I should like to second this motion. We had hoped that the Minister would have introduced his proposals before this. He put the Bill on the Order Paper before the recess, and we were led to believe that in a short time the House would have the Bill in hands and that we would know what the Minister's proposals were.
The question of extending the work of afforestation in the congested counties has been occupying our attention on this side of the House for some time. I am in the position that I am familiar with the difficulties and the case that can be made that a certain procedure has to be followed and certain matters observed in the acquisition of land and in proceeding with the afforestation programme generally. There is a general feeling, not confined to this side of the House, that more energetic steps ought to be taken to develop afforestation. Deputies who hold that view feel that the afforestation programme provides some solution, perhaps not a complete solution, to the question of unemployment and the solution of the emigration problem.
There arises also the question of the exhaustion of peat resources during the coming generation. Both from the short-term point of view, as regards the giving of employment and the providing of opportunities in the West, and from the long-term point of view of building up our national resources as far as possible, we ought to ensure that, when a shortage of our peat resources occur, the people of the West, who depend to such a large extent on it for fuel, will have an alternative which will make up to some extent for any shortage of turf.
In following Deputy Blaney, I have only to say that Deputies representing western constituencies know that the progress of land acquisition has been very slow in certain areas. Even in those areas, where some advances have been made and a good deal of progress recorded, the vexed question of commonages arises. In counties like Mayo, Roscommon and Galway the intake of land is very far short of requirements, if we are to make any substantial advances in the provision of employment.
When Mr. Cameron wrote his report on the development of afforestation, he emphasised that in order to make forestry work really profitable and economical the blocks of afforested land should be up to 3,000 or 4,000 acres in extent. In fact, even in the oldest established forest in this country, we scarcely reach those figures, although we are there for more than 30 years. Efforts have been made for a great part of that time to build them up further. It is suggested by those who have an intimate knowledge of counties like Mayo that the difficulties arising in acquiring commonages are in great part the cause of the slowness in regard to acquisition. I know that Deputy Moran, who, is unfortunately absent as he did not expect the motion to come forward this evening, has a great deal of experience in the matter and believes that large numbers of holdings have become practically derelict, the greater number of the owners being in America.
If not, they are being let year after year for a long period of years. The question arises as to whether that state of affairs is to be allowed to continue or whether steps should not be taken, without any injury to the rights of the owners, who probably are not in this country at all, to devise means by which lands which are either derelict or being let year after year should be made available to the acquisition branch of the Forestry Department.
The Minister has the advantage of the liaison that exists with the Irish Land Commission and the experience they have had in framing legislation of the type whereby tenants were given the benefits of the vesting of their holdings, although the actual legal vesting of the land in the tenants did not take place for some time afterwards. It should be possible to enable the Forestry Division to go ahead with the acquisition of lands which are not being used for agricultural purposes, and in whose development otherwise there is no great interest. It should be possible to devise means whereby the rights of those people would not be made void, but whereby the Land Commission of the Forestry Branch would go ahead and acquire the lands and start the work which the House and the country expect them to do in these areas.
I mentioned in the debates on the annual Estimates that there should be a more detailed survey made of these areas. In the West of Ireland, there are areas like Slieveaugty where there are some plantations and valuable stands for timber at the present time; areas like Tourmakeady-Leenane, and the Ox Mountains where it seemed to be possible to acquire land, if the will and anxiety that exists on the part of all Parties in the House could be translated into action through the policy of the Government and the operations of the Forestry Branch, particularly the acquisition officers.
Apart from the question of employment and the question of providing a reserve of fuel, there is also the question of the future of afforestation work when the timber now planted matures. Whether one regards it from the point of view of the planting operations, or the thinning operations, or the felling operations and the possibility of the establishment of a pulp industry in due course, one realises that the larger the areas that can be dealt with, the better, particularly now that we are depending on mechanical means for drainage and preparation of these inferior lands on which the Forestry Branch has largely to depend. It seems clear that, if we are to make the fullest use of that machinery, we should endeavour to have much larger areas to work on.
During my time in the Department, I found that year by year the average acreage per transaction for the acquisition of land was declining. That was because we were depending on the acquisition of isolated mountain holdings. As I have said before in this House, the acquisition of a holding of 30 or 40 acres was just as troublesome, in the amount of the inspectors' time involved and from the point of view of legal procedure, as the acquisition of an estate of some thousands of acres. It was with a realisation of the difficulty of making progress if we were to continue along that line that I suggested a systematic survey of those areas which, in my view, are very important from the point of view of afforestation. Of course, they are not confined to the West. There are areas like the Devil's Bit, for example, and there are areas in Donegal and Leitrim where there seemed to be greater willingness to meet the acquisition officers and to come to terms. In fact, Donegal and Leitrim were entitled, from what I have seen, to a high priority in the attention that should be given by the Forestry Branch to particular areas. It seemed as if progress was being made, as if it was not too difficult to come to terms with mountain or other tenants in those areas.
Even if the legislation which the Minister proposes deals with the question of title in some such manner as he has indicated, more will be necessary. Therefore, I suggested that, in addition to the survey of lands that are said to be available and the Plantable Survey, these areas should be zoned or scheduled and mentioned in the legislation as being areas which, in the opinion of the State and of the Executive, are potential forest lands. That would mean that the attention of the Minister and of the Forestry Branch would necessarily have to be directed to those particular areas.
At the present time, it must be confessed, the work of the Forestry Branch is made very difficult, if not impossible, by the fact that their activities are spread over such a large number of comparitively small centres, and, furthermore, that the searches for land have to be in the nature of hit and miss, rather too haphazard. The principle of compulsory acquisition does not seem to commend itself to the House. The Plantable Survey is quoted extensively, without due regard to the fact that the figure mentioned of 1,250,000 acres, or whatever it may have been, was the result of a rather rough survey of possible forest land and was not based on any close examination or research, parish by parish, of lands that might come into the hands of the Forestry Branch. It was simply a general survey as to the possibilities.
When the agricultural position of the country was discussed in former years, we generally spoke of 12,000,000 acres of arable land, but, if my memory serves me aright, when the compulsory tillage regulations were in operation, it was found that, in the best view of the Department of Agriculture, in face of the emergency, we had to take a lower figure of something in the nature of 10,000,000 acres of arable land.
In the same way if we come down to an exact appreciation of the situation, so far as land available for forestry in the different districts is concerned, having regard to the fact that lands that heretofore were not considered even potentially arable are now being made arable through the operations of the land project and through the work of the farming community, it seems to me that there is bound to be a reduction in these figures.
The Plantable Survey presumably included a great deal of mountain land that on close examination might be considered to be entirely uneconomic and unplantable. In the newspapers to-day, there is a letter from a legal gentleman in the West of Ireland stating that of a fairly large parcel of mountain land, which he was able to offer the Forestry Branch, they considered that only a comparatively small proportion of it was plantable or economic from their point of view.
All these factors must be taken into consideration. As I have said, the Plantable Survey was not done parish by parish or in a very close way from the point of view of examining in each district the actual possibilities. A great deal of the land mentioned therein might be of the type the Forestry Branch are refusing every day or which, when they do take it over as part of a large block, find that up to 20 per cent. is unplantable.
It is for that reason I would again ask the Minister to consider my suggestion of scheduling these areas where we know there are large tracts of land, and of considering asking the Forestry Branch to devote special attention to them in order that in the next 15 or 20 years comparatively large forests may be built up. I think it will be necessary to do that whatever amending legislation the Minister may propose in regard to the title of commonages or title of those isolated mountain holdings which are giving such a great deal of trouble at the present time.