On Wednesday last I addressed a question to the Minister for Agriculture in the following terms:—
"To ask the Minister for Agriculture if he will state: (a) whether any of the continental countries now purchasing cattle here have indicated their intention of making imports of Irish cattle a permanent feature of their economy; (b) to what extent the present continental trade is likely to become permanent; and (c) whether any discussions took place, at any time, between the British Ministry of Agriculture and his Department regarding the question of live-stock exports to the Continent, the resultant reduction in exports of forward stores to Britain, its effect on British live-stock economy and on the future of our live-stock trade with Britain."
That question was tabled before a statement was made by the chairman of the Cattle Traders' Association, which aroused a good deal of public interest in the last few days. I do not agree with the statement made by the chairman of that organisation. I do not object to this country sending a gift to the Continent to help the distressed people there. I think we should feel there is an obligation on us to do everything we can do in that respect.
So far as exports recently were concerned, as a farmer I welcome any competition that is there. God knows, the people who feed cattle over the winter have rarely got a margin of profit out of it. They were more interested in producing good farmyard manure, and it is only occasionally, if they were interested in costings, that they would discover they had a margin over and above what that particular residue was worth. I am particularly interested in competition. It is a stimulus to production. But the competition to be sound and healthy ought to be of a permanent nature. We talk a lot about stability and we ought to have stability in our agricultural policy. The necessary prerequisite to increased production in an expanding economy is a secure market. The Minister's reply to my question was as follows:—
"As regards the first and second parts of the question, exports of cattle to continental countries are arranged seasonally through the diplomatic or consular representatives in Ireland of the countries concerned and no long-term arrangements for export have been made. I cannot predict the extent to which this trade may continue in the future. As regards the last part of the question, no discussions of the kind referred to by the Deputy took place between the British Ministry of Agriculture and my Department."
It appears to me, from that reply, that the Minister and the Department are not concerned with a long-term view of this question of marketing and at this particular stage I think it is of the utmost importance that we should clearly understand what the position is likely to be in the next few years. It is pretty fashionable that we should do that.
Most other countries are making long-term trade deals to ensure that their future markets are assured. As a matter of fact, Holland recently made an announcement about her economic position and probable development. There is an indication of what they have been doing to re-establish different industries. It is indicated that within 12 months their steel industries will be all right and in three years their agriculture will be all right. We know that Canada has made a long-term deal on wheat for the next four years and that they accepted a lower price on the four years' deal than they would get in a free market for wheat. We know the Argentine Government is concluding negotiations with Great Britain for a long-term trade deal on meat.
The Minister's reply clearly indicates that we are not concerned with long-term deals of any sort. We are simply availing of the opportunities that are there at the moment, owing to the shortage of meat all over Europe. It is true that the primary producer is getting the benefit and cattle fed this winter are leaving reasonable margins of profit. We have sent something like 23,000 cattle to the Continent in recent months and it is proposed to can 25,000 animals to be sent as a gift to the Continent. It has been suggested by the cattle traders that it is unwise to do that. I feel myself that if the activities of the canners are confined to a particular type of animal, they may be very helpful to the small farmers of the west and in the Border counties to produce a type of animal that is not suitable for the forward store trade of Great Britain. The canning of these animals will help the people who have been receiving poor prices for cattle which had to go to the British Minister of Food. An attempt was made to obtain an increased price for the small quantity of beef that we sent to the British Ministry of Food—we sent something like 14,000 animals last year—and it was increased by 1d. per lb. The British Minister of Food in reply to a question in the British House of Commons said that it was only second-class meat. I felt at the time that if it was second-class meat, he was offering us a third-class price. The canning of these animals, I feel, enables the people who produce that type of animal to get a decent price for their beef.
I want to make it clear that I do not think any damage has been done so far by the taking of these animals for the Continent, but if the Minister is satisfied that there is no future in the continental trade—and it appears to me that there is no future—we want to be assured that whatever animals may be taken for the Continent in the next two or three years will not have any injurious effects on the future of our live-stock trade with Britain. I want to make it clear that there is a very large number of farmers in Britain who have based their live-stock economy on Irish stores and who swear by them. They felt that the Irish store was the very finest in the world to buy, cattle up to 11½ cwt. or 12 cwt. when leaving this country. The English farmers were prepared to carry these up to the peak of the market and, incidentally, to hold them for the minimum period to qualify for a subsidy. It does not follow that they took a big margin because the competition in recent years for animals of that type, particularly from Norfolk, has been very keen. It would be a pity if the men who believed in that economy were forced away from Irish stores. If that happened, they might be forced to adopt a different policy and to breed their own cattle. If they once bred their own cattle, and if in three or four years the continental trade disappeared, they might not be prepared to switch back to Irish cattle again.
It is true that at present most British farmers are reluctant to raise young cattle because the price of milk is very attractive and the demand for liquid milk is so big that they prefer to sell milk for human consumption. Our people here are not in that position. The demand for milk is not so great in many areas and our farmers must direct their attention to live-stock production and the rearing of animals. I have always felt that that situation gave this country a golden opportunity of integrating our live-stock conditions here with the live-stock conditions existing on the other side, remembering the good name which Irish stores have in Great Britain. We must remember that over a year ago the British Department of Agriculture were switching the agricultural community over to live-stock production. They felt that the cereal problem was over but their anticipations were rather premature. The cereal difficulty was not over and they had to switch back to wheat again last year. I believe that the cereal problem will be cleared up after the next world harvest and that you will see Great Britain again devoting all its agricultural efforts towards live-stock production. They appreciate that the world has always been very short of protective foods of a high value and that their climatic and soil conditions equipped them in a special way for the production of protective foods. We have the same conditions prevailing here. Notwithstanding artificial intervention by particular Parties or particular Ministers, we are equipped in a special way for the raising of live stock. Now is the time to consolidate that position; now is the time to integrate live-stock conditions here with those obtaining in Britain.
We must appreciate that even in the Agriculture Bill, at present passing through the British House of Commons, the British people anticipate that they must, because of their difficult financial position, rely much more on their own economy. They will have to intensify agricultural production. These are circumstances leading to the creation of a favourable atmosphere for action such as I suggest, if the case is properly presented to the responsible British Minister.
Sometimes agricultural experts suggest that it is regrettable that we have to export store cattle. They point out that it takes a great deal of calcium and phosphates to build up cattle, but if the policy were adopted of selling independently of the British live-stock trade we would probably be put into the same category as the Argentine. I feel that the particular economy now in operation under which there is a certain interrelation between our live-stock trade and that of Britain is one that should be consolidated. It is the most desirable form of live-stock economy, one that is suitable to both countries. We are selling to-day in a seller's market, but we are not looking forward to a long-term deal as we should. The time is opportune now. The time to make a deal is when the market is favourable to the seller. We ought to make that deal now. I asked the Minister about the continental trade and he was not able to tell me whether there is a future for it. I do not believe there is a future for it. If they were interested in our live-stock industry as a permanent trade, they would have been able to buy our stock during the economic war. There was no one to offer a price for our cattle at that time.
