asked the Minister for Local Government and Public Health whether he is aware that certain benevolent societies make purely ex gratia allowances to indigent widows and whether he will take such steps as may be necessary to ensure that such ex gratia grants will not be assessed as means for the purposes of the Widows' and Orphans' Pensions Acts.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Assessment of Widows' Pensions.
Ex gratia allowances made by benevolent societies to widows entitled to claim pensions under the Widows' and Orphans' Pensions Acts do not affect the rates of contributory pensions under the Acts.
Non - contributory pensions are granted subject to means test. In determining the income of a claimant for such pension the Acts provide that voluntary payments are taken into account only in so far as they exceed £6 10s. per annum.
All non - contributory pension schemes are based on the test of necessity, and, accordingly, all cash income from whatever source (subject to statutory exemption) must be taken into account. It was never intended that non-contributory pensions should be given to persons who are in receipt of incomes from other sources except to such extent as would comply with the statutory test of necessity. If voluntary allowances were to be excluded from the calculation of means in such cases the position would be entirely anomalous as the same rate of assistance would apply to many persons in different degrees of need.
It is not proposed to amend the Acts to exclude in full such ex gratia payments.
Does the Parliamentary Secretary realise, in the case of a widow in receipt of a widow's pension, who secured as a result of the herculean efforts of her friends a grant of £32 a year from a British society for the relief of elderly ladies, that on the receipt of the £32 from the society in London she was informed that her non-contributory pension was cancelled by the Government in Dublin? Does he not think that a very anomalous and undesirable situation?
The position is as I have said that any scheme of social assistance must have attached to it a means test.
I deny that absolutely. The children's allowances have none.
If the voluntary allowances were to be excluded from the calculations of means, the position would be entirely anomalous. It would be most inequitable to allow one widow to earn a considerable amount from casual work and have the proper means test applied, and not have some discriminatory effect produced in the case of a widow who receives assistance in the form of charitable allowance.
A distinction should be drawn between the income enjoyed by a widow in receipt of a contributory pension under which she has a claim under contract enforceable at law, and income derived from a purely voluntary gift which may be suspended at any moment at the will of the donor, because the only effect of having such voluntary gifts recognised as income for the purpose of this Act is to ensure that such voluntary gifts will be suspended. The benevolent bodies will not give voluntary gifts if the only result of doing so is to relieve this State of its obligation under the Widows' Pensions Acts. What is actually happening is——
The Deputy is now making a speech.
Will the Parliamentary Secretary make a distinction between voluntary gifts which may be withdrawn at the option of the donor, and the income which a widow can claim under contract or by law?
No.
All the voluntary grants will stop then.