Pat Rabbitte
Ceist:1 Mr. Rabbitte asked the Taoiseach the total costs incurred by his Department to date from the operation of the National Forum on Europe; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [19848/03]
Ceisteanna – Questions. - National Forum on Europe.
Enda Kenny
Ceist:2 Mr. Kenny asked the Taoiseach the costs which have accrued to his Department in respect of the National Forum on Europe; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [21960/03]
Trevor Sargent
Ceist:3 Mr. Sargent asked the Taoiseach the costs which have accrued to his Department from the operation of the National Forum on Europe; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [24082/03]
Joe Higgins
Ceist:4 Mr. J. Higgins asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the costs incurred by his Department in relation to the operation of the National Forum on Europe. [24880/03]
Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin
Ceist:5 Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin asked the Taoiseach the costs accrued to his Department for the operation of the National Forum on Europe. [25364/03]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 1 to 5, inclusive, together.
A total of €3,035,677 has been spent by my Department to 31 October 2003 in respect of the National Forum on Europe. I have provided details of the annual breakdown of costs over the period of operation of the forum in a table which I propose to circulate in the Official Report.
|
Year |
Expenditure€ |
|
2001 |
229,928 |
|
2002 |
1,997,185 |
|
2003 (to 31/10/03) |
808,564 |
|
Total |
3,035,677 |
Does the Taoiseach acknowledge that, in terms of expenditure, there is still an information deficit, which was revealed as recently as this morning in the latest Eurobarometer poll? It showed that 30% of our citizens have heard of the Convention on the Future of Europe compared with an average of 39% across Europe. Does the Taoiseach foresee a role for the forum in promoting knowledge of the Convention? Has he plans in that regard?
It is not for me to set the forum's agenda but I hope it has been presented with copies of the Convention report and the new constitution. I understand the forum is also producing a second video for distribution to all second level schools and will undertake a number of other initiatives in the regions, which are helpful and necessary.
The forum organised 21 events this year compared with 40 last year. Does the Taoiseach agree that, in a year when the European Convention produced a draft constitutional treaty and a new Intergovernmental Conference has commenced, the forum should promote more public meetings? If that does not happen, we will be in the same position as applied prior to the first Nice referendum with the public prepared to reject a proposal on the basis of lack of information.
When I recently criticised a 54% cut in the forum's budget, a statement immediately issued from the forum which said it was happy with the amount allocated. While that is a matter for the forum, it is not usual for such an agency to make such a comment. Will the Taoiseach clarify that no official in his Department was associated with the issuance of the statement relating to the forum and its work?
That is a matter for the forum but I saw both statements. I saw the forum's statement before I even read the Deputy's remarks and, therefore, had no involvement with it.
With regard to his first question, the meetings are continuing. I am careful not to try to set the forum's agenda. There were not large attendances at many of the regional meetings but I agree with the continuation of meetings. I attended a number of them in the run-up to the Nice referendum. They are useful and a good way to provide an information base. If we are approaching the conclusion of the Convention, the forum should continue to hold sessions to explain it because those who attend them are genuinely interested and are opinion formers on these issues.
The Taoiseach may well have serious matters to deal with during his Presidency of the Union from January to June 2004, as a result of which there will be another constitutional referendum. Should the Government and the Taoiseach allow the forum to hold as many meetings as it thinks appropriate throughout the State as ideal preparation for the putting of a complex question to the people following the Intergovernmental Conference? While the Taoiseach does not set the agenda, he should make it clear he will provide resources to the forum to hold however many public meetings it thinks fit.
I agree with Deputy Kenny with regard to that issue. He raised it with me at the previous session of the forum and I stated publicly that it would be the position.
The Taoiseach referred to a figure of €3 million. Is that in line with the Government Estimates breakdown of January 2003, which gave a figure of €197,000 for 2001, €2 million for 2002 and €700,000 for 2003? That amounts to a slightly smaller figure. Is the Taoiseach in a position to say whether it includes the cost of producing the draft constitution which the forum launched, or is that yet to be reported? Has he a figure in respect of that cost? Will additional copies of the document be printed for wider distribution, having regard to the indication from the recent Eurobarometer poll that 71% of the Irish people – far higher than most European countries – wished to read a summary of the constitution, if not the full document? Is an allocation being provided in line with the forum budget to ensure that will be available? Will the forum have a specific additional role in this regard during the Irish Presidency of the EU, as well as during the run-up to the referendum on the new EU constitution? Has any role been envisaged by the Government in that regard?
The forum had a very busy year in 2002 in which it spent almost €2 million. The figure for 2003 up to the end of October, at €808,000, is in excess of that mentioned by the Deputy for this year. I am aware that the constitutional document was widely circulated but I am not aware of any plans for further circulation. However, the Government will continue to try to resource the work of the forum. I believe its meetings are receiving considerable attention. The information available to me is that it has prepared and circulated a summary booklet on the draft treaty to establish a constitution for Europe and a glossary of terms. I do not have a figure for the number of copies printed.
Does the Government envisage giving new guidelines to the forum for the wide debate which should now open up on the proposed new EU constitution? Has the Government ideas as to how this debate can take place to the widest possible extent? Does the Taoiseach agree that there continue to be diverse views on the proposed EU constitution and that it is very important that both sides of the argument are heard? Does he agree that, on one side of the argument, those opposed to some of the structures of a Europe dominated by big business should not be at a disadvantage because of a lack of resources? Has the Taoiseach an inkling of the timescale for a referendum on the proposed future EU constitution? Incidentally, if it does not go the Government's way the first time, will there be a re-run?
The Deputy has gone well outside the scope of the five questions which deal with the costs of the forum to date.
I believe the debate to which the Deputy referred is under way. There have been a number of forum sessions on the EU constitution. The last of which I attended involved people of divergent views on both sides of the argument. That debate is being well managed by the forum and should continue. The Minister for Foreign Affairs, Deputy Cowen, and Minister of State, Deputy Roche, have been involved on behalf of the Government, as well as numerous other speakers. From my involvement on the previous occasion, it is my impression that the forum intends to continue that form of debate.
Will the forum continue its work in the lead-up to the referendum on the draft constitution for Europe? Given the outreach work of the forum and the opportunities in the run-up to the Nice treaty which allowed for public participation in discussion meetings in different locations around the country which were well attended and very successful, will a similar approach be employed in the lead-up to the referendum? Will the Taoiseach tell us when the referendum will take place?
The Deputy is well outside the scope of these questions—
I will try to slip back in.
—including his own, which refers to the cost incurred by the Department.
I take your point, a Cheann Comhairle. What steps will the Government take to assist the work of the forum and in the wider debate on the information deficit regarding the Government's position on the draft constitution, clause by clause? Will the Taoiseach consider publishing a White Paper which will detail all the information, clause by clause, in order that we can fully appreciate the Government's attitude to this important document?
The Deputy has gone well outside the scope of the question.
On that matter, the Government has already put its views through and at the Convention. There have been 35 plenary meetings, 31 regional meetings and four national conferences. As I said, a video on the Convention on the Future of Europe has been sent to all post- primary schools and a national schools writing and public speaking competition for transition year students, based on that video, was recently completed. A further schools initiative for this academic year is in preparation, as is a summary booklet on the draft treaty establishing a constitution for Europe and a glossary of terms. In answering these questions I do not want to say that I am doing the work of the steering group. I am conscious that it is an all-party group and I do not direct it in any way, but this gives an indication of what the forum is doing on this issue.
I do not want the Chair to rule me out of order.
I will stick to the cost issue. On my first question relating to the publication of the draft constitution, will the cost given by the Taoiseach for the forum's work provide sufficient copies for each household in the State, as was considered in previous referenda? Notwithstanding the fact that the forum makes its own policies, does he agree that the Government must at least give a nod in the direction of the forum, given that it controls the purse strings and will decide, de facto, whether everyone gets a copy of the constitution by virtue of the funding available? Has there been Government discussion of this?
There has not, for one simple reason. Deputies have asked me when the referendum will take place, but we need to conclude the constitution first before that is decided, and those discussions are ongoing. It could be a considerable length of time before that work is finished. Normally a glossary, summary or full document is sent out but that is usually done by the Department of Foreign Affairs.
The Taoiseach said earlier that the Government had provided significant information. However, while an explanatory document was circulated, and there have been a number of public statements which addressed specific issues within the wider debate, there has not been a substantive address of all the essential elements or core points on a clause by clause basis. Is there a cost consideration? What is the cost of an informed debate which allows people to have truly informed opinions on the draft constitution proposals in the absence of a White Paper? Will the Taoiseach tell the House that he and his colleagues are prepared to produce a White Paper to ensure the public is informed on this issue?
The Deputy should submit a question on the matter. It does not arise under these questions.
Surely it is not cost which is holding back the dissemination of information on this issue.
I suggest the Deputy submit a question on this matter. The Deputy tabled a question on the costs associated with the forum.
Is there a cost factor? Will the Taoiseach elaborate on that?
It is not a cost factor. The National Forum on Europe has done its job on this. The Department of Foreign Affairs put out its summary on the Convention, which was a detailed issue, not to mind the detailed issues on record put forward by the Minister, Deputy Cowen, and the Minister of State, Deputy Roche, on the work of the Convention and where we have moved in regard to it. That has been done throughout the process.
We now move on to Question No. 6 in the name of Deputy Kenny.
I wish to make a point about the taking of questions together, although I am aware I cannot get anywhere on this. The Taoiseach is taking Questions Nos. 6 to 17, inclusive, together, but they deal with two separate and distinct issues. Questions Nos. 6 to 11, inclusive, deal with Cabinet meetings outside Dublin while Questions Nos. 11 to 17, inclusive, deal with the Cabinet committee on drugs and social inclusion.
I preface my remarks by saying that under the rules all I do in response to these questions is state the dates of the meetings. I do not go into the detail of those questions, which are relevant to the Ministers concerned.
I understand that.