Adjournment Debate

Flood Relief

Deputy Pat Breen

I thank the Ceann Comhairle for giving me the opportunity to raise this important issue tonight. It is not often I get an opportunity to raise an issue in this Chamber that concerns my own parish, so I am delighted to have that chance. This serious matter relates to the embankments on the Fergus estuary, which cover the inner part of the Shannon estuary from outside Ennis.

In the 1960s the Office of Public Works, OPW, did a major upgrade on the embankments from Clarecastle to Islandavanna, and I compliment the work done at the time, along with the ongoing work on the embankments on the Fergus estuary. I am delighted to see the Minister of State at the Department of Finance, Deputy Martin Mansergh, is in the Chamber because he is in charge of these matters. Unfortunately, when the Office of Public Works did the work it ran out of money, or some parishioners have said the money was diverted. As a result, the job was unfinished. Through the years many efforts have been made by the local people, landowners and politicians to continue the upgrading but unfortunately, successive Governments have turned a blind eye to the issue. I remember as a young man being part of a deputation to the Office of Public Works on St. Stephen's Green, where we spoke with the late Joe Bermingham when he was a Minister of State. He was a colleague of the Acting Chairman. That is how long this problem is ongoing.

I raised this matter last year and at my request the Office of Public Works carried out a feasibility study on the conditions of the embankments and cost of repair. Unfortunately, the study found the cost of the works required on the embankments would outweigh the benefits that would accrue. This was a short-sighted view and although I understand the OPW has existing commitments to prioritise flood relief works in other areas, these embankments should be treated as a priority. I praise the work done by the OPW and the contracts signed recently for upgrading the Fergus embankments in Ennis; that came about as a result of the flooding from this time last year and I hope the work will continue.

The river could flood many houses in the urban areas but in rural areas much land — the livelihood of many farmers — can be flooded. Unfortunately, last weekend there was a very high tide covering the embankments in the area which resulted in a number of breaches in very weak areas. Nothing has been done with many of the banks through the years and with winter approaching and the likelihood of windy and stormy weather, more damage will be done. Hundreds of acres of land are likely to be flooded if some emergency works are not carried out on these embankments, which will result in farmers' livelihoods being affected. It is a significant issue in my own parish. I am not talking about just a few landowners but rather many farmers stretched over many miles.

I do not expect that in these recessionary times the OPW will be able to put in much money but I expect that following the feasibility study, some funding for emergency works will be provided to deal with current breaches. There is an old saying that a stitch in time saves nine and if breaches are allowed to continue, it would cost much more to fix damage done to the land. We are in a recession and landowners do not have excess money to fix these breaches because it is expensive to do so. The OPW has the dredgers to deal with the issue and has done great work in the areas along Clarecastle and Islandavanna.

I am delighted to see the Minister of State here tonight and I ask him if it is possible for him to procure emergency funding to fix the breaches in the embankments. There has been significant waste in public finances and a small amount of money would make a big difference to farmers in the region. I am pleading with him in my capacity as a parishioner in the area for any money to fix those breaches and prevent a bigger catastrophe later.

Minister of State at the Department of Finance (Deputy Martin Mansergh)

I thank Deputy Breen for raising the matter of breaches to the Fergus embankments this past weekend. I welcome the raising of such issues in the Dáil as before December 2009 such issues were practically never raised, and certainly not in my time as Minister of State.

This matter had not been brought to the attention of the Office of Public Works and it is understood that Clare County Council was also unaware of the event. The primary role for the immediate response to a serious flood event rests with the relevant local authority, which is in this case Clare County Council. In line with national flood policy, the OPW works with local authorities and other State bodies to implement programmes to mitigate future flood risk. In this regard, the OPW, in addition to implementing a range of non-structural measures, carries out a programme of major capital flood relief projects, such as the Ennis flood relief scheme, the second phase of which is currently at tender stage. The aim is to ensure that the preferred solution is one that will afford the required level of protection while also addressing any environmental issues and providing the best value for money.

The Office of Public Works also maintains those drainage schemes undertaken by the office under the arterial drainage Acts, including elements of the Fergus embankment system. Although designed primarily for drainage of agricultural land, these schemes also provide a degree of flood protection. The embankments in the Fergus system fall into three categories. There are those which are the responsibility of the Office of Public Works, those forming part of the Fergus drainage district and those that were in the past the responsibility of the Land Commission.

Following a survey in 1999, a comprehensive programme of major refurbishment works was carried out by Office of Public Works on approximately 14 km of those embankments for which the office is responsible at a total cost of approximately €1 million. The Office of Public Works continues to carry out weekly inspections of these embankments and, where maintenance works are considered necessary, they are undertaken as part of the office's annual programme of maintenance works, in accordance with its statutory obligations under the arterial drainage Acts.

Responsibility for maintenance of the embankments between Clarecastle and Ennis, which form part of the Fergus drainage district, rests with Clare County Council. It has been agreed recently with Clare County Council that a section of these embankments, which is closely linked to and impacts on the Ennis flood relief scheme, will be included in proposed additional flood defences for the town that will be undertaken by the Council with funding from the Office of Public Works.

The embankments that were formerly maintained by the Land Commission include those at Ballynacally, Inishdea, Kildysert and Carrickerry. Following the abolition of the Land Commission, maintenance works in some places have been carried out on these embankments by the relevant landowners. Following representations of behalf of property owners, the Office of Public Works undertook a preliminary study on the feasibility of upgrading the former Land Commission embankments in these areas, which was completed in 2008.

The study examined 27 separate embankments with a total length of approximately 30 km. These embankments generally protect polders or areas reclaimed from the estuary. No dwellings were found to be at risk of flooding in these areas. The study found that the cost of bringing the embankments up to the same standard as the embankments for which the Office of Public Works is responsible would exceed the benefit that would accrue, in most instances by a wide margin. It was concluded that upgrading the embankments to that standard could not be justified having regard to demands on the Office of Public Works for priority flood mitigation works at other locations.

In 2009, the Office of Public Works introduced the minor flood works scheme to provide funding to local authorities to address localised flood problems, where a solution had been identified or could be readily identified. The level of protection afforded by these works varies having regard to the level of risk in each location. To qualify for funding under this scheme, the local authority's proposals must be economically viable and environmentally sustainable.

In 2010 to date, in excess of €11.5 million has been allocated to local authorities under this scheme with approximately €600,000 allocated to Clare County Council. It is open to Clare County Council to apply for funding for mitigation works to those Fergus embankments not maintained by the Office of Public Works that meet the eligibility criteria of the minor flood works scheme. If an application were submitted by the council, it would be given every consideration having regard to the overall funding available to the Office of Public Works for flood risk management. The scheme is still open for further applications this year

Deputy Pat Breen

I hope the Minister of State will support an application from Clare County Council and I thank him for his reply.

Hospital Services

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

I wish to share time with Deputy Ciarán Lynch.

Acting Chairman (Deputy Jack Wall)

Is that agreed? Agreed.

Deputy Kathleen Lynch

A prosthetic clinic has been operating in St. Mary's Orthopaedic Hospital, Cork, for the past 21 years. I have testimony after testimony from patients, their parents and four plastic surgeons attesting to the quality, speed and delivery of services at this clinic. One of its patients recently participated and won a medal at the Paralympic Games. Her prosthesis was admired by other athletes for its flexibility and quality. The clinic in question deals mainly with children who have lost a limb, usually a leg, through meningitis or congenital deformity for example. The clinic has ensured they have a service second to none.

The clinic, however, is about to become defunct. I must declare an interest. The National Rehabilitation Hospital was extraordinarily good to me when I had to attend it and no one would deny it provides an excellent service. However, recently its consultant rehabilitation medical clinical director sent a letter to St. Mary's Orthopaedic Hospital stating that because the manufacture of prosthesis is not regulated, the clinic must be shut down and a new supplier put in place, Ability Matters, an English company with clinics in other parts of the country. When I checked its website, it appeared to deal mainly with aids for the elderly. While I do not doubt the company does a good job, in this case the provider does not know the children in question.

There also seems to be a large move towards centralising services. For the past five years I have been seeking the roll-out of the National Rehabilitation Hospital's services in the Cork area. What Cork does not need is a new provider of prostheses. A female doctor in a report on prosthetic clinical delivery in 1998 for the then Southern Health Board stated St. Mary's Orthopaedic Hospital was much more satisfactory on all counts with a strong emphasis on the humane aspects of service provision related to the economic support and information. The report further stated the average cost of a prosthesis per patient at the National Rehabilitation Hospital was 16% higher than at St. Mary's hospital.

The director of the Cork clinic told me of fitting the first limbs for a girl when she was a year old. She still returns to him at 21. This shows how some of the patients have developed with the clinic. One mother informed me how the clinic has no waiting list for children. If a child requires a prosthesis, it is made at the clinic. If it needs adjustment, as a result of growth, or a repair, it will be done on the same day. One cannot tell a child who outgrows his or her prosthesis that he or she will not get one for another six months. Instead, they would be condemned to a wheelchair and immobility. Moving this clinic makes no sense and should be stopped.

Deputy Ciarán Lynch

This service has been in Cork for more than 20 years with a proven and exemplary record in providing prosthetic services. There are two essential elements to prosthetic services. First, there is the measuring and fitting of the limb. Second, there is the provision of aftercare and support services required by patients. There are concerns among users of this service as to what will happen to them in the future. Many of them are asking why should a service that works so well be dismantled by the HSE and the National Rehabilitation Hospital while a lesser service is put in its place. This is a local service meeting local needs that has built up a wealth of experience in the past 20 years. Deputy Kathleen Lynch attested to this with her example of the young woman who grew up with the service.

Were studies carried out into the costs of moving this service and, more importantly, its impact on patient care? People are really worried about this. People who have had limbs fitted and are getting aftercare, support and adjustments are now asking who will provide the aftercare and adjustment services if there is a change of company? It is a critical question which the Minister needs to answer. We could have a situation where people who have had limbs fitted in the past 12 months or two years now find that they will have to have their limbs refitted because the new company is coming into operation which will not deal with patients who had their limbs fitted by another company.

Minister of State at the Department of Finance (Deputy Martin Mansergh)

I am replying to this Adjournment matter on behalf of my colleague, the Minister, Deputy Mary Harney. Prosthetics services in Cork currently involve a number of private service providers working out of St. Mary's Orthopaedic Hospital, St. Finbarr's Hospital and North Valley Business Centre, Blackpool, and the National Rehabilitation Hospital, which provides a service on the St. Finbarr's Hospital campus. The service currently operating from St. Mary's Orthopaedic Hospital campus is one of a number of services to which the HSE has been referring a number of its patients over the years. I wish to assure the House that the HSE has no plans to change the arrangements whereby public patients can access this service.

The HSE is, however, planning to move the prosthetics services currently based at St. Finbarr's Hospital. The premises being used for this service are no longer fit for purpose and the HSE is satisfied that the interests of the users of the service will best be served by relocating the current National Rehabilitation Hospital-delivered and HSE-sponsored amputee clinic from St. Finbarr's Hospital to a purpose-built facility at the Mercy University Hospital, Cork.

Amputee rehabilitation is specialist rehabilitation and needs to be done under the care of a consultant in rehabilitation medicine. The HSE's aim is to ensure that a comprehensive rehabilitation service is available to persons who have had or will have an amputation. The service which will operate from the Mercy University Hospital will be a consultant-led service, subject to all the tenets of good clinical governance and best practice. The necessary specialist technical staff will be available on a daily basis and a consultant in rehabilitation medicine with a sub-specialty interest in the rehabilitation of amputees will provide a service on a weekly basis. This represents a substantial upgrading from the service levels currently available at St. Finbarr's. It will be open to patients currently attending the service at St. Mary's to switch their attendance to the new Mercy service, if they so wish.

The consultations on the new facilities at the Mercy Hospital were undertaken at every stage of planning and development. This included meetings with representatives of Amputee Ireland. These initiatives demonstrate the HSE's commitment to improving the provision of this important rehabilitation and ongoing care services for people who have undergone an amputation or who have otherwise suffered the loss of a limb.

Passport Security

Deputy Seán Barrett

I thank the Ceann Comhairle for giving me the opportunity to raise this matter. I would have raised it as a priority question but the latest event occurred past the date for submitting such questions.

The abuse of Irish passports is gravely worrying and reflects a failure, I am sad to say, on behalf of those responsible for the implementation of effective security measures to protect the security of Irish passports following the events that occurred in Dubai earlier this year. It is becoming increasingly clear that international undercover agents are accessing the passport information of Irish citizens with ease for use during their covert operations. It has taken the exposure of a Russian spy ring to highlight the latest abuses and as was the case in Dubai the Irish authorities were completely oblivious to the theft of information until other governments pointed it out.

It was initially reported that only one Irish passport was involved in the uncovering of the spy ring in the United States but it has now emerged that several Irish passports are involved. The security of British passports was significantly reinforced immediately following the Dubai assassination but no such security enhancements have been implemented to protect Irish passports, despite the fact that they were abused in exactly the same manner. I would like to mention the sort of security reinforcements which have occurred in Britain. It has changed, with effect from 1 October, the passports it will issue. New passports will incorporate images of well-known scenes recreated through special printing techniques. The new passport replaces the e-passport which was brought in four years ago to comply with the United States' visa waiver programme.

Other security features, I understand, include moving the chip that stores the holder's details to the inside of the passport cover so it is no longer visible and adding a transparent covering, which includes several holograms. The new passport images will also stretch across two pages instead of one. I point this out because there is research on how one can further improve the security of passports. I have no doubt that if we do not have the wherewithal in this country to do that we could perhaps contact the identity and passport service in the United Kingdom to see if we could copy its new methods of improving security.

I was also disturbed that until yesterday it would appear that no contact was made with the Russian Embassy despite the fact that when the Dubai scandal broke the Government called in the Israeli ambassador and, ultimately, an Israeli diplomat was expelled. I do not know why we seem to have failed to act as quickly with the Russian Embassy but I also read that visas were issued from that embassy in respect of passports which were ultimately forged, with the original user's passport was forged.

There are serious questions to be answered. I hope the Minister of State will give an assurance that every possible step is being taken to guarantee the sanctity of the Irish passport which for many generations was regarded very highly. I hope it will continue to have a high reputation throughout the world. We do not want to be involved in spy rings and other activities of a corrupt nature. I sincerely hope that the Minister of State, Deputy Power, whom I am delighted to see in the House, can give us a guarantee that these security steps will be taken, answers will be obtained from the Russian Embassy and the appropriate action taken, if necessary, so that we will not have any recurrence of this situation and that other possible abuses may be sent a warning that Ireland will not tolerate this type of behaviour under any circumstances.

Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs (Deputy Peter Power)

I thank Deputy Barrett for raising this important issue.

On Sunday, 27 June, US federal agents arrested ten people in the states of New York, New Jersey, Virginia and Massachusetts for allegedly carrying out long-term deep cover assignments in the United States on behalf of the Russian Federation. A total of 11 defendants, including the ten arrested, were charged with conspiring to act as unlawful agents of the Russian Federation within the United States, while at that time one defendant remained at large. The affidavit lodged by the Federal Bureau of Investigations, FBI, to justify the bringing of charges against the defendants alleged that one of the defendants travelled to Moscow using a false Irish passport and that another travelled on a false British passport. A search of the Irish passport database confirmed that a valid Irish passport with the same details as those on the alleged false Irish passport had issued in 2001 to an Irish citizen.

On being made aware of these allegations, the Minister for Foreign Affairs asked the passport service and An Garda Síochána to undertake an investigation into the alleged use of a false Irish passport. This investigation is under way at present and it would be inappropriate for me, at this stage, to speculate on its conclusions. However, I can inform Deputy Barrett that the Garda has since received information alleging that as many as six Irish forged passports using material cloned from the valid passports of Irish citizens may have been used and involved in the case in question.

I can confirm that a small number of citizens have been interviewed by the Garda and the passport service. While there is no evidence that those whose passport details have allegedly been used are under any threat or have been inconvenienced while travelling, they are, as a precautionary measure, being issued with replacement passports.

There has been no delay in carrying out the ongoing investigations. The allegation of the fraudulent use of Irish passports was made by the agency of a foreign government in a foreign jurisdiction and concerned events outside this jurisdiction. Accordingly, the investigation requires the assistance of agencies from other countries. The process of gathering and substantiating evidence in such circumstances has therefore been time consuming but it is hoped that the investigations will be completed within a couple of weeks.

The Government regards the fraudulent use of Irish passports as a most serious matter and we constantly seek to improve the security of passports. I understand that the passport books allegedly used were of a type produced by the passport service prior to 2005. There have since been major enhancements to the security features of the current passport book and the Government is satisfied that this now makes the production of a counterfeit Irish passport much more difficult, although clearly not impossible for agencies with substantial resources. In addition, procedures for confirming the identity of first-time passport applicants have been tightened with a view to preventing fraud during the application process.

The Government's concern about these allegations has been conveyed to the Russian authorities. On 1 October, senior officials of the Department of Foreign Affairs informed the Russian ambassador and a senior official from Moscow who was visiting Dublin on other business that the Government was investigating US allegations on the use of forged Irish passports by Russian agents and made clear that the Government takes serious exception to the forgery and misuse of Irish passports. The Russian officials were also informed that, depending on the outcome of the current inquiries, the Government may seek the assistance of the Russian authorities in furthering this investigation.

I would point out that there are significant differences between the current case and that involving the use of forged Irish passports by Israeli agents earlier this year. In the Israeli case, the announcement by the Dubai authorities of the alleged use of forged Irish passports was accompanied by the publication of photocopies of the documents in question and video evidence linking the persons whose photos appeared in the forged passports with a murder for which Israel refused to deny charges of responsibility. In the circumstances, it was entirely appropriate to immediately call in the Israeli ambassador and to ask for Israel's assistance in explaining the matter. In the current case, where less evidence was publicly available at the time the allegation was made, the Minister for Foreign Affairs decided first to assess the nature of the evidence collated by the Garda and the passport service before deciding whether he himself should meet with the Russian ambassador.

I am aware many Members of the House will have seen a headline in a newspaper this morning which suggested that the Russian ambassador, in a meeting with the representative of an NGO operating in Russia, sought to link the passport allegations with progress on the negotiation of a bilateral agreement with Russia on adoption. These reports have been checked out, including with the NGO representative in question, and I can assure the House that there is no substance whatsoever to this headline. Furthermore, I can categorically state that there has been no attempt by the Russian authorities to link the passport allegation to any aspect of our bilateral relations.

Ireland and Russia have traditionally enjoyed very good relations as evidenced by the successful visit to Russia undertaken last month by President McAleese. Russia is an important trading partner and growing market for Irish goods and services as well as a permanent member of the UN Security Council.

Situating this matter in its international context, we should not forget that the US allegation that a Russian agent had used a fake Irish passport was part of a wider US claim that a Russian spy ring was operating on its territory. This announcement was made only days after a highly successful visit to the US by the President of Russia. The spy ring episode was quickly and amicably settled with no apparent harm to US-Russia bilateral relations. Furthermore, the British Foreign Secretary is in Moscow today seeking to develop UK-Russia relations, notwithstanding recent strains and the allegation concerning the use of a forged British passport by a member of the same spy ring.

This is not to belittle the importance of allegations which, if confirmed, would represent a very serious affront to Irish sovereignty and to the Irish citizens whose identities have allegedly been cloned, but rather to situate this incident in the wider perspective of the conduct of international relations. Regardless of such considerations, whenever the Government has solid evidence that Irish passports have been forged or misused by a foreign government or its agents, we will, in accordance with the Irish national interest, make clear our strong objection in a firm and appropriate manner.

Once the Minister for Foreign Affairs, my colleague Deputy Micheál Martin, has received the reports of the Garda and the passport service into these most serious allegations, he will consider the evidence presented to him before reporting to the Government and recommending whatever course of action he believes appropriate. He will then inform the House on the findings of the investigation and any action the Government should decide to take on foot of those reports.

Social Welfare Benefits

Deputy Tom Sheahan

I wish to discuss the amount of time it takes to process disability allowance and disability benefit claims. Recently, I spoke to a community welfare officer who told me that either 6,500 or 8,500 claims are in that office at present awaiting decision. To make my point I will recount two anecdotal cases.

A man claiming jobseeker's benefit working at home with a disk saw mutilated his finger. He contacted the social welfare office and stated what had happened. The jobseeker's benefit payment was stopped immediately and the man was told he would have to apply for disability benefit, which he did. I must stress this man would not know the system inside out. The accident happened last March and his claim for disability allowance arrived in the office on 27 May. On 4 October he received a reply to state that he was refused. He was told by the social welfare office to give up his jobseeker's benefit because he was not available for work because of his injury. He applied for disability allowance and was refused. He was told that his case had been considered by a medical assessor who expressed the opinion that he was unsuitable for disability allowance because all of the required medical criteria were not satisfied. He meets both required criteria.

I thank the Minister for coming to the House and I appreciate and understand that he inherited the Department. Will he tell the House what medical qualifications do the medical assessors have? To the best of my knowledge they have none. If any medic saw the state of this man's hand and finger he or she would not disallow him disability benefits. We will appeal it but I believe this man has been victimised by the system. He has not received a cent since the accident happened last March and it is now October. I do not know how long it will take for this appeal to go before the chief appeals officer, who will not see his hand either, but he has received no payment whatsoever since March last.

In another case, while in hospital for a minor procedure there was serious harm done to a neighbour of mine, so much so that today I applied for an E111 form where he must go to England for treatment. Ten months ago that man applied for disability allowance. He has been refused because he was considered by a medical assessor to be unsuitable for disability allowance because all the medical criteria listed were not satisfied. That is ten months ago, and his wife and two children have got nothing from the State. In those ten months he has spent 83 days in hospital and he has not got a shilling from the State. Will the Minister tell me the number of medical assessors in his Department who can make the assessment, without seeing the injuries of these two particular persons, that they cannot work?

Minister for Social Protection (Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív)

First, I thank Deputy Tom Sheahan for raising the question on the Adjournment. I assure him that, within the law and the terms of the scheme, every effort is being made to deal with all applications under the various schemes as expeditiously as possible. As he is probably aware, there was a significant increase in the number of applications under the various schemes in recent years.

There are currently 6,477 disability allowance claims awaiting decision and this represents 6.4% of the total number currently in receipt of disability allowance, DA. The numbers in receipt of disability allowance have increased year on year. At the end of September 2010, there were 101,042 in receipt of the allowance, representing an increase of 4,970 or 5% over the number of recipients in January 2009. The average number of weeks taken to decide a disability allowance claim in September 2010 was 10.69 weeks, and 59% of all claims were decided within 12 weeks.

To be eligible for disability allowance, a claimant must satisfy a medical assessment, a means test and be habitually resident in the State. All aspects of the claim must be decided before the customer is notified of the decision.

The processing time for individual disability allowance claims may vary in accordance with their relative complexity in terms of the three main criteria to which I referred. Certain claims have to be referred to social welfare inspectors for means investigation and this can add to the overall processing times. One third of the claims awaiting decision are currently with inspectors. In addition, factors outside the Department's control can have an impact, for example, incomplete application forms, the supply of relevant information by the customer, that is, bank account details, details of spouses earnings, information from employers or third parties.

Anyone who is under financial pressure while awaiting a decision on his or her claim can apply for supplementary welfare allowance from his or her local community welfare officer.

My Department is committed to delivering the best possible service to its customers. Operational processes and procedures and the organisation of work are continually reviewed in all areas of the Department, including disability allowance section, to ensure that claims are processed and decided in the most efficient and expeditious way possible, having regard to the eligibility conditions that apply to each scheme.

Measures introduced by the Department to address the efficiency of DA claim processing include the review of existing processes and procedures with the objective of reducing delays in claim processing, the review of ongoing staffing deployment and the judicious application of overtime working.

An increasing number of claims are now desk assessed for means purposes, thus reducing the numbers being sent to social welfare inspectors and improving the overall times for claim processing. With regard to medical assessment, all claims are now being desk assessed by the medical assessors of the Department, thus obviating the need to call the vast majority of claimants for medical examinations.

This is where certification from the medical practitioners who fill up the application forms is so vital. In an effort to speed up the operation, and rather than call everybody for medical examination as there are many black and white cases of eligibility for disability allowance, we are trying to have better certification from the doctors coming in so that the doctor assessing does not need to see the patient because he or she already has the information from the original medical examination, in other words, that we take it that the examination carried out by the applicant's doctor is thorough and gives us the information. I am sure the Deputy will agree that this approach makes sense. Of course, it leads to a situation where some applicants will not be happy with the decision. In such a case, obviously, the person can look for a revised decision and then we can carry out a physical examination.

I have been encouraging the Department to look at, as a first process, having better documentation coming in because we can only make decisions on documentation coming in. If we get good documentation and if it answers the questions clearly — remember in many cases it is disability to work is the issue — then we can make quicker decisions and need not have to physically have a medical officer check everybody. Obviously, however, if that does not resolve the issue, then one must fall back on the physical examination, and, of course, the right of appeal also exists.

One argument I have with some commentators is that they are always on about policy. I agree with the Deputy, that for the ordinary punter in the street it does not matter how good the policy is if the actual delivery of the service does not match it. I could have the best policies as Minister for Social Protection but unless the person can get the payment to which he or she feels entitled, or get a fair process to show he or she is not entitled to the payment after the appeals process, all of the policy is a waste of time.

We are trying systematically, in view of the increased number of applicants to get a speedier decision making process in the first round, have a review within the Department, and then one goes to appeal. Even at appeal stage, if new information is provided we go back to the deciding officer and ask him or her to review it again before we go through the appeals mechanism. In that way, we would hope in a range of processes that we can reduce processing time and give a much more satisfactory service.

I must state on behalf of the appeals office, in justification, that the number of appeals grew significantly with the number of applications, but that is cold comfort to the public. Therefore, they are working with me proactively to try see how we reduce the waiting times for decisions, both at the first application and on appeal.

Deputy Tom Sheahan

With the Acting Chairman, Deputy Wall's, indulgence, could the Minister inform me what qualifications the medical assessors have?

Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív

I could get that detail. My understanding is they are medical practitioners. On that matter, the Chief Medical Officer, the person with whom I mainly have had dealings in the Department, is a very fine medical practitioner and I understand is very experienced in occupational medicine, and I have found him to be a very fair minded person. He is working to try see how all of these procedures can be improved. He has done a great deal of work, even on the design of the certification so that we manage to get the information we require to make good decisions. It is partly medical and partly also related to the design of forms, etc., so that the information we get in is perhaps better than it was in the past.

While I am taking the Deputy into another subject here, I genuinely feel this is an important matter where we all can make progress. As he is probably aware, often doctors give a certificate to an applicant for all sorts of schemes only outlining the medical condition. However, as I stated in the Dáil committee today, schemes often have an issue, not only on what is the actual medical condition but on whether, for example, a person applying for carer's allowance needs full-time care and attention or a person applying for disability allowance or illness benefit is capable for work taking into account his or her qualifications, experience, etc., depending on one's qualifications and experience, and the type of work one does. A roofer in a wheelchair could not operate, but the Deputy and I know other people in wheelchairs who are in very senior roles because they have desk jobs. From my personal experience as a Deputy, one of the problems up to now has been that it was not enough to get the medical assessment, but that the next issue was whether the person was capable for work in the opinion of the original doctor taking into account whether he or she was labouring or had a desk job, and the kind of work concerned. There is work we can do to speed up the process by trying to get that information in the first round and save all of us, particularly the applicants for our schemes, much heartache and grief.

I sometimes hear people saying that the Department is holding back for some financial reason. I can assure the Deputy nothing is further from the truth for a great many reasons which he can figure out. With the amount of money involved, if the allowance is given in the end, there is no saving for the Department because we give the arrears to the date of application. There is no messing like that going on; everything is done to the staff's best ability. There is no hidden agenda.

That said, we can do the job better and the Department is open to doing so. I have been very impressed going around to the country to the various offices. I was down in Killarney recently where we spent two hours going through all of the mechanisms there discussing how we can have better delivery mechanisms right throughout the Department. My experience of the staff is that they are definitely up for it. They are fantastic staff committed to the work they do and I believe we can do things better in the future.

The Dáil adjourned at 9.40 p.m. until 10.30 a.m. on Thursday, 14 October 2010.

Dáil Éireann díospóireacht - Wednesday, 13 Oct 2010