Vol. 174 No. 13
asked the Minister for Justice why the Parochial House at Lusmagh, Banagher, County Offaly, residence of Very Reverend John Fahy, P.P., was raided by a large force of Gardaí on the 5th instant; what evidence was adduced to justify the raid; and further, if he is aware of public uneasiness as a result of the raid.
18.
asked the Minister for Justice if it was a decision of the Government to instruct Gardaí to raid the Parochial House, Lusmagh, Banagher, County Offaly; what prompted this action; and if what was sought was found.
With the permission of the Ceann Comhairle I propose to take Questions 17 and 18 together. Father Fahy's house was visited by the Garda Síochána because they had information confirming reports widely circulating in the locality that men whose escape from lawful custody had been effected by force were being harboured there. I take full responsibility for what was done.
Might I ask the Minister whether he does not consider that, if it were necessary to raid the Parochial House, the day time was the time to raid it, and not between dawn and morning, with a large force of detectives and uniformed police from Dublin? Would the Minister not agree that, if it were necessary to search Father Fahy's house, the day time was the time to do so, and not when Father Fahy and his aged housekeeper had retired?
I would agree if it were possible to carry out a raid in day time, but the considerations which had to be seriously given thought to were that these people were there and, if there was any delay, that they might have gone. In the event, that is what it turned out to be, perhaps because we did not deal with it more swiftly than we did. The actual position is that the raid was carried out with the utmost courtesy. The parish priest himself conducted the Chief Superintendent from room to room, and everything was considered, from the parish priest's point of view and from the Chief Superintendent's point of view, as being highly satisfactory.
Why could not this be done at 10 o'clock in the day?
May I ask the Minister a further question? There is a large issue involved. May I inquire, with the Ceann Comhairle's permission, did not experienced Garda Officers recommend against this raid to the Minister's Department and——
That is completely untrue.
Is it not a fact that this raid was decided upon by civil servants and politicians?
That is a matter which does not arise.
May I ask the Minister for Justice does he allege, as he appeared to allege a moment ago, that these men were previously in that premises? I understood him so to allege a moment ago. Secondly, will he tell us exactly why it was not possible, if the circumstances so required it, to throw a cordon of Gardaí around these premises in darkness and then, having cordoned them off, could they not raid in an ordinary manner, at a suitable hour of the morning?
It was not carried out exactly as the Deputy seems to suggest. The raid, as it has been described by Deputy O.J. Flanagan in his question, was carried out, as I said, with the utmost courtesy. It was necessary to bring a force of Gardaí to ensure the arrest of these individuals, should they have been there. There was no question whatever of force being used. The Chief Superintendent knocked at the door and he got an answer, almost immediately from the parish priest, who came down, opened the door and conducted the Chief Superintendent through the premises. If there was anything that the Deputy can describe as a cordon around the place it was, perhaps, for the purpose of ensuring there would be no escape from the house.
The Minister has completely misunderstood. I asked two questions. First, I gathered from what the Minister said a second ago that he now alleges these men had been on the premises of Father Fahy. Did I gather that the Minister clearly so alleged? Secondly, would it not have been a better method of dealing with the situation, if the Government felt this house had to be raided, that a cordon would be put around it in darkness and the raid itself carried out at a normal hour of the morning, 9 o'clock or 10 o'clock? If the men had been present and that had been done they could not have got away.
I did not allege anything. I had not the information; it was the police had the information and it was the police who acted on that information.
A few moments ago I thought the Minister alleged the men had been in this house. Do I understand that was incorrect and he does not so allege?
I am stating what I know to be the facts. The police had information that these particular persons were on the premises and for that reason they raided them.
It now appears the information was wrong.
Will the Minister agree this was the first occasion on which a parochial house was raided since the Black and Tans raided Bishop Fogarty's House?
In 1929 your Government arrested him.
With your permission, a Cheann Comhairle, I would like to raise this matter on the adjournment.
I shall communicate with the Deputy in the course of the evening.
