asked the Minister for the Environment if, in view of the widespread use by many local authority members of the section 4 process under the City and County Management (Amendment) Act, 1955, he has any plans to introduce amending legislation to curtail the use of such motions.
Ceisteanna — Questions. Oral Answers. - Local Government Reform.
56.
I have no proposals at present to amend section 4 of the City and County Management (Amendment) Act, 1955. This section provides one of the most important powers reserved to the democratically elected members of local authorities. Should any adjustment in relation to the operation of this provision appear necessary this could, appropriately, be considered in the context of proposals for local government reform generally, which I am currently examining.
Does the Minister agree that it is unsatisfactory that all that is required for the passing of these motions is a simple majority with only one-third of the members of a local authority voting in favour of a section 4 motion for it to be passed? Does the Minister agree that in many local authorities these motions are being used, in many cases, to flout the planning laws, as they exist, to the detriment of the community at large? Would the Minister like to comment on the position, for example, in regard to Dublin County Council, of which I am a member, where at the last three meetings of the council there were 36 section 4 motions on the agenda? This is a very strange use of the section 4 process which traditionally was used only in very rare cases. Would the Minister agree that these motions, particularly in my own county council, are leading to a situation where the business of the council cannot be conducted effectively by those members who are not involved in this process?
I recognise what the Deputy is saying and I would like to point out to her that I am aware of the regulations attached to the passing of a section 4 motion. It is important for local authority representatives to have that power. Sometimes the question of the involvement of section 4 can be somewhat overstated. Less than half of 1 per cent of all applications involve section 4. I have a statistic which might be relevant and it is the most recent one available to me. In 1985, 33,649 planning applications were received of which 88 involved section 4. Taking it in the overall context of all the applications made throughout the country, it is not a large number. As the Deputy well knows, only a very small number of counties have passed section 4 motions. The Deputy made a reference to the situation in Dublin and the latest figure available to me is that nine section 4 motions were passed in 1985.
Would the Minister agree that it would be desirable that at least two-thirds of the members of a local authority should have to vote in favour of these motions before they could be passed?
I am aware that in the document published by the Progressive Democrats on the environment that suggestion was made. The question of this particular power will have to be considered in the reform of local authorities and I will bear what the Deputy has said in mind. It is a pity that the few counties who have a difficulty with this matter do not take a tighter rein on the problem. I would like to point out to the Deputy also that her own party is the biggest offender.
Would the Minister agree that allowing only three members of a local authority to sign these motions is also unsatisfactory and that the minimum number that should be required before these motions could be placed on the agenda should be between seven and ten? When I say to the Minister that the meetings of Dublin County Council have become a total farce I hope he believes me because councillors now see fit to put down the fixing of drains etc. by way of section 4. As these motions take priority on the agenda of the meeting obviously they get discussed first. At some meetings no other business is conducted. When I say that 36 such motions were on the agenda for the last three meetings of Dublin County Council the Minister can believe me because I have checked these figures and they took up between 90 per cent and 95 per cent of the time of those meetings.
I am aware that the Deputy's party also suggested in their programme that seven members of a local authority might be required to table such a motion. It is a pity that the Deputy could not influence other members of her own party as the total number of section 4 motions passed could be greatly reduced if she could, but one way or the other it must always be understood that any person has the right to appeal to An Bord Pleanála whether or not planning permission has been granted by way of section 4. That avenue is always available to individuals, groups or bodies. In all the circumstances and taking into account the total numbers and percentages I have given, it is not unreasonable to expect that such a provision would continue to be on the Statute Book.