Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Tuesday, 26 Mar 2013

Vol. 797 No. 3

Order of Business

The Taoiseach

It is proposed to take No. 12, motion re referral to joint committee of proposed approval by Dáil Éireann for a regulation of the European Parliament and of the Council amending Council Regulation (EC) No. 1346/2000 on insolvency proceedings; and No. 27, Health (Alteration of Criteria for Eligibility) Bill 2013 - Committee and Remaining Stages.

It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that the Dáil shall sit later than 9 p.m. tonight and shall adjourn on the adjournment of Private Members' business which shall be No. 105, motion re mortgage arrears, which shall be taken on the conclusion of No. 27 or at 7.30 p.m., whichever is the later, and adjourn after 90 minutes; that No. 12 shall be decided without debate; and that Committee and Remaining Stages of No. 27 shall be taken today and the proceedings thereon shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion after two hours by one question which shall be put from the Chair, and which shall, in relation to amendments, include only those set down or accepted by the Minister for Health.

An Ceann Comhairle

There are three proposals to put to the House. Is the proposal that the Dáil shall sit later than 9 p.m. agreed to? Agreed. Is the proposal that No. 12, motion re referral to joint committee of proposed approval by Dáil Éireann for a regulation of the European Parliament and Council without debate, agreed to? Agreed. Is the proposal for dealing with No. 27, Committee and Remaining Stages of the Health (Alteration of Criteria for Eligibility) Bill 2013 agreed to?

Deputy Micheál Martin

No. The Bill was published last Friday week and Committee and Remaining Stages are to be taken today. The legislation will enable the Minister for Health to change the eligibility criteria for medical cards without ever having to return to the House again. It provides the Minister with extraordinary powers to determine who will be eligible for a medical card into the future. In addition, the Bill will remove approximately 20,000 medical cards from the system. Some 20,000 people, mainly senior citizens aged over 70 years, will lose their medical cards as a result of the Bill. The Bill is going through the Oireachtas at the speed of light and any scrutiny is hardly reported. There is a need for more reflection on the Bill, in particular on foot of the serious ramifications of the way sensitive, private, personal data is handled and exchanged among the HSE, the Department of Social Protection and the Revenue Commissioners. It smacks of Big Brother and will cause concern to many citizens.

Rather than guillotine the Bill today, the debate should be open-ended and more time should be made available for reflection and consideration of its provisions. Above all, eligibility criteria should be determined by the House into the future.

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

I object to the guillotining of the debate on No. 27. True to form, the Taoiseach wants to rush through in record time a measure which will penalise people. He is not prepared to have sufficient democratic scrutiny or debate. It is bad enough that the Taoiseach wants to take medical cards from people but he does not even want to afford Members of the House and the Opposition in particular the full opportunity to scrutinise these matters and to challenge the Taoiseach yet again on poor policy.

The Taoiseach

This is a budgetary matter that was referred to in the Budget Statement.

Deputy Seamus Kirk

It was not in the programme for Government or the Fine Gael manifesto.

The Taoiseach

Quite some time has been spent on it. It is due for commencement as a legislative measure on 1 April 2013 and is due in the Seanad tomorrow.

Question, "That the proposal for dealing with No. 27 be agreed to", put and declared carried.

Deputy Micheál Martin

At the conclusion of Croke Park II, which is causing distress to many public servants in terms of the impact on their take home pay, the Taoiseach indicated to the House, as did the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, Deputy Howlin, that three items of legislation will be required to implement sectoral aspects of the agreement. The health sector has been isolated and hung out to dry and I understand legislation will be required to reduce the pay of nurses, health care workers and those working in the front line of the health sector. Likewise, other sectors in the public service are in the same position. Can the Taoiseach indicate the timeline for the introduction of the three items of legislation to which the Taoiseach and the Minister have committed?

The Taoiseach

I do not have an exact timeline. I think it is appropriate that the trade unions have the opportunity to reflect and consider their views and the negotiations that have concluded in respect of Croke Park II.

Deputy Micheál Martin

Even if they vote in favour of it, there must be legislation. There must be legislation irrespective of the vote. The Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, Deputy Howlin, has made this clear in his press conference.

The Taoiseach

I do not have the timeline and I will wait for the response on 17 April.

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

I also want to raise the issue of legislation arising from the Croke Park deal. Legislation will be required irrespective of the view the trade union membership takes. One of the items of legislation is a new financial emergency measures in the public interest Bill. I do not yet have an idea of how the other items of legislation will be framed. The new Croke Park deal takes effect on 1 July. It lacks credibility for the Taoiseach to say he has no notion of the timeline of the legislation. Officials in the relevant Departments probably have the legislation drafted. How many items of legislation are required? Will one of them be another financial emergency measures in the public interest Bill? When will we see these items of legislation?

The Taoiseach

Hopefully the decision of the trade unions ballot will be known by 17 April.

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

That is irrelevant.

The Taoiseach

It is only appropriate that they be given the opportunity to deliberate on the discussions and negotiations that took place. There is no promised financial emergency measures in the public interest Bill of which the Deputy speaks. Hopefully the decision will be a positive one but it is a matter for the unions to make a decision through their ballots on 17 April.

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

Is the Taoiseach saying that, if the trade unions reject the deal, there will be no legislation? Is that the import of what the Taoiseach is saying?

Deputy Micheál Martin

On a point of order, on the Order of Business we are to ask about promised legislation. Irrespective of the outcome of the vote, the legislation is promised. The minimum we need from the Taoiseach, as head of Government, is an indication of the timeline for the legislation that must be published irrespective of the vote result. If there is a "Yes" vote, legislation must be published.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Taoiseach has given an answer. Deputy Martin may not like the answer.

Deputy Micheál Martin

It is incredible that Taoiseach does not know or will not tell us.

An Ceann Comhairle

I cannot do anything about that.

Deputy Micheál Martin

Maybe his timeline is tomorrow.

The Taoiseach

I have already said it is appropriate that, after these intensive discussions, the unions should have the process and time to deliberate and cast their ballots on the discussions that took place. This affects all public servants and is a matter of considerable importance.

Deputy Micheál Martin

Will the Taoiseach send it onto us? Will the Taoiseach communicate with us?

An Ceann Comhairle

I suggest Deputy Martin discusses these matters with the Whips.

Deputy Mattie McGrath

In view of what is emerging about people's homes being repossessed and legislation concerning the Personal Insolvency Act, can the Taoiseach give us an update? Will people's homes be protected and will it be as a last resort that people come breaking down doors or barging into people's homes? The home must be the castle and must be protected at all costs.

The Taoiseach

It is Government policy to protect home ownership where possible. Repossession should only be applicable as a last resort.

Deputy Michael Healy-Rae

With regard to the property tax, there is great confusion about what is happening. The guidelines sent out with regard to banding-----

An Ceann Comhairle

We are not dealing with guidelines.

Deputy Michael Healy-Rae

My point is on promised legislation, if the Ceann Comhairle will let me finish. Taking the banding that townlands are in-----

An Ceann Comhairle

That is detail and cannot be dealt with on the Order of Business.

Deputy Michael Healy-Rae

The demand going to the people------

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy should table a parliamentary question.

Deputy Michael Healy-Rae

-----is not in correspondence with the banding of the townland as described. The whole thing is a shambles.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy should resume his seat.

Deputy Michael Healy-Rae

My question is whether there is a proposal, considering the error-----

An Ceann Comhairle

That is not a question on promised legislation. The legislation has already been passed.

Deputy Ray Butler

When is the expected publication of the trust Bill, to reform and consolidate the general law relating to trustees so as to deal better with, and protect, trust assets?

The Taoiseach

There is no date yet for the publication of the Bill.

Deputy Billy Kelleher

When will the health (private patient charges) Bill be brought before the Dáil? It is quite urgent in view of the fact the Taoiseach cannot give an answer on the legislation required for the change to the Croke Park deal. It is already included in HSE budgets. It is important we get clarity quickly in terms of the legislation for Croke Park.

In view of the newfound ability of the Taoiseach to get mortgages for people, should I refer my constituents who cannot get credit to the Taoiseach or to the Credit Review Office?

An Ceann Comhairle

That is a parliamentary question.

Deputy Tom Hayes

He is powerful but not that powerful.

Deputy Billy Kelleher

It is an important point.

Deputy Paul Kehoe

A few Members on the Opposition side could tell us about mortgages.

Deputy Billy Kelleher

The Taoiseach is going into banks. It is important to get clarity on whether it is the Credit Review Office or the Taoiseach's office-----

An Ceann Comhairle

It will not be on the Order of Business.

Deputy Billy Kelleher

-----that reviews credit refusals by banks.

The Taoiseach

The health (private patient charges) Bill will be taken in April. I am not responsible for the allocation of mortgages. By coincidence, the person yesterday received an immediate response and an introduction. I asked her to advise me how discussions went and I hope that in the newfound openness of the lending institution involved, the good lady and her husband will be considered very carefully for a mortgage for which they applied in the constituency of Meath East yesterday. It brought an immediate response.

Deputy Niall Collins

Like at Lisdoonvarna, the Taoiseach gave an introduction.

Deputy Billy Kelleher

The Taoiseach might send me his constituency clinic address.

The Taoiseach

I am not advising that the Deputy hangs outside the doors of the banks.

Deputy Paul Kehoe

I would go to my party leader before Deputy Kelleher's.

Deputy Brian Stanley

I asked the Taoiseach about the Constitutional Convention and any electoral reform he may have planned. The people of Meath go to the polls tomorrow and the Taoiseach has sawed two hours off the voting day, held it in midweek-----

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy is out of order. We are not talking about tomorrow's by-election. The Deputy will not get an answer and should not waste his breath.

Deputy Brian Stanley

-----and has gone away from the practice of holding it on Thursdays, Fridays and Saturdays in the case of referendums. The Taoiseach is denying 12-hour shift workers, commuters and students. These people cannot vote. They are denied the opportunity to vote and I appeal to the Taoiseach at the 11th hour to open the polling stations until 10 p.m. The Minister, Deputy Phil Hogan, did this on 6 March-----

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Stanley should resume his seat.

Deputy Thomas P. Broughan

When will we see the criminal justice (corruption) Bill? A few weeks ago, before the St. Patrick's Day break, I asked the Taoiseach about the Priory Hall situation. Can the Taoiseach give an indication if the resolution process will be happening in the next few months, given that people are still homeless?

The Taoiseach

Deputy Broughan will have to repeat his second question.

Deputy Thomas P. Broughan

It was about Priory Hall.

The Taoiseach

I do not have a date of publication of the criminal justice Bill. In respect of Deputy Brian Stanley's comment-----

An Ceann Comhairle

Do not go there.

The Taoiseach

-----I recall that people from his party-----

An Ceann Comhairle

The Taoiseach is encouraging him.

The Taoiseach

-----were miraculously able to get people who had long been laid to rest to vote in different elections.

Deputy Brian Stanley

I ask the Taoiseach to withdraw that remark.

An Ceann Comhairle

Will the Taoiseach answer Deputy Thomas P. Broughan's question on the other issue?

Deputy Brian Stanley

The evidence shows the opposite.

An Ceann Comhairle

Will the Deputy please resume his seat? What about Deputy Thomas P. Broughan's question?

The Taoiseach

On what?

Deputy Thomas P. Broughan

On a resolution at Priory Hall and Mr. Justice Finnegan's-----

The Taoiseach

The Minister, Deputy Phil Hogan, is dealing with the matter.

(Interruptions).

Deputy Thomas P. Broughan

He is not dealing with it; that is the point.

The Taoiseach

I understand progress is being made.

Deputy Thomas P. Broughan

Will the Taoiseach look after the issue?

The Taoiseach

I will advise the Deputy of the progress made.

An Ceann Comhairle

I call Deputy Bernard J. Durkan. As it is his birthday, I extend my congratulations to him.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

I feel neglected already.

An Ceann Comhairle

Seeing as it is the Deputy's birthday, I will allow him to speak.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

Have the heads of the employment permits Bill which has been promised been approved by the Cabinet? When is the Bill likely to be brought before the House? Have the heads of the medical capacity Bill, otherwise known as the assisted decision making capacity Bill, an important Bill, been approved or when is it likely that they will be approved? When will the Bill be brought before the House?

The Taoiseach

The heads of both Bills have been approved. I thought the employment permits Bill might get through this session, but it will not. It will be taken in the next session, as will the mental capacity Bill.