Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Tuesday, 21 Nov 2006

Vol. 627 No. 6

Priority Questions.

Postal Services.

Bernard J. Durkan

Ceist:

69 Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources his preferred options for the provision of postal services in the future with particular reference to the role or extended role he sees for An Post, the inclusion of a PSO, the need to ensure a fast, efficient and cost-effective letter and parcel delivery service in all areas throughout the country without exception and the need to comply with regulatory and competition rules; his views on the optimum number of post offices required; his intentions for the upgrading of the maximum number of post offices with a view to delivery of a wider and first class service to the consumer; if he has given instructions to the regulator or An Post with a view to achieving these objectives; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [39110/06]

Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources (Mr. N. Dempsey)

An Post operates within a regulatory framework as enshrined in EU and Irish law and therefore, the universal service obligation, which includes nationwide postal delivery requirements, is a statutory requirement for An Post as the designated universal service provider. To assist the company in meeting this obligation, it has a legal monopoly on all mail items weighing 50 g or less until January 2009.

Compliance with regulatory and competition rules is a matter for the board and management of An Post. Furthermore, ComReg, as the national regulatory authority, is required to monitor An Post's adherence to postal regulations. I have not given any recent directions to the regulator or the company in the above regard.

I believe there will continue to be a key national role for An Post in the delivery of mails and parcels. However, over the coming years, competition can be expected to increase in these sectors, whether from the privately owned express sector, from the large European public operators now looking for international business or from electronic substitution.

Liberalisation of the mail market in Ireland has already commenced and the second postal directive proposes that the postal sector fully liberalise across the EU on 1 January 2009 subject to political agreement which, if achieved, would open up the letter post area to full competition.

Issues that will be important for Ireland in the context of a fully liberalised market will include the protection of the universal service, ensuring that Irish citizens continue to receive a broad suite of postal services and the continued viability of An Post in the face of open competition.

The development of the postal market requires the availability of competitive, high quality products. The current level of market opening has introduced new players with offerings that meet consumer needs and further market opening will provide further opportunities for new and existing players. The development of further competition allied with a modernised and customer focused An Post will provide the basis for the further development of the postal sector here.

As regards the post office network, the precise number of post offices is a matter, in the first instance, for the board and management of the company. However, the Government and the board of An Post are committed to the objective of securing and maintaining the largest, most economically sustainable nationwide post office network possible. In line with this objective and with the need for the company to leverage its competitive advantages, I asked the company to ensure that any strategy for the development of the company should ensure the long-term viability of the post office network.

It was to this end that the Government recently gave its approval for An Post to enter into a joint venture agreement with the Belgian bank, Fortis, to set up a retail banking business. This will entail the provision of a range of financial services operated through the post office branch network, using the An Post brand and other An Post assets. Key to the Government approval of this joint venture was that it not only offers a real opportunity for the growth and development of An Post and the post office network but it will, in time, greatly benefit the income streams of postmasters.

Mr. Durkan

Is it true that it is intended to use An Post for the banking or transmission of money transfers in the future? Would this apply, for example, to the Department of Social and Family Affairs which has advised that it will use banking systems in the future as opposed to postal services? Has the Minister given any thought to the optimum number of post offices likely to be retained throughout the country, notwithstanding the views expressed by the commissioner for communications and given that this country is somewhat different in terrain from most other member states? Is it intended to attach further compatible responsibilities to the postal service with a view to enhancing the viability of An Post? Will the Minister speak about the necessity for political approval of the structures to be followed in the provision of postal services in the future, having particular regard to the fact that it is an EU requirement that political agreement be reached?

Mr. N. Dempsey

The deal between Fortis, the Belgian bank, and An Post will open the use of the postal network for financial services generally, such as insurance and so forth, as well as banking. That will operate throughout the post office network. Obviously, the post offices that are already computerised and electronically enabled will be in a position to do that straight away. Not all post offices will carry the full range of services but all of them will act as agents for the new company set up by An Post and Fortis. The answer to the Deputy's first question is that there will be a full suite of financial services, in the broadest sense, available in the local post office from early next year.

As part of that deal Fortis has agreed to enhance the capability of some post offices in the network to operate the electronic transfer systems. A large proportion of post offices have that capability at present but upgrades will be required due to the new systems. That will facilitate social welfare direct electronic transfers. In the negotiations that were carried out with the bank we told An Post that it must be mindful of the needs of the Department of Social and Family Affairs as well.

I have not formed a view on the optimum number of post offices. That is a matter for the board of An Post. It is true that we have a more scattered population, which is the reason we have so many post offices. Nevertheless, the number of post offices in this country is far higher than is the case anywhere else in Europe.

With regard to new services, the deal with Fortis will mean that a suite of financial services will be provided by post offices. The Government is constantly examining the possibility of new services being provided through the post office network. Some years ago I provided in legislation that something such as the register of electors could be compiled through the post office network.

Mr. Broughan

The Minister, Deputy Roche, did not listen.

Mr. N. Dempsey

That is a useful task it could undertake in the future.

Telecommunications Services.

Thomas P. Broughan

Ceist:

70 Mr. Broughan asked the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources if he will report on the regular meetings that his Department is conducting with the broadband service providers; when he will bring proposals to Government on achieving 100% broadband enablement of the State; if he is considering including an upgrading of all telephone exchanges and fixing the problem of shared lines within these proposals; if the cost of this proposal may be up to €200 million; if such investment would ensure that the State receives a stake in the critical communications network; if he plans a tendering process along the lines of the contract that was awarded to BT in Northern Ireland; the role he envisages for e-Net and the MANs in this proposal; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [39125/06]

Mr. N. Dempsey

I meet industry and interested parties on a regular basis in pursuit of my objective to facilitate the widespread availability of competitively priced broadband in Ireland. The provision of telecommunications services, including broadband, is a matter in the first instance for private sector companies operating in a fully liberalised market, regulated by the independent Commission for Communications Regulation, ComReg. The role of the Government is to implement regulatory and infrastructure policies to facilitate the provision of affordable, high quality telecommunications services by competing private sector service providers.

However, it has been clear for some time that the private sector has failed to invest at the level necessary to keep pace with the demand for broadband. Direct funding has already been provided under the National Development Plan 2000-2006 for the provision of backbone infrastructure and to upgrade local access infrastructure. My Department's regional broadband programme is addressing the infrastructure deficit by building high-speed open access broadband networks, in association with the local and regional authorities, in the major towns and cities. These metropolitan area networks, MANs, allow the private sector to offer world class broadband services at competitive costs. The networks also offer towns opportunities to attract inward investment in advanced technology and knowledge based enterprises.

The Department also offered funding assistance for smaller towns and rural communities through the group broadband scheme. The scheme is technology neutral, allowing the community to select the most suitable broadband delivery platform for the area.

Despite private and public investment in broadband infrastructure there are still some parts of the country where the private sector will be unable to justify the commercial provision of broadband connectivity. Options to address these gaps in broadband coverage are being considered by a steering group comprising officials from my Department and representatives from ComReg. I expect it to finalise proposals shortly.

Mr. Broughan

The Minister said he has ongoing discussions with the industry. Has he spoken to the executive chairperson, Mr. Pierre Danon, and the chief executive, Mr. Rex Comb, of Eircom about their proposal to enable broadband supply throughout the country for €200 million? They gave that estimate for dealing with split lines, exchanges, remote rural areas and so forth. Has the Minister met Mr. Danon and Mr. Comb to discuss this proposal? Has the Minister carried out a cost benefit analysis of the enablement of all parts of the country? In the Estimates the Minister apparently provided €10 million for this purpose. If Eircom estimates the cost of the job at €200 million, why is the Minister only allocating €10 million?

Will the Minister engage in a tendering process, as the British Government did in Northern Ireland? That process was won by BT and it gave Northern Ireland 100% broadband enablement. We have not yet attained that target. Will the Minister engage in a tendering process or will he make a special deal with Eircom? Given the level of State expenditure that would be necessary, is the Minister prepared to take a stake in Eircom in return for financial support to the company?

The Minister always refers to the MANs in replies to questions about broadband provision. However, we know the MANs do not solve the local loop or the last mile problems. Have we not already spent €120 million on the MANs project? Is it not the case that e-Net, the company administering the MANs, last year lost €4 million and is still losing money? Has the Minister received a proposal from e-Net on enabling broadband throughout the country or does he expect that company to engage in a tendering process? In other words, if the Minister advertised a tender for broadband, would he expect e-Net to make a bid alongside Eircom, BT and anyone else who wished to do so?

What is the Minister's opinion of the Labour Party's proposal to make Dublin city a wireless enabled zone so that broadband could be freely accessed in the city centre business and commercial district?

Mr. N. Dempsey

I have had several meetings with Mr. Danon and Mr. Comb, including two where I met both together, during which we discussed a range of matters. At our initial meetings, the two men wanted to introduce themselves and outline their views on where their company was going and what they were planning to do. I wanted to learn their plans for broadband and the telecommunications sector in general. Eircom is clearly an extremely important company.

Mr. Broughan

Did they put a specific proposal to the Minister?

Mr. N. Dempsey

I ask the Deputy to give me a chance to answer the question in my own way. We discussed a range of issues pertaining to broadband and telecommunications. The €200 million figure to which Deputy Broughan refers was reported in a Sunday newspaper but, to my recollection, it was never mentioned in any conversation I had with Mr. Danon or Mr. Comb nor did I hear it confirmed by either following publication of the speculative article which mentioned it. We discussed the issue of providing nationwide broadband services and, as was the case with other private sector operators in this field during the 12 to 18 months in which I have dealt with them, they have pointed out they are in the business to make money and to give their shareholders a return. Their basic attitude is, while it is very laudable for the Government and Opposition Members to desire nationwide broadband, do not ask the private sector to pay for it. That is the real world in which we live. Even before Mr. Danon and Mr. Comb joined the scene, a number of providers predicted that certain areas of the country will not have broadband for the foreseeable future if we are not prepared to invest directly.

We have been aware of the issue since 2001 or 2002 and have established the county and group broadband scheme to address it. While that scheme has been successful in allowing communities to become involved, it is somewhat slow in terms of developing the type of coverage I would like to see in this country. For that reason, we are now considering the issue raised by Deputy Durkan with regard to bringing nationwide broadband to the last 10% or 15%. Discussions are ongoing in respect of how we might achieve that target and how we could shape a tendering process.

Mr. Broughan

There would be a tendering process.

Mr. N. Dempsey

A tendering process would be necessary. At this stage, we are asking whether we should divide the country into small areas, as we were doing, to provide services on a countywide or regional basis or if we should develop a single national contract. There are advantages and disadvantages to each option. We are sure, however, that we want a technology neutral solution so that we do not give the tender to one company only to have it claim it is running out of copper wires.

Fisheries Protection.

Martin Ferris

Ceist:

71 Mr. Ferris asked the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources his views on whether the compensation currently being offered to drift net fishermen is adequate. [38963/06]

John Perry

Ceist:

72 Mr. Perry asked the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources whether, in respect of compensation for commercial netsmen, he will reconsider the valuation that has been put on the licence or improvements to the minimum payment, given that commercial quotas declined by approximately 60% in the reference period for compensation, fishermen were penalised by the area based quota system and commercial representatives suggested equal valuation of all salmon licences; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [39097/06]

Mr. N. Dempsey

I propose to take Questions Nos. 71 and 72 together.

The Government's primary motivation is the conservation of the wild salmon species, which has long been regarded as one of Ireland's most prized fish. It is vital to afford every protection to the remaining salmon stocks and to clearly prioritise conservation over catch. The current imperative must be to maintain stocks above conservation limits or at the very least halt the observed decline. If we do not take action now, the relentless decline in stocks will continue, leading to the inevitable demise of wild salmon and the loss of a valued cultural, recreational and economic resource.

International best practice for the management of North Atlantic salmon requires the adoption of a precautionary approach and the cessation of indiscriminate mixed stock fisheries. These are the recommendations of the North Atlantic Salmon Conservation Organisation and the International Council for the Exploration of the Sea. Moreover, if we do not end mixed stock fishing in 2007, the European Commission will undoubtedly proceed in its action against Ireland under the habitats directive. On the other hand, we can expect a reputation bonus from neighbouring countries if we proceed on the proposed course.

In future, the harvest of salmon by any means will be restricted to those stocks of rivers that are meeting their conservation limits. This means there will be no indiscriminate capture of fish. Commercial fishing and recreational angling can continue only on the scientifically identified exploitable surplus. The Government has decided in the circumstances to introduce a hardship scheme for commercial fishermen and others severely affected by the curtailment of the wild salmon fishery on the lines set out in the independent group's report. As the Deputy will be aware, the independent group was appointed to examine the implications of alignment with the scientific advice for the commercial salmon fishing sector in 2007 and beyond. As part of its remit, the group made recommendations to address any financial hardship that may be experienced by the sector. The approach it adopted in determining the hardship payments was robust and convincing.

In its report, the group noted that the level of hardship likely to be experienced would vary both in extent and scale. Taking all factors and available information into account and noting in particular that there is no legal obligation on the State to provide compensation where it is imposing management measures that are fundamentally in the public good, the group proposed to provide a measure of relief to each individual in line with the level of hardship likely to be experienced and recommended that relief should be based on the recent catch history of the individual licence holder from 2001 to 2005.

The Government accepted the recommendation of the independent group and determined that the level of payment should be based on the average net income per salmon in the commercial fishery for the past five years, that is from 2001 to 2005. This income calculation was based by the group on the average price obtained per fish per year and the costs incurred by fishermen. Each individual licence holder who applies to the fund is set to receive six times his or her average catch multiplied by the average net income per salmon. I believe this is a fair and reasonable allocation and does not need to be modified. An additional fund of €5 million will be available for a community support scheme to aid the development of those communities where the impact of the cessation of drift netting will be hardest felt and to provide alternative employment and economic opportunities for those affected.

Mr. Ferris

The Minister will be aware of the presentations made by driftnet fishermen to the Joint Committee on Communications, Marine and Natural Resources, in which they categorically stated they were in favour of sustainability and conservation. Many other groups argued in their presentations to the committee for a voluntary buy-out scheme, with provision for set-aside as an alternative for those who wished to continue in the industry.

Is the Minister aware that the blanket ban on drift netting will affect so many coastal villages, along the west and south coasts in particular, that there will be implications for other sectors of inshore fishing? I refer in particular to lobster and crab fishermen and the added pressures that will be put on that sector when the people who have effectively been made redundant by the Minister's order are forced to partake in it.

Does the Minister accept the proposed compensation package has been described as totally inadequate by the former Minister of State at the Department of Communications, Marine and Natural Resources, Deputy Gallagher, who speaks with the experience of someone from a coastal community? Does the Minister recognise that the €5 million compensation package for affected rural communities is totally inadequate, considering the size of the sector involved and the isolated nature of coastal areas? Does he accept that the five year reference period he is using effectively represents a considerable restriction for the salmon fishing industry? The term of three to four months fishing was cut to 35 or 36 days.

Given that the package is being portrayed as some type of redundancy package and that there is a five year reference period, does the Minister not accept this is a slap in the face for those who have spent their lives in the industry to sustain their communities and local economies? The proposal is an insult to them. Will the severance package be taxed?

Mr. N. Dempsey

For all the reasons I outlined during the discussions, which I will not reiterate, a decision was made on whether the scheme should be voluntary. I do not dispute the Deputy's contention at the committee that this might cause difficulties as people try to operate in fisheries associated with other types of fish. However, this is not a reason to allow for the extinction of the salmon. The problem we face is diminishing salmon stocks, partly caused by drift-netting and partly by other factors, some of which we understand and some of which we do not. We made our decision in order to have an influence in an area over which we have some control, and we have done so in the best interest of conserving salmon stocks.

I do not agree with Deputy Ferris that the compensation is totally inadequate. I have outlined how the figure was calculated, which figure is based on a five year period. A net price of approximately €23 per salmon was arrived at after the subtraction of costs, and this was based on salmon above average weight and certainly above the average weight of those caught over recent years. A top price is accepted rather than a medium or low one. The individual payments from the hardship fund do not comprise a slap in the face and are quite generous. They are even more generous given that the State need not provide any payment at all.

Mr. Broughan

Is the Minister sure about that?

Mr. N. Dempsey

I am absolutely sure. We have legal obligations under both national and EU law, including the habitats directive. There is absolutely no obligation on the Government to provide any form of payment but we did not believe that providing none would be fair. We asked an independent group to make a recommendation to us. It did so and we accepted the recommendation on the basis on which it made it. I had it sanctioned by the Cabinet.

There is some difficulty over the five year period. We were trying to be generous in this regard. The reason some would have done less well in respect of this period is because there are fewer salmon. If we wait for another two or three years, there will be even fewer. The normal applicable period in such cases would encompass the last three years and the application of this period would be even more severe on all concerned. All in all, we have tried to balance the difficulties the period creates for the individuals and communities concerned with the other relevant factors and to alleviate as much hardship as possible.

Mr. Perry

The terms of reference given to the consultants were such that there could be only one outcome, that is, a complete ban on drift-net fishing. On the question of increasing the minimum payment, will the Minister consider the methodology for evaluating the licences? Certain individuals will not even recoup the cost of decommissioning their gear.

Given that the tax-free payment is quite minimal in certain cases, will the Minister not consider an option that would minimise the tax element? He said he is not obliged to make payments but the State has made substantial payments to the fishing community in the past.

Will the Minister consider the €5 million in community funding? He indicated at committee meetings that it would be distributed among State agencies. Will he not consider ring-fencing it in order that its benefits would be clearly apparent?

Mr. N. Dempsey

The Deputy may have misunderstood me at the committee. I did not say the €5 million in hardship funding would be spread among State agencies but that I expected it could be used to leverage other funds from other Departments and agencies. This is my intention and I have spoken on a number of occasions in this regard with the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs, Deputy Ó Cuív, who has community funding available to him. This funding could be allocated with a view to leveraging money from various schemes to enhance the value of the €5 million hardship fund.

My Minister of State and the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs have spoken on a number of occasions and I have spoken to a couple of representatives of drift-net fishermen to listen to proposals on alternative employment. When this consultation is finished, we may be able to produce a package. However, it will be very specific to the communities and very visible.

I have no function in tax matters as it is the Revenue Commissioners who decide whether an income is taxable. The independent group made the recommendation that all the compensation be paid in one tranche to assist people to move to a new business as quickly as possible, particularly those who had been deriving a large income from drift-netting. We have agreed from the beginning that if people want to spread the receipt of the payment over a two or three year period, they can do so. This would obviously have tax implications for them.

A radio interviewer told me people's livelihoods were being taken away and that they were only receiving €2,000 in compensation. The only people receiving this amount are those who have had a licence for the past six years and have not caught a salmon. Livelihoods are hardly at stake in such instances. Others are affected more severely.

Consider Deputy Perry's point on the terms of reference. The group was asked very specifically about the consequences and what recommendations it would make in view of us having to move because of scientific advice on which everyone in the House agreed. Most Members said that the Government should have moved in accordance with scientific advice two years previously. In fairness to the group, it met its terms of reference in full and without deviation.

Mr. Ferris

The Minister answered regarding taxation.

Mr. Perry

Regarding the equal valuation of salmon licences, the reference years used to calculate the final figures were based on a very difficult period. Will the Minister consider basing uniformity on the payment of licences and the tax element? Why was only €10 million provided in last week's Estimate for the fund, when the original figure was €25 million, with €5 million for the development fund? Will the €5 million in seed capital be retained and administered by the Department with the support of others?

Mr. N. Dempsey

I have not made a final decision on that, but my aim is that we should act to maximise the fund. The Deputy's other question concerned the €10 million in the Estimates. There was a cross-over between publication of the report and preparation of the Estimates, but whatever money is required within next year's €25 million budget will be provided, either through the Revenue or by way of Supplementary Estimate.

Postal Services.

Thomas P. Broughan

Ceist:

73 Mr. Broughan asked the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources if the Government will respond to the new proposal by European Commissioner, Mr. Charlie McCreevy, on abolishing the reserved areas for national postal operators for letters below 50 g; his views on the concerns of Ireland’s EU partner states such as France, Italy, Spain, Poland, Belgium and Greece that Commissioner McCreevy’s proposal will weaken customer service in the postal sector and lead to thousands of jobs losses; the way or the model by which he proposes to maintain the universal service obligation; if he will establish a new comprehensive postal services strategy to ensure that An Post is robust enough to meet the challenges of the fully liberalised market; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [39126/06]

Mr. N. Dempsey

The European Commission's proposal for a third postal directive envisages that the postal sector across the EU will be fully liberalised on 1 January 2009, subject to political agreement. The proposal is based on a Commission study on the impact on the universal service of the full accomplishment of a liberalised postal market. The study concludes that full market opening is achievable in all member states, including Ireland. It also concludes that liberalisation has the potential to create employment in the postal sector. The focus of the debate in Europe has now moved to the European Parliament and Council.

Liberalisation will undoubtedly encourage new entrants to the market. Other sectors that have liberalised as a result of developments at EU level, such as the telecommunications market, have provided greater consumer choice and achieved reduced prices, and I anticipate that liberalisation of the postal market will also have positive effects.

Ireland has fully implemented European Directives 97/67/EC and 2002/39/EC, which set out the requirements for member states regarding the provision of high-quality postal services and liberalisation of their postal networks. Under the directives, each member state is obliged to provide a universal service, whereby a minimum level of service must be provided. I understand that there are no proposals to amend those provisions in the third directive.

I am anxious to ensure the continued operation of a top-quality universal service and the highest levels of customer service, and Ireland's position on the proposals will reflect that view. No decision has yet been made on how provision of the universal service obligation should be financed in the absence of a reserved area. My departmental officials and I are currently considering various options in that regard. The proposed postal directive will be subject to Oireachtas scrutiny.

I believe that there will continue to be a key national role for An Post in delivering mail and parcels. However, over the coming years, competition can be expected to increase in these sectors, from the privately owned express sector, from large European public operators now looking for international business and from electronic substitution. Therefore, to deal with the challenges facing An Post in the coming years, the company's management, in conjunction with the trade unions, must deliver on restructuring agreements, particularly for mail.

The postal sector in Ireland needs An Post to be competitive and efficient. I believe that liberalisation and the expected increase in competition will ultimately be good for both An Post and consumers and that the company can continue to be a significant and strong player in the market after liberalisation.

Mr. Broughan

Regarding the Minister's comment on the operation of other deregulated markets, is it not correct that the result in the energy sector has been underinvestment, with amber and red alerts and blackouts? Has the Minister transmitted to Commissioner McCreevy the Government's view of the 2009 deadline? Many of his European counterparts have conveyed strong views to the Commissioner. For example, Mr. Alain Hutchinson MEP of the Parti Socialiste in Belgium has stated that the European directive, if adopted, would have disastrous consequences for Belgian citizens.

Perhaps Fine Gael might give me a chance to ask the question. This is the second time that its members have interrupted.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Order, please.

Mr. Broughan

Mr. Hutchinson believes that there would be heavy job losses, an increase in prices and a loss of services to those who need them most in communities, the elderly and frail, who would never be financially viable customers for private companies. That has been the reaction to Commissioner McCreevy's plans in many countries. I believe that the Minister was among those at the airport waving him goodbye when he left for Brussels, happy that he was going. Has he asked him about his plans and their impact on Ireland?

The Minister has spoken of models of maintaining the universal service obligation, but what are they and what subsidy would be required? Is he considering a territorial division, with an unbundling of the network in some areas and An Post delivering for other operators? Would there not then be a danger that certain operators, as they have intimated, will cherry-pick those parts of the network most valuable commercially?

What has the Minister done to create a universal service obligation and lay it before the House? Is a postal services Bill not an absolute necessity before the Government leaves office not only in this regard, but relating to a whole range of matters? Why has the Minister not prepared a strategy statement for An Post? He will soon leave office without having given us any strategy from 2010. What is his estimate of the number of people employed by An Post in 2010? Is the Fortis deal in jeopardy now that the Irish Postmasters' Union has said that it cannot support it owing to many of its members effectively working for rates below the minimum wage? The Minister will be leaving office with post offices closing at an approximate rate of one every ten days, such is his track record. The network is effectively closing down and falling apart owing to inaction on his part.

Has the Minister held any talks with his colleague, the Tánaiste and Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform, Deputy McDowell, regarding post office security in the wake of the "tiger" raids? Three have occurred since we last had the chance to put questions to the Minister, with postmistresses and their families subjected by criminals to the most dastardly treatment. What steps has the Minister taken to protect them?

Going back to when the Minister, Deputy Dermot Ahern, was Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources, the Government will have halved the post office network it inherited in 1997. It has dismantled it through its disgraceful and thoughtless attitude.

Mr. N. Dempsey

I was wondering when the Deputy would have another rhetorical tirade.

Mr. Broughan

That is the track record. The Minister should put it in his election literature.

Mr. N. Dempsey

He is usually good at that kind of thing during parliamentary questions, all doom and gloom.

Mr. Broughan

Until the new Government.

Mr. N. Dempsey

I was not aware that anyone waved Commissioner McCreevy off at the airport; I was certainly not there.

Mr. Broughan

Is the Minister sure?

Mr. N. Dempsey

I am absolutely sure, and I would not mislead the House as the Deputy did by making that claim.

Mr. Broughan

He taxied him out.

Mr. N. Dempsey

Ireland has participated fully in the debate on the liberalisation of postal services in Europe, not only in the last six months but for a longer period. The deadline of 1 January 2009 for the final liberalisation of those services has been in the public domain for a considerable period, before I became Minister. In the course of the labour relations difficulties at An Post a year ago and in the 12 months previous to that, I put it to those involved on more than one occasion, both unions and management, that liberalisation was hurtling down the track at a rate of knots and that we did not have time for the type of argy-bargy that had gone on for the previous 12 to 18 months. A year later, there is cause to be hopeful those industrial relations difficulties are behind us and that both unions and management can work together effectively. While those labour relations issues were being mediated through conciliation sessions and various triumvirates, I put it to both sides more than once that it would be better to focus on the future rather than the past. That remains the case.

It is a matter for An Post, both management and unions, rather than the Minister of the day to decide how the company will meet the challenges it faces. My job is to ensure, in the context of the discussions on the directive, that our postal services are capable of meeting those challenges. The Deputy asked me specifically how the universal service obligation might be maintained. There are several ways of doing this, one of which is the provision of reserved postal services areas. There is the possibility of a levy on all operators in the country to subsidise the less economically viable areas. Several options are being considered.

I do not believe the Fortis deal is in any danger. It will ultimately be of benefit to the post office network and the postmasters themselves. Discussions are ongoing between the latter and An Post management to reach agreement in this regard. This issue relates to contract staff and is not a case of negotiations between trade unions and management. I have spoken to both sides on the outstanding issues and am hopeful a resolution can be found quickly. It is a matter for the management and the Irish Postmasters Union, IPU.

The question of the optimum size of the post office network is an issue that has been discussed before. It is for An Post to make a decision in this regard as it is part of the mandate it is obliged to deliver. The IPU has clearly indicated its view that there are too many post offices. The document produced by Farrell Grant Sparks indicated the IPU's acceptance of this and its — not unreasonable — assertion that if staff are to leave the service, they should receive greater compensation than is currently the case.

In regard to security, I understand An Post has engaged with the appropriate authorities and taken advice on improving security provisions not only in recent weeks but in the course of the last 12 months.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The time for Priority Questions has expired. Before moving on to other questions, I call Deputy Perry who has requested permission to make a brief correction to the record regarding a previous parliamentary question.

Mr. Perry

In the course of discussion of Parliamentary Question No. 4 of 19 October 2006, which I tabled and which related to the Lost at Sea scheme, I asked:

How is it possible that two persons, both constituents of the then Minister, Deputy Fahey, received 75% of the funding allocated, which was a substantial amount of money?

I wish to correct the record to state:

How is it possible that two persons, both constituents of the then Minister, Deputy Fahey, received 75% of the tonnage allocated?