to-morrow, but, if not, early next week.
Might I ask whether the Minister hopes to get all stages through before Christmas?
Through the Dáil, yes.
Does the Minister propose to take No. 11—Children's Allowances Bill—before No. 9—Vocational Education (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill?
A great deal will depend on the progress of business to-day. I hope to get the Second Stage of the Children's Allowances Bill through at an early stage because, as I am sure Deputies will realise, it would be a good thing to avoid any unnecessary delay in connection with a Bill of this kind; but, clearly, it is desirable that a certain period should be allowed between the Second Reading and the Committee Stage of the Bill so as to enable Deputies to prepare amendments. Therefore, it would be better to have the Second Reading agreed to as soon as possible.
If, then, it should be possible to come to some arrangement with the Whips to-night, we could see whether No. 11 should be taken to-morrow, and disposed of, and then arrange for taking No. 9?
Yes, we hope so.
With a view to securing an effective debate on the Vote for the Department of the Taoiseach, I suggested a week ago that the main subject for debate might be an amalgamation of some of the notices handed in, namely: "The present cost of living and its effect on the economic position of people dependent on low wages or social service payments"; and, allied to it: "The social policy of the Government." I understand that the majority of the House agree with that suggestion.
While admitting at once, Sir, that the majority of the House would agree with the lines laid down by you with regard to the conduct of this debate, I take it that you admit that it is the right of every Deputy in this House to speak on all matters connected with the Department of the Taoiseach?
I am scrupulous as to the rights of Deputies, but I asked for the above notice a fortnight ago and, again, a week ago, and I have received no intimation from the Deputy as to what points he wishes to raise.
I am just making a general representation as to the broad question of freedom of speech in this House.
That is a very wide question. Notice of any important matter to be raised on a Vote of this kind should be given, but I have not received any from the Deputy. Suppose there were ten Independent Deputies who gave notice of ten divergent subjects for discussion. If each of them spoke, even admitting that some subjects dovetailed, the debate would be unwieldy and ineffective.
I admit that, Sir, but there is a certain danger here. So long as there is goodwill and agreement between all Parties, then everything in the garden looks lovely, but I can see this kind of thing being used in 10 years' time by the Taoiseach's successor to say that certain things cannot be discussed, and so on; and I submit that, within the limits of relevance, each individual Deputy is entitled to be allowed to discuss, through you, Sir, whatever he wants to discuss, and not necessarily what the Taoiseach wants to have discussed, which is a very different thing.
The Deputy may rest assured that the Chair would not accept any such suggestion. My predecessor did not do so and I am confident that my successor will not do so.
I agree, Sir. It is good to get that on the record as well as some of the other things put on the record.