asked the Minister for Industry and Commerce if his attention has been drawn to reports of a recent communication from a brewery management to its employees as to the possible serious upheaval in the industry; if, having regard to the grave damage to employment opportunities and to many other interests in the agricultural, industrial and commercial fields, if the large enterprise in question is transferred abroad, he will have immediate discussions with the management and trade unions concerned; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Brewery Management Communication.
26.
I am, of course, aware of the recent public statements on this matter and the management of the company has also discussed the situation with me and with my Department. I am assured that they will continue to maintain close liaison with the Government Departments and State agencies concerned as their plans to deal with the situation are developed. I am aware that they have also advised their employees and the trade unions of the problems which have arisen and will, no doubt continue to keep them informed. In this connection I would refer the Deputy to a reply given by the Minister for Labour to a question on 16th inst. I should add, in case this is what is implied in the question, that the transfer of the enterprise abroad does not arise. What is primarily at risk is the company's export trade.
I am sure the Minister would agree with me that, both in the good employment which this industry offers, and the markets which it makes available for Irish agricultural produce, Guinness is particularly good for Ireland, and that this goodness applies also to the export markets which are now endangered. Would the Minister ensure that employment in this vital Irish industry—as vital to Ireland as Rolls Royce is to Britain—is maintained at present levels, and that nothing is left undone to preserve for Ireland, and the Guinness employees in particular, all the export markets which are now available in the Midlands and the North of Britain?
I am fully in sympathy with the views expressed by the Deputy. We all share these views. The one place I must take issue with the Deputy is that I think the reason why the management of Guinness have had discussions with the workers and the trade unions, is their capacity to maintain the present employment level in relation to the volume of business, and the volume of exports, and the necessity to get themselves into a better competitive position from the point of view of maintaining the export business. This is what the whole exercise is all about.
The Minister has said that he has had discussions with the management and I certainly think that is a good thing.
The management came to inform me.
That is an excellent thing. Would the Minister now also have discussions with the trade unions involved because it is important that both sides in such a vital industry—and, indeed, in all industries—should be consulted? Perhaps the Minister would also give an indication as to what assistance, by way of capital grant or otherwise, the Government might be prepared to give to secure for Ireland the new brewery, which apparently is envisaged, for the purpose of meeting the keen competition on the export market.
That would be a separate question.
Further expansion is also involved in the question. My understanding from the management is that they are in constant contact and close communication with their workers' trade unions. I should like to make it quite clear from my point of view that, if any approach is made to me by the trade unions concerned, and if I feel that the trade unions concerned need to speak to me, or are anxious to speak to me, in relation to this whole matter, arising from the discussions they have had with the management, I will certainly have no objection to this, and I will be only too happy to discuss the situation with them if they require such a discussion.
If, as has been intimated, some of these workers are to become redundant, would the Minister not now initiate a meeting with the Guinness group to see if they would bring this new industry here to take up these workers, or to employ them in this new industry? It was intimated at a meeting that it is going to one of three or four places and Dublin was mentioned. Could the Minister initiate a discussion with Guinness on this matter straight away before they make any decision in England?
I think the Deputy is not aware that I have already conveyed to his colleague that I had a meeting with the management of Guinness. I think Deputy Belton said that there has been an acceptance of the fact that there will be redundancies as such.
I did not mean that.
This is not right. I do not know what the reaction of the trade unions has been, but I would hope that, arising from the discussions that have taken place between the management and the trade unions, the trade unions understand the position. This is why I am so ready to state here positively that I would be only too willing to meet the trade unions concerned if they felt that was necessary. It is not a question of a decision to create a new brewery here. The matter has been pretty fully discussed between management and the trade unions. It is a question not alone of our holding on to what we have, but of being in a position to develop it, and that development to be achieved by a further rationalisation of the brewery industry.
One last question. While I agree with the Minister on that, his predecessor and other Ministers for Industry and Commerce have travelled the world looking for industries and have spent time and money. Surely it is now worth his while to ask to meet the Guinness directors and help them in every way to get a new industry here.
I have been wasting my time if I have not given the Deputy that information already.