Deputy De Rossa moved, on 21 March, that leave be given to introduce the Bill, and the motion was opposed by the Government. In accordance with Standing Order No. 88 (4) the debate was adjourned until now. Deputy De Rossa may make a statement not exceeding five minutes.
Private Members' Business. - Postal Voting (Disabled Persons) (Interim Provisions) Bill, 1984: First Stage (Resumed).
Question again proposed: "That leave be granted to introduce a Bill entitled an Act to provide for the interim extension of postal voting facilities to persons with disability."
—(Deputy De Rossa.)
The five minutes I have do not give me time to go into all the reasons for the Bill. The most immediate one is the failure of the Government to introduce a Bill of their own to extend postal voting to the disabled. It would be an important electoral reform, and it has been recognised for many years. In March last year the working party report suggested that postal voting should be extended to the disabled and to those who could prove they were sick and unable to attend at polling stations.
It has been suggested to me that the Bill is too broad in its scope because it includes persons on disability benefit. I argue that that is a minor point. The Bill could be amended easily on Committee Stage. There is no reason whatsoever for the Government to oppose the Bill. On previous occasions they have allowed Private Members' Bills to go through and at a particular Stage have opposed them or have allowed them to go into Select Committee.
It has been argued there would be administrative difficulties in implementing postal voting for the disabled between now and 14 June, the date for the European elections. I do not accept that argument, because quite a number of complicated Bills have gone through the House in a matter of hours. For instance, a Bill dealing with the PMPA was introduced one morning and went through all Stages in this House and in the Seanad and was law before the night was out. Therefore there is no reason why this Bill could not be dealt with quickly. There are always administrative difficulties when the Government do not want to get up off their backsides and do something. If the Department of the Environment has the political will, and if the political head of the Department has the will, to see the Bill implemented, it could be law in time for the EEC elections.
It has been argued that there could be abuses, that on previous occasions there was widespread abuse of postal voting. The last time it was introduced for the disabled was for the local elections in 1974. The working party on the register of elections have been quite clear that there is no evidence there was widespread abuse at that time. During debates here a number of Deputies complained there had been abuse, but that did not take the form of prosecutions before the courts. There is no evidence that there was abuse of postal voting. Postal voting is an important right which would give the dignity to the disabled to which they are entitled. Many of them, even if they had postal voting rights, would still want to go to the polling stations to cast their votes, and they would still be entitled to do that. I appeal to the Government not to oppose the Bill. They could introduce amendments to make the Bill more effective.
I informed the House on 28 February that the question of postal voting was being examined by the Government and I hoped to bring forward proposals in the near future. I would like to make it clear that this remains the position. Comprehensive proposals on postal voting are being prepared which will strike a sensible balance between the requirements of those who seek postal voting and the necessity to provide adequate safeguards against abuse.
However, the time constraint is such that it will not be possible to have fully developed proposals in operation in time for the European Elections. It will be recalled that the Taoiseach informed the House to this effect on the 1 March.
An effective approach to postal voting demands that it be considered on a comprehensive basis. Disabled persons obviously deserve sympathetic consideration, but we must bear in mind that they are only one of the categories seeking postal voting. Requests for special voting facilities have been made on behalf of many other categories, for example, persons such as commercial travellers, seamen and transport workers who are unable to vote in person because of the nature of their employment. Special facilities have also been sought on behalf of persons required to live abroad for the purposes of their occupation, diplomats and their families, employees of State enterprises and many others. A serious examination of postal voting must take account of the position of each of these categories. A piecemeal approach dealing with a single category could hardly be said to address the problem seriously.
Postal voting is particularly susceptible to abuse. We recall our own experience at the 1974 local elections. Reports vary as to the extent of the abuse which took place on that occasion, but I think all agree that the abuse was serious and fairly extensive. We are all familiar with reports of problems in this area in Northern Ireland. It would be wrong, however, to assume that the tendency to abuse the system is an exclusively Irish characteristic. I understand that in recent years both France and Belgium have moved away from postal voting because of the abuse of the system.
There is a particular responsibility on us as Members of the Oireachtas to ensure that the procedures laid down for election to this House and to the European Assembly are free from abuse and that the democratic choice of the people is not distorted by irregularities. We would be failing in our duty as legislators if we did not build into the postal voting system adequate safeguards against abuse.
I wish to state clearly that any abuse anticipated will not be on the part of the disabled. Quite the contrary, the fear is that they may become the innocent victims. The disabled, the old, the sick are a vulnerable section of society and, in voting by post without the safeguards that apply at polling stations, some of them may be subjected to unfair pressure and interference by unscrupulous persons. That is an example of the kind of abuse that must be guarded against.
In case it may be thought that I exaggerate the danger of abuse, let us recall that the possibility of abuse, the danger of intimidation and the threat to the secrecy of the ballot were referred to by the Supreme Court in the course of the recent constituional action by Mrs. Norah Draper. The working party which reported last year on certain aspects of the electoral procedure drew attention to the danger of abuse associated with postal voting as, indeed, did the Joint Committee on the Electoral Law which reported almost 25 years ago.
The Workers' Party have been good enough to send me a copy of their proposed Bill. Having read the text carefully, it is clear that the measure falls down on each of the aspects I have mentioned. It is not comprehensive, it deals with one category only, ignoring the legitimate requests of all others. It is a stop-gap measure. It provides no safeguards against abuse. It makes no attempt to spell out how the system would operate. Apparently, all this is to be left to the Minister.
Far be it from me to question the motivation behind the measure or to speculate whether it has anything to do with publicity in the run up to the elections. I have to say, however, that it does not represent a serious attempt to come to grips with the real problems of postal voting. I propose to produce the heads of a Bill to be placed before the Committee on legislation shortly. In my view this will meet the needs of a complex piece of legislation. This will give an opportunity to all parties in the House to consider it at committee level and give it the attention such a Bill deserves.
Question put.
The Dáil divided: Tá, 65; Níl, 73.
Tá
- Ahern, Bertie.
- Ahern, Michael.
- Aylward, Liam.
- Barrett, Michael.
- Barrett, Sylvester.
- Brady, Gerard.
- Brady, Vincent.
- Brennan, Paudge.
- Brennan, Séamus.
- Briscoe, Ben.
- Browne, John.
- Burke, Raphael P.
- Byrne, Hugh.
- Byrne, Seán.
- Calleary, Seán.
- Collins, Gerard.
- Coughlan, Cathal Seán.
- Daly, Brendan.
- De Rossa, Proinsias.
- Fahey, Francis.
- Fahey, Jackie.
- Faulkner, Pádraig.
- Fitzgerald, Gene.
- Fitzgerald, Liam Joseph.
- Fitzsimons, Jim.
- Flynn, Pádraig.
- Foley, Denis.
- Gallagher, Denis.
- Gallagher, Pat Cope.
- Gregory-Independent, Tony.
- Harney, Mary.
- Hilliard, Colm.
- Hyland, Liam.
- Kirk, Séamus.
- Kitt, Michael.
- Lemass, Eileen.
- Lenihan, Brian.
- Leonard, Jimmy.
- Leonard, Tom.
- Lyons, Denis.
- McCarthy, Seán.
- McEllistrim, Tom.
- Mac Giolla, Tomás.
- MacSharry, Ray.
- Morley, P. J.
- Moynihan, Donal.
- Nolan, M.J.
- Noonan, Michael J. (Limerick West)
- O'Dea, William.
- O'Hanlon, Rory.
- O'Keeffe, Edmond.
- O'Kennedy, Michael.
- O'Leary, John.
- O'Malley, Desmond J.
- Ormonde, Donal.
- O'Rourke, Mary.
- Power, Paddy.
- Reynolds, Albert.
- Treacy, Noel.
- Tunney, Jim.
- Wallace, Dan.
- Walsh, Joe.
- Walsh, Seán.
- Wilson, John P.
- Woods, Michael.
Níl
- Allen, Bernard.
- Barnes, Monica.
- Barrett, Seán.
- Barry, Myra.
- Begley, Michael.
- Collins, Edward.
- Conlon, John F.
- Connaughton, Paul.
- Coogan, Fintan.
- Cooney, Patrick Mark.
- Cosgrave, Liam T.
- Cosgrave, Michael Joe.
- Coveney, Hugh.
- Creed, Donal.
- Crowley, Frank.
- Deasy, Martin Austin.
- Desmond, Barry.
- Desmond, Eileen.
- Donnellan, John.
- Dowling, Dick.
- Doyle, Avril.
- Doyle, Joe.
- Dukes, Alan.
- Durkan, Bernard J.
- Enright, Thomas W.
- Farrelly, John V.
- Fennell, Nuala.
- FitzGerald, Garret.
- Flaherty, Mary.
- Flanagan, Oliver J.
- Glenn, Alice.
- Griffin, Brendan.
- Harte, Patrick D.
- Hegarty, Paddy.
- Kavanagh, Liam.
- Kelly, John.
- Kenny, Enda.
- Bermingham, Joe.
- Birmingham, George Martin.
- Boland, John.
- Bruton, Richard.
- Burke, Liam.
- Carey, Donal.
- L'Estrange, Gerry.
- McGahan, Brendan.
- McGinley, Dinny.
- McLoughlin, Frank.
- Manning, Maurice.
- Mitchell, Gay.
- Mitchell, Jim.
- Molony, David.
- Moynihan, Michael.
- Nealon, Ted.
- Noonan, Michael. (Limerick East)
- O'Brien, Fergus.
- O'Brien, Willie.
- O'Donnell, Tom.
- O'Keeffe, Jim.
- O'Sullivan, Toddy.
- O'Toole, Paddy.
- Owen, Nora.
- Pattison, Séamus.
- Prendergast, Frank.
- Quinn, Ruairí.
- Ryan, John.
- Shatter, Alan.
- Sheehan, Patrick Joseph.
- Skelly, Liam.
- Spring, Dick.
- Taylor, Mervyn.
- Taylor-Quinn, Madeline.
- Timmins, Godfrey.
- Yates, Ivan.
Tellers: Tá, Deputies Mac Giolla and De Rossa; Níl, Deputies Barrett (Dún Laoghaire) and Taylor.
Question declared lost.