asked the Minister for Labour if he has further proposals to assist in eliminating discrimination in employment and promoting equality of opportunity in employment between men and women; and, if so, the proposals he has for amending the Anti-Discrimination Act, 1974 and the Employment Equality Act, 1977.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Employment Discrimination.
23.
I have had a detailed review of the Anti-Discrimination (Pay) Act, 1974, and the Employment Equality Act, 1977, carried out by my Department in consultation with the main interests involved, namely, the Employment Equality Agency, the Labour Court, the Irish Congress of Trade Unions and the Federated Union of Employers. The review concentrated firstly on the extent to which the existing entitlements provided for in the legislation might be extended and, secondly, on streamlining and harmonising the provisions of both Acts with a view to removing certain ambiguities and difficulties which have been encountered.
I hope to be in a position to submit a memorandum to the Government early in the new year containing proposals for the amendment of both Acts.
I take it from the Minister's reply that he accepts that there is still considerable discrimination? Perhaps he could tell the House of the main areas in the Act which are creating difficulties.
I am aware that discrimination still exists and will exist for some time because legislation does not remove attitudes of discrimination which prevail——
It helps.
I am pleased to have been associated with the party and Government which have put most of the legislation on the Statute Book in respect of that area. The operation of that legislation and its interpretation have produced ambiguities which we are examining. Because of the nature of the legislation, consultation with both sides is required and it would be inappropriate at this juncture to give an indication of areas which need reform, renewal or modification.
Has discrimination in the public service been eliminated or does it still exist in regard to promotion and employment opportunities in higher grades?
I am concerned about this and I have written to various agencies within the public service to ensure that a positive programme of action for equality is undertaken by all state agencies because, while some bodies may not be breaking the law, the level of discrimination, overtly or covertly, can and does exist because of the attitudes prevalent in society. We are still a male dominated society and legislation will not improve the position in that regard. It will have to come about by a programme of positive action and that is why I work closely with the Employment Equality Agency to try to promote a change of attitude as well as a change in legislation.
Does the Minister agree that there should be particular concern with regard to secretaries and assistant secretaries of Departments because, although, the proportion of women within Departments is extremely high, almost without exception those positions are held by males. Does the Minister agree that that is discrimination?
I agree. In 1974 the previous Coalition Government removed the marriage bar in the public service, a request denied on numerous occasions by Fianna Fáil Governments. If Fianna Fáil had removed the marriage bar in the sixties we would now have far more women at senior rank in the Civil Service. However, because of the marriage bar women were forced, unjustly, to make a choice—which men do not have to make —between their career, being married or remaining single. For that reason, inevitably the numbers of suitably qualified female staff at senior level is much smaller than the same number of females participating at lower levels——
It is not zero.
No and you will find that the Government's record in relation to promotion of females and their appointment to boards generally in areas where we have had discretion is a very positive one. In regard to the public service, there are other factors which have to be taken into account and balanced in relation to the appointment of senior civil servants.
The top levels appointments commission is a creation of the Government but does the Minister agree that they have not helped to improve the position?
That commission have undoubtedly improved the method and the manner in which appointments are made within the public service in relation to senior posts. They have also improved the prospects for female promotion because people can now move from one Department to another whereas that was not previously the case. I regret that to my knowledge no woman has been appointed by the commission but I am not suggesting that it is because of any prejudice on their part.