It is proposed to take No. 9 — Motion re. Ministerial Rota for Parliamentary Questions; No. 10 — Motion re. Leave to Introduce Supplementary Estimates [Votes 2 and 33] and subject to the agreement of No. 10 to take Supplementary Estimates [Votes 2 and 33]; and No. 11 — Motion re United Nations Human Rights Year. It is also proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that No. 9 shall be decided without debate; No. 10 shall be decided without debate and any division demanded thereon shall be taken forthwith; subject to the agreement of No. 10, Supplementary Estimate [Vote 2] shall be decided without debate and any division demanded thereon shall be taken forthwith; and subject to the agreement of No. 10, the proceedings on the Supplementary Estimate [Vote 33], if not previously concluded, shall be brought to a conclusion at 6.30 p.m. today and any division demanded thereon shall be taken forthwith and the following arrangements shall apply: the opening speech of a Minister or Minister of State and the main spokespersons for the Fine Gael Party and the Labour Party shall not exceed 20 minutes in each case; the speech of each other Member called upon shall not exceed ten minutes in each case; Members may share time; and a Minister or Minister of State shall be called upon to make a speech in reply which shall not exceed five minutes. The proceedings on No. 11, if not previously concluded, shall be adjourned at 7 p.m. today and the following arrangements shall apply: the speech of a Minister or Minister of State, the main spokespersons of the Fine Gael Party and the Labour Party and each other Member called upon shall not exceed ten minutes in each case; Members may share time and a Minister or Minister of State shall be called upon to make a speech in reply which shall not exceed ten minutes. Private Members' business tomorrow shall be taken between 12 noon and 1.30 p.m. Private Members' business today shall be No. 61 — Motion re. Health (Physical Disability).
Order of Business.
There are six proposals to put to the House. Is the proposal for dealing with No. 9 agreed? Agreed. Is the proposal for dealing with No. 10 agreed? Agreed. Is the proposal for dealing with Supplementary Estimate [Vote 2] agreed? Agreed. Is the proposal for dealing with Supplementary Estimate [Vote 33] agreed?
There is a difficulty on the Health Supplementary Estimate. The Minister for Health and Children has available to him a report on waiting lists and he also has up to date waiting list statistics, but neither of those has been made available to the House for the debate on the Supplementary Estimate which covers this area. That type of information should be available to the House. I will be grateful if the Taoiseach will ensure that information will be made available within the next half—hour.
The Supplementary Estimate granting £20 million to the Department of Health and Children is required today. The Government has had ongoing discussions on the waiting list initiative and is continuing the work it has done in this area this year. We have substantially reduced the number on the waiting list for cardiac surgery and other treatment. It will take some time to discuss this and I hope we will complete our discussions in the next week or two. I do not see what that has to do with the Supplementary Estimate for funds that are required by health boards, voluntary hospitals and other agencies to enable them complete their expenditure requirements between now and the end of the year.
The Taoiseach seems to avoid dealing with one aspect of the matter. I am reconciled to the Government's suppressing the report of the review group on waiting lists, but I am particularly concerned that the Government has available to it waiting lists statistics——
We cannot have a debate on this matter now.
I wish to raise with the Taoiseach that the Government and the Minister for Health and Children have available to them waiting lists statistics indicating the numbers on waiting lists as at the end of the quarter, 30 September. I asked the Minister for Health and Children, by way of a letter to his Department on Friday, to ensure that information is provided. I draw the Chair's attention to Question No. 236 on today's Order Paper which seeks——
We are discussing a matter on the Order of Business.
Traditionally in this House replies to Parliamentary Questions, such as Question No. 236——
That matter does not arise at this stage.
If the Chair was to allow me to complete the sentence, perhaps he would understand how it arises. It arises because it relates to our taking the Health Supplementary Estimate. There is a question on today's Order Paper seeking detailed information about the state of the hospital waiting lists. The Government has that information available to it. Traditionally the answer to written questions was made available to Members by 4.30 p.m. but it has become a practice of the Department of Health and Children that Members do not now receive replies to their questions until 7 p.m. I seek the Taoiseach's assurance that the reply to Question No. 236 to which I am entitled will be made available by 4.30 p.m. so that we can deal with the current position of hospital waiting lists and not that which pertained last June in the debate on the Government Supplementary Estimate to determine the priorities for the additional spending. I am merely asking the Taoiseach to assure the House that the answer to that question will be made available to Members by 4.30 p.m. in the General Office.
The Taoiseach is not responsible for questions to the Minister for Health.
He is the Leader of the House.
We cannot discuss this matter on the Order of Business.
We are discussing the Order of Business and facilitating the House by taking this Supplementary Estimate at this time at relatively short notice. Opposition Members have rights and there has been a practice in answering questions. All Deputy Shatter asked was will the Taoiseach ensure that to facilitate a constructive debate on the Health Supplementary Estimate the normal practice will be adhered to. A reply from the Taoiseach is warranted on this.
In so far as I have any influence, I will ask that the information be made available.
The Taoiseach has influence.
What an admission.
I assume these replies are available relatively early. I want to correct Deputy Shatter on a point. He referred to suppressing a report. I assure him the Government has no intention of suppressing a report. That report will be published shortly.
The Taoiseach is holding it until the budget.
Deputy Owen should not interrupt.
The Taoiseach has it since August.
It is not the practice that as soon as the Government gets a report it publishes it. It deals with it first and that is what it is doing in this case.
Deputy Quinn said that this Supplementary Estimate was being taken at short notice. Three weeks ago Deputy Bruton asked me——
The figure has increased from £7 million to £20 million.
The Deputy loves to ask the questions but hates to get the answers.
I was enlightening the Taoiseach.
Deputy Bruton asked me if this Supplementary Estimate could be taken in the Dáil rather than in committee and there has been three weeks' notice of that. I do understand that the Opposition is very upset that there is a Supplementary Estimate for the Department of Health and Children.
It is disgraceful.
On a point of order, are there any guidelines for Departments, such as the Department of Health and Children, as to when the General Office should have copies of replies to parliamentary questions available for Members? Is it acceptable that the Department of Health and Children should provide this information, for example, on waiting lists, at 7 o'clock this evening, when it will be too late to be of use to Members in the debate? Unlike the Taoiseach, who claims he does not have authority in this matter, can the Leas-Cheann Comhairle, who does have such authority, ensure that this information is supplied to Members for the debate?
I understand that the Ceann Comhairle has raised this matter concerning replies coming in. It is true to say that some replies do not come in until 7 p.m., which is unsatisfactory.
Sometimes they do not arrive until the following morning.
Deputy Healy-Rae would not tolerate that.
I will draw the concern of the House to the attention of the Ceann Comhairle.
In the context of the concerns that have been raised — and this is an issue that I have raised on a number of occasions — could you, a Leas-Cheann Comhairle, use your good offices to ensure that the answer to this particular question, that all Members of the House are entitled to have sight of, is made available before the debate on the Supplementary Estimate for the Department of Health and Children?
It has to be delivered to Kilgarvan.
Is the proposal for dealing with Supplementary Estimate No. 33 agreed? Agreed. Is the proposal for dealing with No. 11 agreed? Agreed. Is the proposal for taking Private Members' Business agreed? Agreed.
I wish to raise a matter that was raised a week ago by Deputy Quinn. It concerns the parliamentary timetable for the legislation to set up the implementing bodies under the British-Irish Agreement. Clearly, there will be a problem with the parliamentary timetable if this matter is not agreed. Will the Taoiseach indicate his estimate of the length of parliamentary time that will be needed for the legislation on the implementing bodies, so that all the legislation will be passed in this House and the institutions can go live in February, as planned? How many parliamentary days does the Taoiseach believe will be necessary for the purpose and is there any possibility that this legislation could be passed on a contingency basis, even if the decommissioning issue has not been finally sorted out, so that the legislation can take effect? In that way, we will not have all night sittings for three or four consecutive days to get the legislation through.
Hopefully, parliamentary time will not be our difficulty. If we could complete matters we could begin working on the arrangements. A number of issues have to be put forward and I provided a list of these some time ago. If we could reach the stage of getting the implementation bodies agreed, then hopefully the heads of the human rights legislation could be circulated to Departments. I told Deputy McManus that the matter would go a committee in about a fortnight's time — certainly before Christmas. The legislation will be ready directly after Christmas. The Equal Status Bill is in preparation, as is the legislation to amend the Nationality and Citizenship Act, 1956. There are other matters, not all of which would be required at the same time. However, the legislation concerning the implementation bodies will have to be worked on during January and into February. It will certainly be tight in the present circumstances.
Is there not a problem in that the legislation has to be introduced in this House in plenary session before it can be debated by a committee? When is the Taoiseach likely to introduce the legislation for the implementing bodies? Is it not the case that, if we do not get agreement before Christmas, it will be some time in mid-January before this legislation can be introduced? Is legislation for the implementing bodies available in draft form, which can simply be introduced with a few minor amendments to take account of the final agreement?
No, obviously it is not because we have not even agreed what they are. That will not be ready in January. All of January will be required to deal with that. My comment about the committee of the House was in relation to the human rights legislation where I gave a commitment that, as soon as the heads were ready, they would be discussed in committee prior to Christmas so that a Bill could be drafted in January.
I am trying to be helpful in relation to this matter. The British-Irish Agreement belongs to all parties in this House and to the 95 per cent of the electorate in the Republic who voted for it. Will the Taoiseach not agree with my observation that the legislative programme required from this House to enable the process to go live on 1 February is now seriously out of line? By the Taoiseach's own admission, the human rights commission legislation, which is relatively straightforward, will not be available until early in the new year. He has slightly changed what he said on a previous occasion, when he said the heads would be circulated to the Departments. He indicated previously that the heads were coming to Government, which would have implied in the normal convention that they had already gone to various Departments. Be that as it may, may I formally propose that the Taoiseach brief party leaders and give us, and the Whips, a clear indication of the legislative programme required in relation to making the British-Irish Agreement work? We should get agreement specifically about the legislation that is required. In that way, the Taoiseach will get the co-operation that is available to him from the House in order to make this happen. The last thing we want is to be on our feet at three minutes to midnight in late night sittings, drawing to the Taoiseach's attention defects in legislation that will have been cobbled together because of lack of time. I make this suggestion specifically in relation to the implementing bodies.
It is quite possible, although I do not know, that the legislation could be drafted and circulated and that the schedule, which would incorporate the agreed bodies — which have clearly not yet been agreed — could be attached. That may be one possibility.
Brevity, please, Deputy. We are on the Order of Business.
Brevity applies to all sides of the House. I offer this for the Taoiseach's consideration. I am asking for a formal consultation with the Opposition leaders in the House and a discussion on the necessary logistics of a legislative programme to see in what way we can co-operate to give legislative effect to an agreement to which we have all signed up.
With other party leaders, I have raised this issue before with the Taoiseach. We were assured that all necessary legislation would be ready in time. After this week, there remain only two weeks until the end of the current session. I understand that we will not be returning until close to the end of January. This means that the amount of parliamentary time available for passing critical legislation in relation to the implementation of the British-Irish Agreement will be limited. It is a matter of urgency that this House gets its business organised in such a way as to ensure that, at the very least, it is not at fault in delaying the implementation of the agreement. The Agreement has the support of everybody in the House. Virtually everybody had a hand in negotiating it and 95 per cent of the people supported it. Therefore, it is critical that we get our act together.
Brevity please, Deputy. We are moving on from the Order of Business.
I am about to finish. It is critical that we get our act together and that the Taoiseach has the co-operation of everybody in doing so.
I thank the Taoiseach for having lived up to his commitment in relation to the committee. I take it that the committee he referred to is the Committee on Justice, Equality and Women's Rights. In order to comply with the British-Irish Agreement, does he also intend to refer the heads of the Bill to the All—Party Committee on the Constitution?
I thank the Leaders of the Opposition for their co-operation in this matter. Of course, I will take up Deputy Quinn's suggestion of briefing them on developments. Our biggest problem is getting matters finalised and agreed to. Once that is done we can begin working on the areas concerned. As regards the other legislation that is not part of the implementation bodies, work is ongoing. I will ask the Government Whip to brief the Opposition and get agreement on the timespan required to allow these matters to be dealt with. All matters mentioned in the Agreement do not have to go through at the one time. It really concerns the implementation bodies so that the North-South Ministerial Council — which should be meeting in shadow form at this stage, but is not for other reasons — is allowed to continue with its work. We can agree on the timetable. In reply to Deputy McManus, my only difficulty is in moving it from committee to committee. I am more interested in getting it through.
They could deal with it simultaneously.
If it is possible.
I wish to raise two matters, one of which relates to the protection of architectural buildings Bill which the Taoiseach said last week would be introduced in January. Last week a house in the Taoiseach's constituency, originally lived in by James Joyce, was demolished. It could not be listed because literary association does not make buildings eligible for listing as heritage buildings. Will the Taoiseach look at that question in the context of the forthcoming Bill?
The second matter is one which I sought to raise on the Adjournment but it was not selected, which I accept. It relates to the apparently malicious rumours circulating in respect of a former Taoiseach about his involvement as a fundraiser for the National Gallery. Under the National Institutions Bill, with which everybody is concerned, will the Taoiseach ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage, Gaeltacht and the Islands to make a statement to clear up this matter?
That is not in order.
Is the Taoiseach aware that when I raised the issue of the NATO—led Partnership for Peace with the Tánaiste on 26 November she replied that the Taoiseach had given a commitment that there would be a referendum?
This is not in order on the Order of Business. The Deputy can ask a question about legislation.
It is in order because a referendum requires legislation. I want to know when we will have that legislation and whether we will have time to debate this issue in the House.
It arises only if the decisions are made.
According to last Saturday's The Irish Times the Minister has made the decision.
The Deputy should resume his seat. I am calling Deputy Connaughton.
The decision has been made.
There was an article in last Saturday's The Irish Times in which the Minister for Foreign Affairs outlined his position.
The Deputy is out of order and I ask him to resume his seat.
It is an absolute disgrace.
Are the Taoiseach or the Minister for Agriculture and Food aware of the great dissatisfaction among farmers with the grading of cattle at meat factories and the low price at the factories?
That is not in order. It is being raised on the Adjournment this evening by two Members.
Will we have to wait until tomorrow for the great news?
When will legislation be introduced to facilitate the payment by Ireland of a contribution to the IMF for the Enhanced Structural Adjustment Facility? There has been a press release from the Department of Finance and the Department of Foreign Affairs stating that £7 million will be paid to the IMF for this purpose. It is perfectly clear that IMF membership by Ireland is not encompassed by legislation. A decision was taken by a previous Government not to go ahead with this legislation. How is it proposed to make a grant of £7 million to the IMF for purposes which were not envisaged by the original legislation? When does the Department of Finance propose to bring in the legislation, and when will we have an opportunity to debate it?
It relates to the Bretton Woods Agreement (Amendment) Bill.
What we are talking about is the Enhanced Structural Adjustment Facility of the IMF, for which the IMF has been canvassing support, and to which we have no commitment. We have no obligation under existing legislation to make a contribution. A contribution has been announced, disgracefully, at a time when we have cut bilateral aid.
The Bretton Woods Agreement (Amendment) Bill is to obtain parliamentary approval for the payment by Ireland of a contribution to the Enhanced Structural Adjustment Facility of the IMF.
The question I asked was when are we going to debate this issue.
That does not arise on the Order of Business.
It does.
The Bill was cleared by Government today. It will be debated as soon as the Whips can arrange it.
Will it be this side of Christmas?
Yes.
(Carlow-Kilkenny): In view of the fact that legislation was introduced last year to allow ballot papers to contain photographs of candidates in the European elections, and given that those involved in adult education are extremely upset about the number of people who are disenfranchised because they cannot read, are there any plans to introduce legislation to allow photographs on ballot papers in local elections which are to take place next year?
A commitment was given that this would be done as an experiment in the European elections. Regulations to cover that have already been implemented, but that is just for the European elections.
Some weeks ago the Taoiseach indicated that the Government had agreed to facilitate the amendment of the Committees of the Houses of the Oireachtas (Compellability, Privileges and Immunities of Witnesses) Act to enable the Comptroller and Auditor General to carry out investigations on behalf of the Public Accounts Committee into the allegations regarding AIB and tax fraud with offshore accounts. Is that legislation ready and, if so, when will it be debated in this House?
The staff involved in this legislation have been working late every night and have worked the last two weekends. It is proving quite a complicated Bill, but they are still hoping they will get it through well before Christmas.
Since staff have been working weekends and late nights, the Bill is not before the Government and we are now on our third last week, is it the case that we are unlikely to see this legislation between now and Christmas?
The Attorney General and the parliamentary draftsman are adamant they will achieve that, but they are finding it far more difficult than they expected. I was told today they will have to work every night this week and next weekend to have it ready.
Is the problem one of drafting or of constitutionality?
It is both. They are trying to overcome the difficulties but they still hope to have it ready in a forthright
When will the Bill relating to Irish registered non-national companies be published?
That issue is being dealt with under companies legislation, and the companies Bill is to be published at the end of this year or early next year.
Can the Taoiseach tell us whether legislation will be necessary for the division of the country and the establishment of 15 counties for Objective One status? Will the fact that Clare and Kerry are in separate regions mean legislation will be necessary?
No legislation is promised.
(Dublin West): On promised legislation, on the national airwaves this morning, the Minister for Public Enterprise dropped a bombshell by speaking about forthcoming legislation involving a significant privatisation programme for Telecom Éireann. When is it proposed to bring forward such legislation for another sell—out to private interests of a vital national asset?
That does not arise on the Order of Business.
(Dublin West): The Minister spoke of legislation. It is therefore promised legislation.
The Order of Business refers specifically to promised legislation.
(Dublin West): The Minister promised legislation this morning.