asked the Taoiseach in view of the fact that the arts in Ireland are severely under-funded, if he has proposals to further assist bodies promoting art and the arts generally.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Funding of Arts.
2.
I accept that the arts in Ireland are under-funded. As the House is aware, the Arts Council is the main channel for Government financial assistance to the arts. While the 1985 allocation of £5.5 million to the Arts Council may seem inadequate compared with the needs of the arts, it should be pointed out that to have provided for any increase for the council at a time of severe pruning in the Estimates of public expenditure was not an insignificant achievement.
In the past year there have been other substantial developments for the arts generally including: the reduction of VAT on theatre and live performances estimated to be worth £1 million for the first year of the reduction——
That is a joke.
It is not a joke. A sum of £1 million is involved. The developments include the allocation of another £0.9 million for culture and the arts in the Funds of Suitors Act; the inclusion of tax relief for gifts to approved bodies in the arts in section 32 of the Finance Act, 1984 and the recent budgetary provision of £120,000 in connection with European Music Year.
As for the coming year, Deputies will be aware that the rate of value added tax on artists' materials and musical instruments, on picture framing and on sales of works of art in galleries, will be reduced with effect from 1 March from 35 per cent to 23 per cent. Further assistance to bodies promoting art and the arts generally will be available in the coming months and years ahead. In the first instance, the Royal Hospital, Kilmainham, will be available as a major cultural centre for artistic and cultural events. It is envisaged that part of the proceeds of the proposed national lottery will be used for the benefit of arts and culture. This development could have a very significant result, depending on the success of a lottery. On a wider front I am happy to say that I succeeded in getting my fellow EC Ministers of Culture to pass a resolution during our recent Presidency of the EC, urging the use of the European Social Fund for artistic and cultural workers.
I think that the Deputy will agree that the various measures which I have outlined will go a considerable way to augmenting the level of public funding for the arts in Ireland.
In view of the underfunding, how would the Minister of State envisage the promotion of the greater appreciation of the arts in, say, Crumlin where I have the pleasure of opening their art exhibition annually? Also, what sort of percentage of the national lottery does he envisage will be available for art and has he any idea of what that will mean in money terms?
I do not think that I can go into details about what is envisaged to promote the arts in every part of the country, notwithstanding the importance of Crumlin. One area in which we hope to make an advance is the location of art centres in the suburban areas of Dublin and throughout the country. We have not decided on the percentage of the lottery that might be going for the arts but I will push myself and I have no doubt that I will have the support of the House to get a very considerable slice of it.
Would the Minister of State like to indicate to the House what kind of funds he and his fellow Ministers for culture envisage as being available from the European Social Fund?
The European Social Fund would operate through various schemes in order to help out artists, so there is a very large fund there. It is a question of seeking to encourage larger sections of that fund that now exists being channelled through for the purpose. We found a great deal of goodwill on this and the various Ministers involved, the Minister for Labour in our case, were very sympathetic towards this line. We had this resolution adopted and we hope it will have a beneficial effect.
Are any figures mentioned?
The fund is very large. Of course, we will get only a small slice of it at the moment.
Is the very large sum specifically for the arts?
No, there are no funds specifically for the arts. There is a specific area, very badly funded, within the President's Department dealing with culture and the arts, but the British and the Danes object to expanding the EC to cover the arts and culture areas and that is very difficult to overcome. Therefore, they are reluctant to allow any increased funding. That is why we during our Presidency directed our attempts to getting more funds from the existing Social Fund to which there could be no objection.
In connection with promoting the arts generally, will the Minister of State undertake a study in his Department of the possibility of encouraging community groups, development associations, residents' associations and ladies' groups to hold art exhibitions and competitions within local communities in an attempt to spread appreciation of the arts at local level?
The Deputy's suggestion is very good. The idea of combining a community centre with an art centre should be pursued on a cost effectiveness basis.
I have two questions. One is in regard to the recent budget changes in VAT on theatres. Does the Minister of State accept the arguments of those involved in running theatres that they will lose by the recent changes in the budget whereby they will be denied the refund of VAT which they pay on purchases in connection with the promotion of their theatrical work, due to zero rating for the theatrical companies?
That seems to be a different question.
The Minister of State mentioned in his reply that £1 million benefit to the theatre arises from the change in VAT. My second question is, does the Minister of State consider the work of Comhaltas Ceoltóiri Éireann to be severely underfunded, and what action do his Government intend to take to ensure that CCE maintain their very important work in promoting the Irish language and Irish culture?
The latter is a separate question, and if the Deputy puts it down I will be delighted to answer it in detail in so far as I have responsibility in that area. Our funding is done through the Arts Council, who are a statutory independent body, and I have no power over where the funds go. Regarding the Deputy's earlier question, I have details from the Abbey Theatre which show that they would lose out by the exemption from VAT as distinct from zero rating from VAT. I have similar figures from the Gate Theatre. It depends largely on the extent to which capital undertakings, cost of scenery and so on are being undertaken by the theatre. I am concerned about this and I am in contact with the theatres about it.
I am surprised at the Minister's answer regarding CCE especially in view of the term of the question and of the answers he has been giving to the House on VAT. Surely it is misleading of the Minister of State to say to the House that theatres would benefit to the extent of £1 million arising from the recent VAT changes when he admits that he has already received representations from the Abbey Theatre. I have received very strong representations from the Druid Theatre in Galway who state categorically that they will lose substantially by reason of the budget changes in VAT. It is clear evidence again of major changes being implemented by the Government without taking into consideration the effects of the implementation of these changes. These are very detrimental to the theatre, as happened in the case of VAT changes in the construction and other areas——
We cannot argue the budget on this question.
Surely the Minister of State is misleading the House when he says that the theatres will benefit to the extent of £1 million.
The reduction in VAT last year and this year, the overall reduction, was in the region of £1 million for live performances. That is not misleading the House.
They lose all the refunds.
They are losing maybe £10,000 on the refunds by the difference between 5 per cent and zero. It has nothing to do with the original provision in which about £1 million was involved. The difference we are talking about now is £10,000 or £20,000.
The Druid Theatre maintain that they suffer very substantially.
(Interruptions.)
The Minister of State should show more concern for CCE.
If the Deputy cares to put down a question, I will answer it for him.
I am calling the next question.
You cannot call the next question.
I am sure the artists would not be impressed by the scene we have just had over art.
We are not doing the fiddling on this side.