It is proposed to take Nos. 9, 5 and 2. By agreement, all the Estimates will be passed today. The Industry and Commerce Estimate will be resumed and continued until 4 p.m. The remaining Estimates and the Appropriation Bill will then be disposed of. The Dáil, at its rising today, will adjourn until Tuesday, 14th January, 1975.
Order of Business.
May I ask the Taoiseach when he proposes to take or can he set a time for taking early in the new year Estimates for the financial and public services sector?
Does the Deputy mean the Department of Finance Estimates and the Public Service Estimates?
Yes, Estimates Nos. 1 to 20, roughly.
I cannot say at the moment but I shall communicate with the Deputy about it.
The Taoiseach is aware that now for a number of years—this is probably the third year at least—the procedure we are adopting today has been adopted. The Estimates are simply mentioned: they are put through for legal purposes without discussion. We pass the Appropriation Bill. If we do not get a chance of discussing this business, this Parliament's function in financial business does not operate. We are abdicating our authority completely. For that reason I should like to ask the Taoiseach if he would seriously consider bringing these Estimates before the House in an orderly way so that we can debate the functioning of these Departments in the early part of the coming year.
I agree entirely with the Deputy's view but I think the only way to do this is to have a fixed timetable for Estimates and that means cutting back on time on some Estimates so that other Estimates can be considered. It is unsatisfactory that some Estimates get a particularly protracted period of the Dáil's time and others are closured out. My experience is, and I have always advocated this on both sides of the House, that a timetable is the most efficient means for both sides of the House because it enables an adequate discussion on each Estimate without giving too much time to any particular one. I think it does mean that speeches would have to be curtailed in length or some of them. But I certainly agree with the Deputy and I shall see what can be done in the new year. One important change I mentioned yesterday is that from now on the financial business will begin much earlier, in January. Both in the case of the budget and the other financial business we shall have started three months earlier than in any other year. I hope that will make a difference.
I appreciate the Taoiseach's difficulty and I thank him for his answer. It is very important that the financial business and the administration of the Departments responsible for finance should come before the House and be adequately debated. This has not happened for some years.
Perhaps I might be allowed to make a suggestion? Yesterday and some weeks ago I complained about running too many items in the Dáil together. Yesterday I pointed out that four Estimates were currently under debate and were to be resumed. I am suggesting that instead of running too many debates together, they should be brought to a conclusion one after the other. Every time they are resumed it gives a new impetus to the subject in question whereas if they were run through the Minister would reply in due time and at least there would be a conclusion with regard to some of the Estimates.
That is provided they are not talked out. It all comes back to a reasonable timetable. Obviously some matters will require longer time than others but that could be arranged between the Whips. The other suggestion made was that some Bills of a technical character might go to special or select committees.
With the permission of the Chair, Deputy Andrews and I wish to raise on the Adjournment the question of the Government's proposals to compensate thalidomide victims.
I will communicate with the Deputies on the matter.
Will the Minister for Finance tell the House if there is going to be a further rise in the price of petrol before the House resumes?
By order of the House time for questions is not being provided today. In accordance with practice, as the House is going into recess, written replies will be provided to questions on today's Order Paper except where any Member intimates to the General Office or to myself that he wishes to postpone any question for oral answer after the recess.