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Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Thursday, 9 Jun 1960

Vol. 182 No. 7

Committee on Finance. - Vóta 45—Roinn na Gaeltachta.

Tairgim:—

Go ndeonfar suim nach mó ná £367,730 chun slánuithe na suime is gá chun íoctha an mhuirir a thiocfas chun bheith iníoctha i rith na bliana dar críoch an 31ú lá de Mhárta, 1961, le haghaidh Tuarastal agus Costas Roinn na Gaeltachta maille le deontais le haghaidh Tithe agus Ildeontais-i-gCabhair.

Taispeánann an Meastachán don bhliain seo méadú de £40,120 glan ar an soláthar a rinneadh don bhliain seo caite. Sé an chúis is mó atá leis an ardú sin ná méadú de £59,850 a bheith sa soláthar le haghaidh Tithe Gaeltachta agus méaduithe de £13,805 in iomlán sa soláthar le haghaidh seirbhísí cultúrtha, coláistí Gaeilge agus scoláireachtaí saoire agus scoile sa Ghaeltacht. Ina gcoinne sin cuirtear sábhála de £33,500 in iomlán sa soláthar le haghaidh scéimeanna feabhsúcháin sa Ghaeltacht, an deontas-i- gcabhair do Ghaeltarra Éireann agus an deontas £5.

Taispeánann an Meastachán sábhála freisin sa soláthar le haghaidh tuarastal, costaisí taistil agus costaisí teagmhasacha, torthaí mara agus cúnaimh teicniúil ach baineann an t-iomlán atá i gceist ansin, £39,280, go díreach leis an laghdú de £39,345 san iomlán a bheas le fáil mar leithreasa-i-gcabhair mar a mhíneoidh mé níos déanaí agus mé ag caint ar na fo-mhírchinn ar leith.

Tagann an tsábháil ar thuarastail, pá agus liúntais, go formhór de bharr foireann teicniúil na dtionscal tuaithe a aistriú go seirbhís Ghaeltarra Éireann tar éis don Bhord Scéim Aoisliúntas a dhéanamh dá oifigigh agus seirbhísigh faoi réir an Achta um Thionscail na Gaeltachta, 1957. Leagadh an Scéim sin faoi bhráid gach Tí den Oireachtas ag deireadh mí Iúil seo caite agus le linn Lúnasa agus Meán Fómhair haistríodh na bainistreása agus teicneóirí eile nár Stát-seirbhisigh bhunaithe iad chuig seirbhís an Bhoird. Bhí soláthar de £15,000 le haghaidh tuarastal na nOifigeach sin i Vóta na bliana seo caite agus sábhálfar é sin i mbliana. Ar an taobh eile dhe, áfach, bhí soláthar ann an bhliain seo caite chun an £15,000 sin a aisghnóthú ó Ghaeltaira Éireann agus é a ghlacadh chun creidis an Vóta mar leithreasa-i-gcabhair. Ní bheidh a chomh-mhéid le fáil mar leithreasa-i-gcabhair i mbliana.

Tá sábháil freisin ar thuarastail i mbliana toisc an obair a bhain le bailiú na dtorthaí mara d'aistriú chun cúram an ghnóluchta, Arramara Teoranta, le feidhm ón gcéad lá de Dheireadh Fómhair seo caite. Do haistríodh chun seirbhíse an ghnólachta freisin na hOifigigh neamh-bhunaithe a bhí ar fhoirinn mo Roinne chun an obair bhailiúcháin sin a mhaoirsiú agus de thoradh a n-aistrithe sin beidh sábháil i mbliana ar thuarastail agus freisin ar chostais taistil agus costais teaghmhasacha a bhain lena ndualgais mhaoirseoireachta.

Go dtí gur aistríodh obair bhailiúcháin na dTorthaí Mara chun cúram Arramara Teoranta bhí soláthar i Vóta na Roinne chun na slataí mara agus cineálacha eile feamainne a cheannach agus soláthar ann freisin chun an t-airgead a faightí ar a ndíol a ghlacadh chun creidis mar leithreasa-i-gcabhair. Sábhálfar an costas ceannacháin feasta ach ar an taobh eile dhe beidh ísliú ar an bhfáltas mar leithreasa-i-gcabhair. Chífear gur beag an difríocht atá idir an t-iomlán a fuarthas anuraidh ar na Torthaí Mara a dhíol sé sin £19,168 agus an t-iomlán de £19,078 a sábháilfear ar na slataí mara agus feamainne a cheannach sé sin, £15,145, agus na sábhála a bheas ar thuarastail sé sin, £1,720, costais taistil sé sin, £2,063, agus costais teagmhasacha £150.

Moltar soláthar de £100,000 a dhéanamh i mbliana mar dheontas-i-gcabhair do Ghaeltarra Éireann. Tá ísliú ansin de £10,000 ar an soláthar a rinneadh an bhliain seo caite ach mar a tharla ní raibh an soláthar iomlán ag teastáil ón mBord anuraidh agus níor ghá ach £85,000 a chur ar fáil dó mar dheontas-i-gcabhair.

I rith na bliana seo caite bhí 1,345 daoine fostaithe i gceantair na n-ionad tionscail — fir tuairim is an ceathrú chuid díobh. Bhí timpeall leath an líon oibritheoirí sin ar fostú lán-ama sna hionaid oibre agus an leath eile ar fostú páirt-ama ina dtithe féin. Tháinig forbairt ar an tionscal láimhchniotála i rith na bliana seo caite agus bhí gá le tuilleadh oibritheoirí d'fhostú. San iomlán bhí céad duine níos mó fostaithe ag an mBord ná mar a bhí sa bhliain roimhe sin. Dá bharr sin agus de bharr méadaithe sna rátaí pé i gcásanna áirithe do híocadh £27,795 níos mó mar phá ná an méid a híocadh, sé sin, £149,365, sa bhliain roimhe sin.

Díoladh luach níos mó ná leathmhilliún punt earraí sa bhliain. B'ionann, nach mór, an díol sa Stát an díol ann sa bhliain roimhe sin, ach thit luach na ndíolachán thar lear. Tuigim go bhfuil an Bord tar éis suirbhéireacht a dhéanamh anois ar na margaí thar lear agus socraithe nua déanta acu chun díolacháin a spreagadh i dtíortha áirithe. Tá a fhios agam go dtuigeann an Bord a thábhachtaí atá sé san am i láthair go n-onnmhuireofaí oiread earraí agus is féidir agus tá gach dóchas agam go n-éireoidh leo san iarracht atá á dhéanamh acu chuige sin.

Faoi Fho-Mhírcheann E deantar soláthar le haghaidh deontas faoi Achtanna na dTithe (Gaeltacht). Sa bhliain airgeadais 1959/60 críochnaíodh 153 tithe nua, feabhsaíodh 199 tithe, cuireadh saoráidí sláintíochta i 78 tithe agus rinneadh méadú speisialta ar 5 tithe.

Thainig méadú arís ar an gcaiteachas faoi na hAchtanna ó £78,000 i 1958/59 go tuairim is £85,000 i 1959/60. Meastar go dtiocfaidh méadú arís ar an obair sa bhliain airgeadais seo de bharr an Achta nua a ritheadh anuraidh agus gur gá £150,000 a sholáthar chuige i mbliana.

Cuireadh tús le hobair in i bhfad níos mó cásanna i rith na bliana seo caite. Ceadaíodh deontais de luach timpeall £140,000 i dtuairim 900 cásanna i gcomparáid le deontais de luach £54,000 i 413 cásanna sa bhliain airgeadais roimhe sin.

Ó ritheadh an tAcht nua i mí Iúil, 1959 tá méadú mór tagtha ar líon na n-iarratas. Fritheadh ós cionn 1,500 iarratais i 1959/60 i gcomparáid le tuairim 850 i 1958/9. Nuair a cuimhnítear go dtógann sé dhá bhliain de ghnáth ón dáta a ceadaítear cás go dtí go n-íoctar an tráthchuid deireannach den deontas, tá sé soiléir gur sa bhliain reatha agus sa bhliain seo chugainn a bheidh an chuid is mó den airgead, a bhainfidh leis na hiarratais sin, le n-íoc. Mar is eol do na Teachtaí, méadaíodh na deontais tógála, na deontais feabhsúcháin agus na deontais sláintíochta san Acht nua agus tá cosúlacht ann go mbainfidh muintir na Gaeltachta mórán tairbhe as na deontaisí nua.

Tá sé ro-luath fós a rá cé mar a néiróidh leis an iarracht atá á dhéanamh trí na deontais i leith méadaithe speisialta, seallaí saoire agus brúnna ach tá dóchas agam, as na figiúirí atá agam go dtí seo, go n-éireoidh go maith leis. Fritheadh 10 iarratais faoi Scéim na mBrúnna, 30 faoi Scéim na seallaí saoire agus 73 ar dheontais i leith méadaithe speisialta suas go deireadh Márta seo caite agus tá cosúlacht ann go dtiocfaidh méadú mór ar líon na n-iarratas sin i rith na bliana seo. Dar ndóigh is rudaí nua ar fad Scéim na mBrúnna agus Scéim na seallaí saoire agus tógfaidh sé tamall sara mbeidh na scéimeanna sin faoi lán-tseol. Ach táim cinnte go rachaidh siad chun mór-thairbhe do mhuintir na Gaeltachta má bhaineann na daoine feidhm cheart iomlán astu.

Tá gnólachtaí sa tír atá in ann seallaí réamh-dhéanta lena nglacfaidh an Roinn a sholáthar ar phraghasanna réasúnta nó, más fearr leis na hiarratasóirí iad, tá pleananna ullmhaithe ag an Roinn le seallaí saoire a thógáil ar an ngnáth-nós. Is gnó é seo inar féidir leis na Teachtaí a bhfuil aon bhaint acu leis an nGaeltacht cabhair a thabhairt trí na daoine a spreagadh i ngach slí is féidir chun na deontais a úsáid ar mhaithe leo féin.

Is as Fó-mhírcheann F a cuirfear an t-airgead ar fáil le haghaidh scéimeanna feabhsúcháin na Roinne i mbliana. Fé mar a míníodh i ndáil le Meastachán na bliana seo caite, tá na húdaráis áitiúla agus muintir na Gaeltachta ag dul i dtaithí na scéimeanna sin do réir a chéile. Tháinig méadú arís sa bhliain 1959/60 ar an éileamh ortha. I gcás na scéimeanna uisce-sholáthair, mar shampla, tugadh 40% breise amach i bhfoirm deontaisí sa bhliain 1959/60 i gcomparáid leis an mbliain roimhe sin. Cé gur méadú mór é sin níl sé in aon ghaor de bheith chomh mór leis an méadú a rabhthas ag súil leis ag féachaint do no meastacháin a chuir na húdaráis áitiúla ar fáil roimhré. Maidir leis an leathnú atá á dhéanamh ar scéim na dtithe gloine, níorbh fhéidir an scéim a chríochnú laistigh den bhliain airgeadais 1959/60 amhail mar a measadh a déanfaí agus, cé go raibh an scéim leathnúcháin faoi lán-tseol i gConamara agus i dTuar Mhic Éadaigh um dheireadh na bliana sin, fágadh timpeall £34,000 den tsoláthar £53,000 a bhí i Vóta na Roinne chun na críche sin gan caitheamh toisc nach rabhthas ullamh chun na híocaíochta d'údarú. Bhain an deacracht chéanna le roinnt scéimeanna beaga eile ar cuireadh airgead i leataoibh dóibh ach nár éirigh leis na heagrais a raibh baint acu leo iad a chur i gcrích laistigh den bhliain airgeadais amhail mar a mheasadar a dhéanfaidís.

Dá dhroim sin uile, fágadh £80,000 gan caitheamh sa bhliain 1959/60 as an £170,000 a cuireadh ar fáil le haghaidh na Scéimeanna Feabhsúcháin.

Ag féachaint don éileamh atá ar scéimeanna feabhsúcháin na Roinne, más ea, agus don éiginteacht a ghabhann leis na meastacháin a cuirtear ar fáil ina leith, meastar, de dhroim na taithí a bhí ag an Roinn ar na cúrsaí seo le cúpla bliain anuas, gur leor suim £150,000 d'fhonn riaradh ar riachtanaisí na Scéimeanna Feabhsúcháin sa bhliain 1960/61.

Fé mar is gnáthach i ndáil leis an Meastachán seo, bhéarfaidh mé cuntas gairid anois ar an obair atá ar siúl agus ar an dul chun chinn atá á dhéanamh faoi na scéimeanna feabhsúcháin. Is iad seo leanas na scéimeanna:—

Faoi Scéim na mBóithar, tugtar deontas, 100% den chostas, a cuirtear ar fáil trí Oifig na Scéimeanna Fostaíochta Speisialta, d'fhonn riaradh ar bhóithre áise, is é sin bóithre nach bhfuil freagracht reachtúil ar na húdaráis áitiúla ná ar éinne eile ina leith. Is é beartas na Roinne airgead na mbóthar faoin bhfo-mhírcheann seo a chaitheamh ar bhóithre den tsórt sin ó tharla nach bhfuil amhras ar bith ann ná go bhfuil géar-ghá le cúnamh airgid i gcás na mbóthar áise sa Ghaeltacht. Ní mór, ámh, cionúireacht bheag den tsoláthar a chur ar fáil, go ceann tréimhse teoranta, le haghaidh na mbóthar contae chun go bhféadfar críoch a chur le hoibreacha feabhsúcháin áirithe ar tosnaíodh orthu le blianta beaga anuas sarar socraíodh ar chaiteachas na Roinne a chúngú go dtí na bóithre áise. Faoi réir an choinníll sin, féadfar glacadh leis gur leis na bóithre áise amháin a bhainfidh deontaisí bóthair na Roinne chomh fada chun cinn agus is léir dúinn.

Tá dhá chineál deontais á dtabhairt ag an Roinn do na húdaráis áitiúla i leith scéimeanna uisce-sholáthair, deontas 50% — 60% i gcás caidéal agus mionscéimeanna píopaithe agus cumhachta, agus deontas 25% i gcás scéimeanna réigiúnacha. I gcás na scéimeanna réigiúnacha sin bíonn cabhair le fáil freisin ón Roinn Rialtais Áitiúil, is é sin cúnamh airgid i leith muirear aon iasachta a bheas á fháil ag na húdaráis áitiúla i ndáil leis na hoibreacha a bheas i gceist. Fé mar d'fhógair an tAire Rialtais Áitiúil tamall ó shoin, táthar tar éis an cúnamh sin a mhéadú ó 43.1/3 — 50% go dtí 60% de mhuirear na hiasachta. Nuair a cuirtear deontas na Roinne seo agus cúnamh airgid na Roinne Rialtais Áitiúil san áireamh i dteannta a chéile, más ea, chítear go bhfuil timpeall 70% de chostas na scéimeanna le fáil in aisce ag na húdaráis áitiúla i ndáil le tograí uisce-sholáthair a cuirtear i gcrích sa Ghaeltacht. Chítear dom gur cabhair an-mhór í sin agus gur cóir go mba leor í chun a chur ar chumas na núdarás áitiúla áird ar leith a thabhairt ar chás na Gaeltachta ó thaobh cúrsaí uisce-sholáthair. Tá dóchas agam go dtiocfaidh borradh dá réir ar na cúrsaí sna blianta amach anseo. Fé mar adúradh cheana tá cosúlacht ar an scéal go bhfuil an borradh sin ag tosnú cheana féin.

Faoi Scéim Mion-Oibreacha Mara, tugann an Roinn deontaisí lán-chostais i leith muir-oibreacha áirithe sa Ghaeltacht ar choinníoll go mbeidh na húdaráis áitiúla iomchuí sásta cothabháil na n-oibreacha sin a ghlacadh mar cúram orthu féin tar éis a ndéanta. Fágtar faoi Oifig na nOibreacha Poiblí, de ghnáth, tograí den tsórt sin a chur i gcrích. Sa bhliain seo caite caitheadh beagán ós cionn £4,000 ar an scéim seo ach, má éiríonn le hOifig na nOibreacha Poiblí clár oibre na bliana seo a comhlíonadh, meastar go mbeidh caiteachas £14,000 ann ar oibreacha éagsúla.

D'éirigh go maith le Scéim na Muc aris anuraidh: timpeall 50 cráin a tugadh amach. Tá ar intinn tuairim is 70 cráin a thabhairt amach sa bhliain airgeadais reatha agus táthar tar éis an scéim a leathnú go dtí Co. Chorcaighe agus Co. Phortláirge, is é sin le rá, go bhfuil feidhm ag an scéim anois ar fud na Gaeltachta uile.

Tá an obair faoi lán-tseol anois i ndáil le leathnú Scéim na dTithe Gloine, mar adúirt mé cheana. Tá teas á chur isteach i naoi gcinn déag de na sean-tithe i gCois Fharraige. Tá dhá cheann déag de thithe nua á dtógáil i dTuar Mhic Éadaigh. Ní bheidh a thuilleadh i gceist, ó tharla nach bhfuarthas dóthain iarrataisí chun go bhféadfaí aonad 20 teach a bhunú amhail mar a bhí ar intinn ag an Roinn. Tá fiche ceann nua eile á dtógáil i gCois Fharraige, agus tá súil agam go bhféadfaimíd gléas teasa a chur sna tithe nua sin uile roimh dheireadh na bliana airgeadais reatha. Comhairlítear dom gur fearr go mbeidh deis ag na fásadóirí nua teacht isteach ar an gcéird sara gcuirfear an teas ar fáil dóibh. Beidh costas tuairim £35,000 ag dul leis an scéim i mbliana.

Tá an Scéim chun cabhrú le meánscolaíocht sa Ghaeltacht ag dul ar aghaidh go sásúil agus is deimhin liom go dtiocfaidh mór-thairbhe don Ghaeltacht aistí sna blianta atá romhainn. Íocadh deontais de mhéid £8,300 i rith na bliana seo caite. Tá tuilleadh oibre faoin scéim ar siúl i láthair na huaire agus meastar go mbeadh suas le £15,000 ag teastáil chun riaradh ar riachtanais na scéime i mbliana.

Scéim nua i Scéim na Hallaí Siamsa trína gcuirtear deontaisí ar fáil suas go dtí 80% den chostas measta, faoi theorainn uasta de £5,000 i leith aon deontais áirithe, do choistí áitiúla chun hallaí a thógáil, a dheisiú nó a fheistiú. Leanfaidh an scéim i bhfeidhm go dtí an 31 Márta, 1965, agus cuirfidh an Roinn suas go dtí £10,000 in aghaidh na bliana airgeadais ar fáil le haghaidh na scéime fhaid a mhairfidh sí. Meastar go mbeidh caiteachas £10,000 faoin scéim ann i mbliana agus go mbeidh éileamh níos fairsinge ar an gcúnamh airgid seo sna blianta atá le teacht.

Baineann Scéim Saoráidí Ilghnéitheacha le saoráidí éagsúla, mar shampla, piniúirí liathróid láimhe, faichí imeartha, linnte snámha, etc. Tugtar deontaisí suas go dtí 80% den chostas measta ina leith siúd. D'ainneoin téarmaí na scéime a bheith chomh fábharach sin, is ábhar iontais é, mar adúradh anuraidh cheana, a laghad tairbhe is a baineadh as na deontaisí seo ó tugadh isteach iad.

Tá deontaisí suas go dtí 80% den chostas measta ar fáil ón Roinn freisin i ndáil le scéimeanna trialacha talmhaíochta. Tá scéimeanna den tsórt sin (maoth-thorthaí is mó atá i gceist) ar siúl i gCo. Chiarraighe, Co. Chorcaighe agus Co. Phortláirge le cabhair na gcoistí talmhaíochta ansin. Sa chás seo arís níl éileamh chomh mór ar na scéimeanna, ná borradh chomh mór ag teacht fúthu, is beifí ag súil leis ag féachaint do na téarmaí a ghabhas leo.

Is é fírinne an scéil, i gcás scéimeanna den tsórt seo, nach féidir tairbhe na ndeontas a thabhairt do dhream ar bith mura mbeidh sásta na scéimeanna d'ullmhú agus a riaradh. Tá téarmaí na scéimeanna ar eolas go fóirleathan ag pobal agus údaráis na Gaeltachta cheana féin. Más féidir leo dul i mbun oibre beidh cabhair airgid ar fáil acu go fial ón Roinn.

Faoi Fho-Mhírcheann H den Mheastachán, tá £2,000 á sholáthar i mbliana chun deontais bheaga a thabhairt le haghaidh imeachtaí cultúrtha agus sóisialacha sa Ghaeltacht, mar shompla, deontaisí i leith feiseanna agus féilí drámaíochta agus cúnamh airgid chun oirnéisí ceoil agus a leithéid a chur ar fáil do choistí áitiúla sa Ghaeltacht.

Chífear go bhfuil laghdú beag déanta i mbliana ar an méid atá á sholáthar faoi Fo-Mhírcheann I le haghaidh an deontais £5. Meastar go bhfuil an figiúr £48,000 níos goire don chaiteachas a bheidh ag teastáil i mbliana. Faoi mar is eol do na Teachtaí tá laghdú ginearálta tagtha ar an líon daoine sna ceantair tuaithe i gcoitinne, agus tá laghdú mar an gcéanna tagtha dá dheasca sin ar uimhir na bpáistí sa Ghaeltacht.

Tá £5,000 á sholáthar faoi Fho-Mhírcheann L i mbliana le cabhrú chun foirgintí a thógáil, a shealbhú, a oiriúnú agus a fheistiú mar Choláistí Gaeilge sa Ghaeltacht. Is cosúil go mbeidh tuilleadh iarratas ag teacht chugainn i leith Coláistí Gaeilge sna blianta atá amach romhainn.

Níl aon athrú ar an soláthar faoi Fho-Mhírcheann M den Mheastachán agus ní dóigh liom gur gá aon rud a rá faoi.

Faoi Fho-Mhírcheann N den Mheastachán, tugtar cúnamh airgid do choistí áitiúla, faoi scéim a bunaíodh i 1936, chun scoláireachtaí saoire sa Ghaeltacht a thabhairt do pháistí ó áiteanna lasmuigh den Ghaeltacht. Do hardaíodh an uasteorainn aoise faoin scéim go dtí 18 mbliana, d'fhonn scóip na scéime a leathnú do dhaltaí meánscoile agus, mar thoradh ar sin, tá méadú mór tagtha ar líon na bpáistí atá páirteach sa scéim faoi láthair. Tá £7,500 á sholáthar don bhliain 1960 i gcompráid le £4,685 (agus Meastachán Foirlíontach a áireamh) a soláthraíodh don bhliain 1959.

Ina theannta sin, tá scéim trialach á chur i bhfeidhm i mbliana trína gcuirfear suas le 300 scoláirí ag freas-tal ar scoileanna éagsúla sa Ghaeltacht le linn téarma scoile amháin sa bhliain airgeadais. Íocfaidh an Roinn deontais de leath an chostais suas go dtí £17 10s. 0d. an scoláire, agus tá £5,000 dá sholáthar faoin bhfo-mhírcheann seo ina leith. Déanfaidh Gael-Linn an scéim a reachtáil i mbliana ar bhun trialach agus is fúthu sin a bhéas na socruithe go léir maidir le toghadh na bpáistí agus iad a chur chun na Gaeltachta. Socróidh siad freisin faoin bhfuílleach den chostas a chur dá bhailiú. Tá súil agam go n-éireoidh go maith leis an triail seo agus go mbeidh ar mo chumas é a mhéadú sna blianta atá rómhainn.

Is iad príomh-fheidhmeanna Roinn na Gaeltachta leas cultúrtha agus geilleagrach na Gaeltachta a chur chun cinn agus cabhrú le caomhaint agus leathnú na Gaeilge mar ghnáthurlabhra. Tá límistéirí feidhme na Roinne leagtha amach in Ordú na Límistéirí Gaeltachta, 1956. Ag comhlíonadh a feidhmeanna di, chítear don Roinn gur ceart di féachaint le cumas tuillimh mhuintir na Gaeltachta a mhéadú, caighdeán maireachtála na ndaoine a ardú, agus an cultúr Gaelach a chothú agus saoráidí oideachais a fheabhsú. Tá eolas tugtha agam ar na hiarrachtaí atá á ndéanamh chuige sin, agus tá súil agam go n-aontóidh an Dáil liom go bhfuil fiúntas éigin sna hiarrachtaí sin. Is go príomha chun neartú le cumas tuillimh na ndaoine a ceapadh na scéimeanna feabhsúcháin a bhfuil saothrú ag dul leo.

I gcúrsaí tionscail, is eol don Dáil gur ar Ghaeltarra Éireann atá anois cúram na dtionscal tuaithe a bhíodh á riaradh ag an Roinn roimhe seo. Chomh fada agus a bhaineann leis an gcaighdeán maireachtála a ardú, is mór an leas a dhéanfaidh an cúnamh fial atá le fáil faoi Achtanna na dTithe (Gaeltacht) agus ní beag le rá sa gcaoi sin na scéimeanna uisce-sholáthair, scéim an gháis bhuidéalaithe agus na deontais atá le fáil le haghaidh hallaí siamsa, faichí imeartha, piniúirí liathróid láimhe, linnte snámha agus a leithéid. Agus is cinnte gur tairbhe don chultúr dúchais agus do chúrsaí oideachais scéimeanna ar nós an deontas £5, scoláireachtaí saoire sa Ghaeltacht, deontais drámaíochta, deontais le haghaidh oirnéisí ceoil, féilí agus feiseanna agus go háirithe an scéim atá againn le cabhrú le meánscolaíocht sa Ghaeltacht.

Tá ar intinn agam go leanfar de na hiarrachtaí atá ar bun againn agus beidh mé toilteanach i gcónaí aon mholtaí a thiocfaidh chugam agus a measfar a rachadh chun leasa don Ghaeilge agus don Ghaeltacht a bhreithniú chomh báúil agus is féidir. Is maith liom é bheith le rá arís i mbliana go bhfuil comhoibriú agus comhairle le fáil go fial ó údaráis agus eagrais agus daoine a bhfuil suim acu sa Gaeltacht. Gabhaim buíochas leo uile thar mo cheann féin agus thar ceann na Roinne.

Pádraig Mac Loingsigh

Tairgim:

Go gcuirfear an Meastachán ar ais chun a athbreithnithe.

Ba mhaith liom a rá i dtosach go bhfuil áthas orm go bhfuil an tAire ar ais arís agus é slán folláin i ndiaidh an tinnis a bhí ar cúpla seachtain ó shin.

Go raibh maith agat.

Pádraig Mac Loingsigh

Cé go bhfuil méadú breis is £40,000 sa Mheastachán seo, níl áfach, maitheas ar bith ann, ach amháin go bhfuil níos mó le fáil i dtaobh deontas tithe. Ach ní ionann sin is a rá go dtógfaí níos mó tithe i mbliana, agus maidir leis an deontas £5, ní féidir a rá ach go bhfuil sprionlaitheacht mhór annsin. Ó mo thaithí féin ar an scéal, ní bhronnfar an deontas £5 agus an deontas tí má bhíonn athair an líontí lag sa Ghaeilge. Is éagóir é sin, agus rud a dhéanann an-díobháil don teanga.

Ar an taobh eile, is maith liom go mór an méadú ar scoláireachtaí chun na Gaeltachta agus le haghaidh na gColáistí Gaeilge. Is rudaí maithe iad sin agus is mór an trua liom nach bhfuil níos mó rudaí maithe ann.

As I said at the beginning in Irish, we are delighted to see the Minister back from his recent bout of illness and looking none the worse for it.

On the last occasion on which the Estimate for the Department of the Gaeltacht was debated here, I, as the person responsible from these benches to speak to it, did not speak to it and I am speaking to it this time out of deference to the present occupant of the Ministry and in sharp contrast with the attitude which I adopted towards his predecessor. Whatever political differences there may be between the present occupant of the Ministry and myself, as there must be differences, having regard to the fact that one is Government and the other Opposition, I concede straightaway that long before he occupied the Ministry which he now occupies, he always spoke Irish, took an interest in it and used it at every available opportunity. The same cannot be said in regard to the person to whose speech in Irish I took serious exception. What I meant at the time when I said that I was not going to speak Irish in this House to the same degree as I might like to was that I felt that the Gaeltacht had been insulted on that occasion.

This Estimate, although it does provide for an overall increase of £40,000, does not really give rise to any reason for pride or boasting. The increase, by and large, is due to the fact that there have been substantial increases in housing grants but, of course, as I have already said, that does not mean that in fact houses will be built. It is a money increase for individual houses and a consequent increase in the overall Estimate.

The other small increases which I welcome are the increases for scholarships to the Gaeltacht and for the setting up of colleges in the Gaeltacht.

The reduction in the £5 prize money to children between six and 16 years of age is indicative of many things. In speaking in Irish, I termed it niggardly and showing a loss of hope. The Minister's own reasons are even worse than that. It is not a loss of hope; it is an expression of facts as they are, namely, that there are fewer people in the Gaeltacht and fewer schoolgoing children there than there were even last year when it was necessary to set aside £51,000 for the £5 prize for Irish-speaking children.

All through his speech, the Minister has talked about various schemes, various things that are going ahead. I hope that is true. I hope they are going ahead, particularly the tomato glasshouses in the various Gaeltachta, but I do think that something should be done to speed up the provision of heating for the glasshouses in Tourmakeady which we have seen recently and in which there is no heating as yet.

With regard to water supplies, that is something taken over from the Department of Local Government and is a scheme set on foot by Deputy O'Donnell when he was Minister for Local Government.

About Scéim na Muc or the Sow Scheme for the Gaeltacht, I do not take the same optimistic view as the Minister. When the scheme was being instituted in the House, Deputy Dillon said that all that would happen would be that instead of getting sows through the ordinary channels of the Department of Agriculture and getting good ones, people would get sows not quite so good at this lesser price through the Department of the Gaeltacht. From my information, it seems that that is true, that there has been a great deal of dissatisfaction, and I should like the Minister to state, when replying how many such sows were actually supplied in each Gaeltacht. The figure of 50 as an overall figure for the whole Gaeltacht is not sufficiently satisfying from the point of view of getting information as to how this scheme is being availed of.

By and large, the story is that the Gaeltacht is dwindling in terms of young people and that is contained, not implicitly, but explicitly, in the Minister's speech. There are fewer people there and fewer children there. I do not know that you are going to keep them there by building handball alleys, providing playing fields and building swimming pools, particularly if the youth are not there to play in the handball alleys, swim in the pools or play in the parks.

It is a feature of the whole seaboard that houses are closing and whole families are going away. The provision of suitable employment in those areas would have a far better effect in stemming emigration than trying to make things pleasant for the old people who are left and the few children who are being born there who might enjoy these amenities in time to come.

I want to know why, when questions are put down in the House to the Minister for Finance in relation to slips and piers, they are transferred to the Minister for the Gaeltacht and why he takes responsibility for them when I heard him say at Aughleam, near Blacksod in Mayo, that all he could do was to receive representations, consider them and make representations to the appropriate Departments. I do not think he should accept responsibility for them and allow himself to be the channel through which these things are by-passed by the authorities that should take greater interest in them.

I am rather disappointed that the Minister has not given more elaborate or more revealing figures about Gaeltarra Éireann. Gaeltarra Éireann, as everybody now knows, was set up under an independent board pursuant to a policy which was taken over from us by the present Government and a policy with which we agree. How the Board has worked out in practice, of course, is a different matter altogether. The only account we have seen from them to date is the printed booklet of Gaeltarra Éireann, an céad tuarastal bliantúil, namely, their first annual report for the year 1958/59, and that, in itself, is a revealing document, much as I imagine it was not intended to reveal anything.

First of all, let us be quite clear as to the amount of the grant-in-aid set aside for Gaeltarra Éireann from its inception. That grant was £220,000. When a grant-in-aid is being sought by a Department, it is fine-combed in that Department and fine-combed afterwards in the Department of Finance before it is allowed into an Estimate and it is computed, from my experience, on the basis not alone of the amount required but the amount it is within the competence and ability of a particular Department or semi-State body to use in the course of its year's working.

What happened in that first year for which £220,000 was made available by way of grant-in-aid? All that Gaeltarra Éireann actually asked for and received was £120,285, almost £100,000 less than they said they required. Either they were doing extremely well during that year or there was an incorrect estimate. By whom was the incorrect estimate made? I do not accept for a moment that they did not require that extra £100,000 because they actually show a trading loss of £82,000 and if they had taken the whole of the grant-in-aid there would not have been any loss at all in relation to their trading.

All I have, of course, is this little booklet. I do not know whether the Minister was referring — I think he was —to the year ending 31st March in relation to Gaeltarra Éireann when he said that over £500,000 worth of goods were sold in the year. I should like to know what the actual figure is, if available, for the year ending 31st March, 1960. I should like to know what those goods were and whether they can be classified by the Minister in his reply into the various categories set out in the report of 1958-59, namely, under the headings of tweed, toys, machine-knit garments, hand-knit garments and linen. The curious thing about the workings of the Board is that their total sales for 1957-58 were £583,294 and in the following year, 1958-59, up to the 31st March that year, their total sales under the headings I have given were £542,244, slightly over £41,000 of a reduction.

We now come to another interesting little table in this report for 1957-58 which says that on the 31st March, 1958, the stock which the Board held amounted in value to £426,763 and the next year's stock is placed at £405,345, a reduction of nearly £20,000. How is that reduction in stock value accounted for? It is rather curious that while the sales have gone down from 1957-58 into 1958-59 the stock has also gone down although one would be led to believe that the picture is that there has been a certain amount of progress. Mark you, there is a good deal to be said — having regard to these figures— for the reference this evening in the previous debate on the Estimate for Transport and Power where the Minister gave the Taoiseach's reply to Deputy McQuillan on some former occasion, that he thought there might be, or should be, an occasion for debate on State or semi-State concerns in addition to the debate on the Estimate, in which Deputies might seek to discover things for themselves.

I do not think this statement of the Board is correct. I know that it is published by the Board and that it has affixed to the back of it — not part of the published material — a certificate from the Chairman of the Public Accounts Committee. From previous experience we know that people who are able to present things with a good face on them can get a certificate of that kind. I am tempted to suggest— my temptation comes from a little more than speculation — that the full £220,000 was not drawn upon from the grant-in-aid because stock was sold, or a large portion of it was sold, and was not used to finance the purchase of new stock but was allowed to run into other expenses. Neither do I accept the figure of £405,000 as being the real figure representing the value of the stock today and I propose at some future time, when the next report comes out, to ask for time by way of motion to discuss this matter in the House. This is a field of activity that has given rise to considerable inquiry over some years past and it would appear that, certainly up to the 31st March, 1959, there is considerable room for further inquiry.

This £82,000 of trading loss must be explained when the grant-in-aid was available to them. The £426,000 for stock at the end of 1958 and the £405,000 at the end of 1959 must be explained by reference to specific articles, be they finished, part-finished or raw material.

Some time in November, 1959, the Chairman of Gaeltarra Éireann, Mr. Briscoe, resigned and has been replaced — in a temporary fashion no doubt but continuing for a considerable length of time from November up to the present day — by the permanent head of the Civil Service Department of the Gaeltacht. It is rather curious to note that while the same permanent head was the acting managing director of this firm the sales fell under his guidance by £40,000 in one year. Now we have the situation where the Chairman of the Board is the same person despite the losses incurred during his period as managing director. Now he is chairman in defiance of what was the stated object of the setting-up of this Board — to free Gaeltarra Éireann from the alleged restrictions to which it was subject under Civil Service procedure.

I understand that all of the civil servants who operated Gaeltarra Éireann have now gone into various Departments, some into the Department of the Gaeltacht. Suffice it to say, that the fact that the Board of whom the managing director was the permanent head of the Department of the Gaeltacht did not keep on one of these civil servants is a very grave reflection on them as a body and is a reflection to which I do not subscribe. I should like to know the reason for that, whether any of them got the option to stay on or whether they elected to move into different Departments where suitable places could be found for them.

The method of recruitment of the new staff to the board provides, to say the least of it, a certain amount of amusement. I understand that almost all of them come from a well-known football club and that they were able to secure appointment through the help of the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for Justice and the permanent head of the Department of the Gaeltacht, the Secretary, now the chairman of the Board and formerly the managing director.

The Irish Times wrote a sub-leader on 17th May of this year taking the Board of Gaeltarra Éireann to task in so far as it had not realised the hopes that everybody placed in it when it was set up. The Irish Times wrote a rather mild article, gently chastising, if you like to put it that way, but it was something, I thought, to which the Board of Gaeltarra Éireann might themselves have taken exception, if they felt that exception should be taken; but far from the Board of Gaeltarra Éireann taking exception — the chairman of the Board is permanent head of the Department of the Gaeltacht — the Minister's private secretary rushes into print. The title of that sub-leader was “Cutting Their Cloth” and the letter replying to it was published on Friday 20th May, 1960. It says:

Sir,

With reference to your leader of May 17th, the Minister for the Gaeltacht has asked me to inform you that he considers the general trend of your comments, and in particular your reference to maladministration, to be most unfair to the civil servants who administered the Gaeltach Services prior to the establishment of Gaeltarra Éireann and who were transferred on a temporary basis to the service of the new board when the latter assumed control of the industries.

What else could the Irish Times say except that there must have been maladministration of some kind? We are all conversant with a certain measure of maladministration during those days. The letter continues:

The responsible Minister stated in the Dáil on the Second Reading of the Gaeltacht Industries Bill, 1957, that the conclusion had been reached after very careful and thorough consideration of the matter that, in view of the continued growth of the industries, the time had come when it was necessary to have them freed from the restrictions of Civil Service procedure, which is not designed to deal with businesses of a commercial nature. This was the only reason for the establishment of the new board.

Was it the only reason? I can say, as somebody responsible and as a member of the Government that undertook the setting up of this new board, the arrangements for which were almost ready on the change of Government, that it was not the only reason. I was not satisfied as Minister for the Gaeltacht that it was the only reason.

The letter goes on to say:

It was the intention from the beginning to withdraw the Civil Service staff when the board had secured, as provided for in the Act, its own staff. It is stated in the report which was the subject of your comments that 50 civil servants were returned to Government departments and 32 appointments made by the board to replace them. It is also stated in the report, however, though not mentioned by you, that other appointments remained to be made.

Here is the private secretary to the Minister for the Gealtacht calmly acknowledging what the Irish Times, misinformed as they were, said, that only 50 civil servants went back. Ninety in fact, went back.

The letter continues:

The advice which you state the board received drastically to reorganise its staff can have had nothing whatever to do with the departure of the Civil Service staff from the service of the board.

The letter is signed: "E. Ó Cadhain, Private Secretary, Office of the Minister for the Gaeltacht, Dublin" and dated May 19th, 1960. I can well understand the Minister directing his private secretary to go gaily into print to defend the position of these civil servants but the way to have defended the position of the civil servants, particularly those men who had long experience and had given good service, was to retain them if they wished to stay, and I doubt very much if all of them opted to go. I should be very surprised if they had.

It is a rather unusual thing, particularly with a new board, the members of which must have been care fully selected — from my own knowledge, they were rather carefully selected — to have the chairman resigning in a very short time. The Minister has a duty to inform the House as to why Mr. Briscoe resigned the chairmanship of Gaeltarra Éireann and further, why, if it is intended, as his own letter would seem to imply, to remove the restricting hand of Civil Service procedure from such a Board, the permanent head of the Gaeltacht has continued since November, 1959, as the chairman of this Board on a part-time basis. Is it the intention of the Minister or the Government to fill this vacancy and get a competent chairman to take over the affairs of this undertaking?

I hear that the sales of tweed are increasing. That is a matter at which we must rejoice. I hope that not alone will they increase but that they will double and treble themselves as time goes on. That can only come from continued competence, improved methods and more care being given to design and patterns generally. I am told the same situation obtains with regards to toys. Certainly in Elly Bay in my constituency, everything seems to be going on well. There was some difficulty recently about the toy factory at Crolly but Deputy O'Donnell was responsible for revealing an extraordinary situation when he questioned notice being served on the 19 people there. He was told that notice was served only, that those people would be taken back or were being taken back because there was plenty of work available now. I hope that is true and continues to be true not alone for the number there but for greater numbers in time to come.

I am told the situation with regard to knitwear is not easy and that those who want to sell are faced with certain difficulties. That situation is, of course, understandable because in many houses all over the country now there are knitting machines and a great many housewives are supplementing their incomes, or housekeeping money, by making knitwear. That naturally makes for a glut. It has to be remembered too that their products are not as highly costed as those of Gaeltarra Éireann. One sympathises with the present management of Gaeltarra Éireann in their efforts to combat this difficulty.

Far from being critical of the Board, apart from what I have said, and the points I have raised which need clarification, I am satisfied this Board is operating reasonably well. We all —I certainly do at any rate — wish it well. I hope it will go on from success to success. Anything that may have happened with regard to it in the past happened with the best intention in the world, namely, to clear out the rot, get rid of the nonsense and ensure that those who invested would get value for their money. I do not know exactly what success has attended those efforts but I do know that there is considerably more activity in relation to the promotion of sales abroad, particularly in the tweed line. That is something upon which we must concentrate. The world is crying out for tweed and we have the best tweed in the world. If it is properly designed, properly woven, and properly dyed there will always be a market for it and there will be no complaints afterwards.

The Minister should check with the Board on these figures because, on the face of them, they are suspicious. I do not understand bookkeeping and all its intricacies, but it seems rather strange that sales can be down and stocks less when production has proceeded uniformly throughout the year.

I sympathise with the Minister in his efforts to deal with the problem of the Gaeltacht. The task is a formidable one. The atmosphere of the Gaeltacht is rapidly fading away. I do not blame either the Government or the Department of the Gaeltacht for that. There are other things, perhaps, to which attention might be directed, but what they are I must confess I cannot even conjecture. I do not think the situation is improved by difficulties in relation to examinations to test linguistic ability where people are looking for a housing grant or the £5. Where a man has had to find a wife from an English speaking area, or vice versa, and the children show a reasonable competence in Irish the examiner should not expect them to be on a par with himself linguistically speaking. The examiner should also take into consideration — this is something that is not taken into consideration in my opinion — that when a stranger comes into a house and proceeds to talk with the youngest child in the house, which seems to be the main pattern set for these examinations, shyness and the difficulties children encounter in meeting strangers is not taken into account. In such circumstances, I do not think we can reasonably expect much progress.

Recently I had a reply to a communication from the Department of the Gaeltacht. I made representations for a housing grant on behalf of a comparatively young man, his wife and children. It was frankly admitted that the wife knew Irish, the children had Irish, but the husband was rather weak. The letter then went on to say there did not appear to be any nature for the language, or any love of the language. How, in the name of Providence, could an inspector find that out in the few minutes he spent in the house? It is absurd to expect too high a standard on these occasions. By encouragement rather than by restriction more can be done to promote the language. The application of sanctions will never revive the language. Indeed, I do not see how one can ask people in areas where work is scarce and money difficult to come by, other then by migration or emigration on the part of some members of the family at least, to devote themselves to the study of Irish to the complete exclusion of English; after all, their ultimate destination will be Birmingham, Coventry, London, New York, Boston, or Philadelphia. In that light, it is an unreal situation to dream of or to aspire to.

Seán Mac Eochagáin

Sa gcéad dul síos, ba mhaith liom a rá go bhfuil áthas mór orm, óm chroí amach, go bhfuil an tAire ar ais anseo in a shláinte agus é chomh maith agus a bhí sé riamh.

Do labhair an tAire mar gheall ar thithe gloine. Tá siad á tógáil, maith go leor, ach tá moill mhor ann. Rud eile atá ag cur isteach ar mhuintir na Fíor-Ghaeltachta i láthair na huaire isea deontas na dtithe ós rud é go bhfuil moill mhór sa chás sin freisin. Rinne mé caint faoi seo anuraidh, freisin. D'iarr mé ar an Aire innealtóir breise a chur isteach i nGaillimh agus rinne sé amhlaidh ach ina dhiadh sin is uile bíonn moill ann i gcónaí.

'Siad na moillte is mó atá in aigne agam ná i leith téamh na dtithe. Sílim go bhfuil Comhairle Contae na Gaillimhe ag feitheamh le scéal ón Roinn le beagnach ceathair nó cúig de mhíosa. Ní raibh Comhairle Contae, na Gaillimhe in ann na deontais a íoc amach nuair nach bhfuair siad scéal ón Roinn seo maidir le téamh na dtithe sin.

Ceist eile isea na deontais i leith céibheanna beaga. Tá an tAire agus an Roinn ag iarraidh ar an gComhairle Contae, pé áit a bhfuil sé san Ghaeltacht, an ceathrú cuid a íoc. Ní cóir agus ní ceart é sin ar aon chor. Sílim gur chóir go n-íocfadh Roinn na Gaeltachta an deontas iomlán. Ansin, bfhéidir go mbeadh an Chomhairle Contae, pé áit a bhfuil sé, sásta na céibheanna a thógáil — sin agus iad a choiméad i gcaoi as sin amach.

Progress reported; Committee to sit again.
The Dáil adjourned at 10.30 p.m. until 10.30 a.m. on Friday, 10th June, 1960.
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