Vol. 431 No. 6
12 Mr. O'Malley asked the Minister for Equality and Law Reform if he has taken any action to establish an Oireachtas lawyers group to assist him in the drafting of legislation; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
I assume that what the Deputy is referring to his question are the exchanges which took place during Question Time in the House on 28 April last.
In the course of a question raised by Deputy McDowell on the law of real property he suggested that I set up a volunteer committee of experts, comprising representatives of the Irish Association of Law Teachers, the Bar Council and the Incorporated Law Society, to make proposals for or prepare draft legislation. I indicated at the time that I would be prepared to consider setting up such a group and Deputy McDowell offered to chair it.
I wrote to Deputy McDowell subsequently and invited him to discuss the matter further with me. However, I have not to date had his response to my letter. As soon as Deputy McDowell is in a position to discuss the proposal with me I will take the matter further.
First, the record should be that the Minister offered the position to me and not the reverse. Second, of course I will discuss the matter with him as I have spoken to his programme manager informally in relation to the matter.
The Minister's adviser.
I am sure the Minister is aware of this but I would like to know how many other people will be involved in this group or will I be the only Member? Looking around the House I notice we have Deputy Shatter, Deputy O'Donnell, who is a lawyer of no mean repute, and Deputy Lenihan also.
And one more.
They are coming out of the woodwork, and we have the Minister also. In those circumstances would the Minister indicate how many other people he proposes to appoint with me to this body which I, at his instigation, offered to chair? Has the Minister contacted the Bar Council, the Irish Association of Law Teachers or his own professional body of solicitors? The Minister has put two stimulating proposals to me, one for the reform of the law of real property which I take very seriously and one in relation to arbitration which I also take very seriously. However, unless the Minister nominates other persons to this body there is very little that I as chairman of a one man band can do.
The Minister is waiting for a letter from the Deputy.
I trust that Deputy McDowell did not come into the House for stimulation.
Sexual harrassment.
I wish to point out to the Deputy also that offering positions to people is one thing and their willingness to serve, on many occasions, is quite a different matter. So far as I am concerned on this issue I would be happy to use the specialist expertise that may be available in the House, and outside, which will be of assistance on legislation of a non-controversial nature. It would be my intention, following discussions as for format and so on with Deputy McDowell, the chairman of the putative new group, to approach other Members who have that expertise and who are prepared to serve.
I note that the Minister referred to the law of real property. Has he responsibility for law reform in this area and, if so, why questions recently put down to him regarding the issues of landlord and tenant and the Mespil Estate were taken by his colleague, the Minister for Justice?
I have responsibility in relation to the law of real property but the law of landlord and tenant is not included in my brief. It was specifically reserved to the Department of Justice as were a number of other areas.
Some areas are in and some are not included?
Will the Minister acknowledge that he may be in danger of creating greater inequality in setting up this proposed lawyers' group? Does he not recognise that lawyers have an inordinate representation in the Dáil and that there are great dangers in giving them influence over and above what they have managed to attain already? Would the Minister not be better advised to provide an expert group among people who are not represented in the Dáil such as unemployed, the poor, the marginalised, minority groups and women who are very often at the receiving end of the difficulties created by solicitors and lawyers in complicating the law to the extent that one can only receive the benefits of the law by employing a solicitor? The Minister's approach in this regard is back to front. As Minister responsible for equality, surely Deputy Taylor should be considering ways of reducing the influence of lawyers——
This is not a time to make a speech. The Deputy should put a question.
——and enabling people to achieve their rights.
It is not a question of extending the influence of lawyers in the House but of availing of the expertise of many Members of the House, which, unfortuntely, over the years has been neglected. If people with expertise can help in drafting legislation that will be of help to disadvantaged groups, it seems a waste of resources not to use the skills and abilities of those people who may be prepared to serve and make a substantial contribution. Participation in such a grouping would require a degree of dedication on the part of many people, and I would be grateful to any Members who would be prepared to give their time, abilities and energy to help in this area. That is not to say representative groupings such as those indicated by Deputy McManus may not be necessary or important. One such group is being set up which Deputy McManus has agreed to chair and I am grateful to her for undertaking that important task. No doubt groupings will also be set up to deal with other matters, but that should not detract from the willingness of Members of the House with expertise in various areas to make a contribution.
