Vol. 249 No. 11
asked the Minister for Posts and Telegraphs the full costs of the public inquiry held recently into the RTE programme on illegal moneylending; if he will give full details of the amounts paid in legal expenses and to whom in regard to this inquiry; and full details of the total cost and payments made or about to be made in respect of each individual.
81.
asked the Minister for Posts and Telegraphs the costs met by his Department arising from the tribunal of inquiry into the RTE 7 Days moneylending programme.
82.
asked the Minister for Posts and Telegraphs the costs met by his Department arising from the tribunal of inquiry into the RTE 7 Days programme.
With your permission a Cheann Comhairle, I propose to take Questions Nos. 80, 81 and 82 together.
My Department has disposed of all claims and accounts received by it in connection with the tribunal in question, with the exception of an account for £2,055 10s which is due in respect of stenography services, and which is held up pending administration of the estate of the stenographer concerned, who died since the inquiry closed. Excluding this amount, payments have totalled £29,389 4s 6d including £4,951 10s 6d for stenography, witnesses' expenses, press advertising, et cetera and £24,437 14s for counsel's fees, which were paid as follows:
|
Mr. A.J. Hederman, S.C. |
£4,155 |
18s. |
|
Mr. S. McKenna, S.C. |
£4,134 |
18s. |
|
Mr. N. McCarthy, S.C. |
£4,105 |
10s. |
|
Mr. P. O'Malley, S.C. |
£4,105 |
10s. |
|
Mr. A. Browne, B.L. |
£2,740 |
10s. |
|
Mr. G. Buchanan, B.L. |
£2,651 |
5s. |
|
Mr. H. O'Flaherty, B.L. |
£2,524 |
4s. |
|
Mr. T. Connolly, S.C. |
£19 |
19s. |
The cost of publishing the report is understood to be £1,101 12s. An account for this amount has not yet been received by my Department.
What is the total aggregate cost of the inquiry known to the Department, including the plethora of fees which the lawmen earned during the course of the inquiry?
I can only give you the figure for the accounts which have been received by my Department. I have given that. The total is £29,389 4s 6d, that is excluding a sum of £2,285 10s.
How soon will the Minister be able to provide the full information on the cost of the tribunal?
As soon as I have it I will give it.
Will it be in the next three months?
I hope so. I am quite sure that when the Estimate for the Department of Posts and Telegraphs comes up we will be able to give that information.
Will the Minister also include the increase in postage in his Estimate?
The Minister is very co-operative. I wish there were more as co-operative as he is.
Question No. 83.
Has the Minister got available to his Department the overall cost of the inquiry? He has given the cost relative to his Department and I am quite certain the accounting officer of his Department has got the costs available to other Departments. I originally put the question down to the Taoiseach and he sidestepped the question deliberately and sent the question to the Minister. That is not quite satisfactory.
I have not got what the Deputy is looking for. I have given him all the information I have.
May I have the costs of the Department of Justice?
That question should be addressed to the Department of Justice.
The legal costs so far paid by my Department are those of State-employed counsel only, representing the Attorney General, the Garda Commissioner and the then Minister for Posts and Telegraphs.
Is it not the case that the Department of Posts and Telegraphs are now well aware of the approximate cost of this inquiry? We want only an approximate figure from the Minister. Any figure which he could give would not be very far off the mark. It would be within a couple of thousand pounds. It is all poppycock if the news media tell us this evening that the total cost is £29,000. It is absurd and ridiculous.
The Deputy is making a statement.
The Taoiseach said that the costs of every party in this inquiry would be paid.
He did not.
The Minister must be as well aware as I am that cost drawers take quite a while to draw up their costs. The Attorney General's costs would be a guideline as to what the total costs would be.
I have told the House that the legal costs so far paid by the Department were the ones I spelled out. I want further to say that no claim has been received from any of the other 14 parties represented by counsel at the tribunal. I could not give an estimate or give an opinion as to what the costs of those counsel would be. I further want to say that the Taoiseach did not assure the House that the Department of Posts and Telegraphs or the Government were going to pay all the costs.
The Minister is quite right. The Taoiseach did not say that the Department of Posts and Telegraphs would pay all the costs. He said that the State would pay the costs.
I beg to differ. The Taoiseach did not say that.
He is on the record as saying it.
I know what is on record as well as Deputy Desmond. The Taoiseach did not say that the State would cover all costs.
We will have another question.
Of course you may. You are welcome to it.
83.
asked the Minister for Posts and Telegraphs if the Government have as yet considered the report of the tribunal of inquiry into the RTE 7 Days programme on moneylending; and if he now has any observations to make on this matter.
The answer to the first part of the question is "yes". As regards the second part, I have no observations to make at this stage beyond stating that I have been in communication with the Broadcasting Authority about the tribunal's findings.
Will the Minister inform the House, in the public interest, the content of the deliberations that took place between him and either the board of the authority or the director-general of the authority?
This is enlarging very much on the scope of the question.
I asked the Minister for his observations on the report. He has given me a partial answer.
I told the Deputy that I have no observations to make at this stage.
May I ask were there direct consultations between the Minister and the board of RTE on this matter?
The Deputy may. There were.
Were there direct consultations between the Minister and the director-general?
The Deputy is now, by a series of questions, trying to enlarge on the original question asked. The Chair could not allow that.
It has regard to the original question, Sir, with due respect.
As far as the Chair is concerned there are two parts to the question. The first is to ask the Minister for Posts and Telegraphs if the Government have as yet considered the report, and the second part to ask if the Minister has any observations to make.
May I ask the Minister if he has any observations to make on the report?
The Minister answered that for the Deputy.
I have answered that.
He has not. He said he had some consultations with the RTE Authority. He has given no indication to this House if he has any observations to make. So far, £30,000 of the taxpayers' money has been spent on this——
The Deputy is making a statement. I am calling Question No. 84.
Who asked for the tribunal in the beginning?
On a point of order, I wish to give notice that I wish to raise the subject matter of this question on the Adjournment.
The Deputy should understand that after 3.30 on a Thursday matters cannot be raised on the Adjournment.
I am giving the Chair due notice that I wish to raise it.
The Deputy will have to give notice next week. It is too late now.
