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Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Tuesday, 18 Jun 2002

Vol. 553 No. 2

Priority Questions. - Community Employment Schemes.

Pat Rabbitte

Ceist:

85 Mr. Rabbitte asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment if her attention has been drawn to the serious concern expressed by community and voluntary organisations at the cutbacks in the number of places on community employment schemes; if she will reconsider the cutbacks having regard to commitments given in the Programme for Prosperity and Fairness that the numbers would not be allowed to fall below 28,000 before 2003, and the serious problems being created for communities as a result of the cutbacks; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [13831/02]

Phil Hogan

Ceist:

86 Mr. Hogan asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment the num ber of planned reductions in places in community employment schemes; if she has undertaken an analysis on the impact of these cuts on communities; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [13870/02]

I propose to take Questions Nos. 85 and 86 together.

In accordance with the Government's decision in 1999 to restructure community employment, CE, participation levels are gradually being reduced reflecting the significant reduction in the numbers of the long-term unemployed, and the shift in emphasis away from work experience programmes to training, from which there is a greater level of progression to employment. The PPF contains a commitment to reduce overall place numbers on CE to 28,000 by 2003 through a reallocation of funding equivalent to 5,000 places to the social economy, together with the reduction of 4,500 places required by the Government's decision of 21 July 1999.

The mainstreaming of school services currently under way and the proposed mainstreaming of other essential services, including the health and environmental sectors, will further reduce the numbers employed on the programme. This has been confirmed by my Department in detail on a number of occasions in the context of discussions with the social partners on the PPF standing committee on labour market matters. I have also made this position clear in my responses to a number of previous parliamentary questions on the restructuring of CE.

There were 30,809 participants on CE at the beginning of 2002 and it is anticipated that the year-end participation rate will be in the region of 24,000 to 25,000 places depending on the rate of inflows and outflows on the scheme. This phased reduction in place numbers is part of a strategic shift in policy in favour of greater investment in training and other supports, for example, social economy and the new high supports process, which I will launch shortly.

I am fully aware of the concerns of sponsors from community organisations regarding the implications of the reduction in CE places for the provision of community services. In this regard I emphasise that FÁS prioritises projects according to the types of services provided and levels of unemployment in the locality and will co-ordinate reductions to minimise the negative effects on groups and services most in need of CE. Priority groups include the drugs task forces, child care service provision and designated disadvantaged areas covered by the new RAPID programme and the BMW region.

In addition, the social economy programme is available to support the development of social economy enterprises that will benefit the economic and social regeneration of communities. Local social economy working groups have been established in the 38 designated disadvantaged partnership areas and in 16 non-partnership areas. In this way, the social economy is targeted at areas which traditionally have had high dependence on services provided under CE.

A review of active labour market programmes, as provided for under the PPF, has recently commenced under the standing committee on the labour market, which is chaired by my Department. The committee includes representatives of the community pillar, employers and trade unions, as well as other Departments and FÁS. Consultants have recently been appointed by my Department to facilitate a rigorous assessment of the effectiveness of existing programmes, which will help to inform the deliberations of the standing committee. Terms of reference for the consultants' work were agreed by a steering group representing the standing committee, which included all the social partners.

I fully recognise the range of valued services across communities which have been provided with the support of CE. The mainstreaming initiative recognises that certain key support services, such as in the education and health areas, can best be provided through the Department with functional responsibility in the relevant area. This is why the appropriate funding transfers from FÁS to the Departments in question are taking place. FÁS is undertaking its own internal review of the scheme, which should further inform the prioritising of activity within CE, taking account of the needs of disadvantaged groups and the provision of services to areas experiencing severe social and economic disadvantage. The future policy direction of active labour market programmes, including CE, will be informed by the outcome of these processes.

Is the Minister saying the cause of concern of all the people who marched on her advice centres and press conferences during the election and all the deputations that sought to meet her was ill-founded? Is she denying that there is confusion at the heart of the operation of these schemes now; that people are being disemployed as we speak; that the Irish Congress of Trade Unions is up in arms about not having been consulted; that the terms of reference as agreed in the social contract, the PPF, are not being adhered to on the side of the Government; and that there is widespread concern about the impact on badly needed community services of the cutbacks that are being implemented operationally, irrespective of her protestations that this is not happening? Is it not fair for this side of the House to inquire of the Minister to make clear whether these cuts are taking place with her authority and that of the Department?

I know my reply was long but I said there were 30,800 places on CE schemes at the start of the year and by year end there will be between 24,000 and 25,000. In addition, a number of places has been mainstreamed and transferred to the Department of Education and Science. However, I will put this in perspective for the Deputy. Five years ago, 72,500 people were involved in community employment and various other training initiatives while today there are 74,000. We are spending more than €200 million more per year on training and community employment than five years ago. At that time the unemployment rate was 11% while it is now 4%, the long-term unemployment rate was almost 6% and this has reduced to 1.3% and there was one CE place for every 2.5 long-term unemployed person and that has been reduced to one place per 0.7 long-term unemployed persons. There has been improvement on three fronts. The emphasis, including by the social partners, has been to try to get people into training so that they can be equipped with the skills for a real job in the labour market.

Two issues concern me. The first relates to individuals involved in CE schemes who, for whatever reason, are not in a position to take up a job when they complete the scheme. That is a huge concern and I will announce a new process shortly for dealing with these hard cases. These individuals require much more intensive assistance and mediation from FÁS. The second issue relates to the services and activities that would not exist were it not for CE such as those provided in schools, in the areas of health, the environment and so on. The process of mainstreaming services began in schools last year and will continue shortly in regard to health and environmental services because we must get away from the notion of stop-start support for worthwhile activities.

There are approximately 70,000 foreign workers in Ireland. Employers are seeking work permits on their behalf and so far this year 18,000 have been granted. This is in addition to those who come here from the European economic area who do not require work permits. It would be irresponsible of me as Minister with responsibility for employment and training not to respond to the significant changes taking place in the labour market. There is a number of separate issues that must be dealt with in a different context. The social economy is part of that. The Minister, Deputy Ó Cuív, has been given responsibility for community services and I shortly hope to discuss the role that mainstreaming CE can play in supporting worthwhile activities on the ground.

The Minister could have saved herself a great deal of trouble in dealing with the co-ordination of the new initiatives that she proposes to take in the near future if she had done so in more thoughtful fashion months ago when individuals and community groups contacted Members regarding their concerns about continuing their programmes through FÁS over the next few years under the CE scheme. The Minister referred to a stop-go approach but communities have been engaged in such an approach because the Minister and FÁS have not ensured there is planned and co-ordinated implementation of FÁS social economy schemes, which are essential to fill gaps in the labour market in the areas of health, education and the environment.

What analysis has been carried out by the Department to verify that CE schemes are not operating to the standard it wishes and that another scheme which the Minister is about to announce will be better? Is she aware that FÁS has no problem spending money on job creation at its headquarters through the provision of directorships and supervisory positions while the number of places on employment schemes is being reduced at local level where the real work is being done?

Deputies

Hear, hear.

I do not accept that people with special needs, who do essential work in communities, should suffer while top level positions are created at national level by FÁS at extra financial cost.

The number of places is a function of two factors, one of which is the level of unemployment. Let us be honest. Community employment and its forerunner, social employment, were introduced at a time of high unemployment to reduce the numbers on the live register. That is a fact. At a time in the 1990s when the economy was growing we still had a growth in joblessness and high levels of unemployment as a result of which the numbers on CE schemes were extended. Since then there has been a dramatic transformation in this economy, particularly in the area of employment, and we have ended forced emigration. We must respond to that and there are two things we could do. We could reduce the number of people in mainstream training and maintain the high numbers in community employment, something I do not believe would be sensible. I believe it is preferable to equip very young people with a skill for a real job which will see them through their entire working lives and provide higher incomes and greater prosperity than to maintain them on community employment. A number of years ago, we decided to increase the age threshold for participation in community employment to encourage those young people into mainstream training and this is working extremely well.

We are not introducing new schemes; the social economy came out of a consultation process under the PPF and is working well. Although only in its infancy, it is developing a new model for the creation of enterprises in the community particularly in disadvantaged areas.

The time has expired for these two questions.

That is unsatisfactory. There has been a lot of confusion on this issue and I was looking forward to some clarification.

Acting Chairman

Unfortunately, Deputy, Standing Orders do not allow me to give you extra time much as I would like to do so.

Standing Orders do not provide for confusion.

Question No. 87 answered with Question No. 84.

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