Léim ar aghaidh chuig an bpríomhábhar
Gnáthamharc

Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 8 Nov 2023

Vol. 1045 No. 2

Domestic, Sexual and Gender-Based Violence Agency Bill 2023: Report and Final Stages

I move amendment No. 1:

In page 18, to delete lines 16 and 17 and substitute the following:

“21. (1) The Minister may, following consultation with the chief executive, appoint such and so many officers of the Minister as the Minister may determine to be members of staff of the Agency.”.

It is great to engage on this again with the Minister. We had a discussion on this on Committee Stage when myself and Deputy Pa Daly had tabled similar amendments. The key to this is the insertion of the words "following consultation with the chief executive". We feel that the chief executive of this agency should have a consultative role vis-à-vis the Minister in terms of appointing any new officers. The explanation given by the Minister is that this should be understood and that there are other written understandings around this but we feel that it should be made explicit in the legislation itself.

This does not just come from myself or Deputy Daly; it comes from those working in the sector who have been dealing with this issue for a prolonged period of time. When they engaged with members of the Opposition, they encouraged us to table amendments and this comes from a level of experience in dealing with the Department of Justice and with various Ministers. While they are very appreciative of the measures the Minister is introducing, they feel that this is an appropriate measure to insert. It would specify, within legislation, that consultation with the chief executive would be required.

Briefly, to follow on from what Deputy Ó Ríordáin said, NGOs within the sector wanted the agency to have some more autonomy. We need accountability within the agency, so the Minister being directly responsible is not necessarily negative but we feel that this provides a good balance. We wish to support Deputy Ó Ríordáin's amendment.

I fully support the work the Minister is doing on this Bill. It is immensely important. I want to highlight my own area. I am very conscious of the fact that a large amount of the work the Minister has been doing over the last number of years is around providing, developing and investing in women's refuges and safe homes for women and families who find themselves in a position where they need a safe haven and an environment in which they can be protected. What is also really important is that wraparound services are fully provided to compliment and encompass the safe environment that we are trying to create for women and families right across the country.

I am very mindful of the fact that a number of constituencies do not yet have these facilities but I am heartened and inspired by the work the Minister is doing in terms of supporting Tusla. One of the complaints over the years has been that when women and families find themselves in those awful situations, they often have to go from one Department to another to find the support that they need and to get the lift and the protection they need. I am really heartened to see that finally we are moving to a stage where this agency will be able to provide all of that. People will not have to go to the Departments of Social Protection and Housing, Heritage and Local Government or find social workers and so on. We will have a one-stop-shop that will provide the services and give women the confidence they need. The work that the Minister is doing here is sending a very clear message to women and children across the country who may be fearful of leaving a difficult situation, who may not have the wherewithal or the financial means to do so or who may not have the support they need within their immediate family to leave.

I will conclude by urging the Minister to continue with this work because it is hugely important.

As I stated previously to her, Cavan-Monaghan is one of the areas that does not have a visible women's refuge. Unfortunately, women in need of such a refuge are sent to other counties and other emergency accommodation. I compliment the Minister on this piece of work.

I thank the Deputies for their contributions and Deputy Ó Ríordáin for tabling the amendment and raising this point. He referred to the organisations and individuals who have worked in this space for many decades. At every step of the way in the development of the zero tolerance strategy, but also this agency, I have tried to make sure their views, voices, concerns, experiences and overall ambition for the agency are taken on board. We have been able to achieve that.

I understand the ambition of the amendment is to ensure the head of the agency has a role in setting out who is working in the agency, the skills that are needed and the requirements overall. It is important to stress that, as I have stated previously, right across the justice sector there are examples of where the structure I am proposing in the Bill is already working and operating well. There are a variety of statutory and non-statutory agencies, including the Parole Board, the Office of the Inspector of Prisons, the International Protection Appeals Tribunal, the Probation Service, Forensic Science Ireland and the Office of the State Pathologist. There are also specialist State services outside the sector, such as the Workplace Relations Commission and Met Éireann, for example. In all those organisations there are long-standing and well-established consultative arrangements that already apply as a matter of course where my Department provides staff to agencies under this aegis. Each agency is supported by designated HR business partners. There is a recruitment partner from my Department and this allows for that relationship to be built between my Department and the specific agencies. It, in turn, helps to ensure staff are assigned and have the right skills and requirements, but also the heads of the various agencies have an opportunity to play a direct and substantial role when it comes to recruitment and selecting key staff, such as by applying selection criteria and job specifications, but also by participating on the interview boards. This is happening. It is not new or just in one agency; it has been happening across the board for several years and they have been working effectively and well.

In terms of anything further that would assist in this regard, on an administrative basis the management of specific recruitment campaigns has on several occasions been delegated or designated to the heads of the various agencies. This is done under the aegis of my Department. We will be happy to engage with the new CEO. I am pleased we are now whittling down the list of names and starting to go through the inverview process and things are progressing. The CEO could explore the possibility where specific recruitment competitions would be delegated to them under order by the Minister. There are a number of ways in which we can make it even more clear that the CEO will have responsibility and a role in the overall administration and deployment of staff within the agency.

I do not believe the amendment is necessary. The structures we have in place work well and allow the CEO to be very much involved in this. In recent weeks, I have spoken to several people who consider this to be an important amendment but my view is that what we have achieves what it is people want to see here, namely, a CEO with true power who will not be dictated to by my Department, me as Minister or anybody else who may be Minister in future. This structure is working well in various agencies and that shows it will achieve what we want it to achieve.

Amendment put and declared lost.

I move amendment No. 2:

In page 31, between lines 17 and 18, to insert the following:

“(5) Nothing in this section authorises—

(a) a service provider,

(b) the Agency, or

(c) the Minister,

to process personal data (within the meaning of Regulation (EU) 2016/679 of the European Parliament and of the Council of 27 April 2016) for purposes that are not compatible with the purposes for which the data were originally obtained.”.

The amendment relates to data protection. Safe Ireland asked us to table it. It proposes to insert:

"(5) Nothing in this section authorises—

(a) a service provider,

(b) the Agency, or

(c) the Minister,

to process personal data (within the meaning of Regulation (EU) 2016/679 of the European Parliament and of the Council of 27 April 2016) for purposes that are not compatible with the purposes for which the data were originally obtained.".

It relates to privacy and protection of data, which is an obvious concern in the context of the establishment of the agency.

On Committee Stage, we moved an amendment to section 41 after concerns were raised with us regarding the safeguarding of personal data of victims and survivors in the context of any information request made by the agency to a service provider under that section. In fairness to the Minister, she said she would check out the point. She contacted us to say she had received advice from the Attorney General which stated the proposed amendment was unecessary as it was not intended the agency would process such data and section 41 did not provide a basis for it to do so. She stated she was satisfied, in the context of section 41 or any other provision, that had it been intended for the Bill to provide such a basis, it would have to have been explicitly provided for in the Bill. Stating in clear and accessible language that victims' personal data will be protected may encourage victims to seek out support services. Some of the NGOs involved, however, made the point that if the amendment is fully in line with the intention to protect such data, how can it affect the Department to include it in the Bill? Why not include it if it is not going to make any difference anyway? The benefit of the protection felt by victims or the feeling they would have that their data are being protected would outweigh any potential administrative inconvenience involved in making the changes. That is the feeling that came back from them and I wanted to put it to the Minister before we proceeded further.

I thank the Deputy for outlining the current position and what we discussed previously. It is a given that the processing of personal data by any party must be in accordance with GDPR and law, particularly the legal framework provided by GDPR. As the Deputy noted, the advice I have been given is that section 41 does not alter that in any way or affect the data privacy rights of any person. If it had been intended to provide such a basis in the legislation, that would have to be explicitly provided for in the Bill. I appreciate the view of some people that stating this does not do any harm, but it is already the law. If every Bill stated what is already a fact and in law, that would make legislation even more complex. The advice I have been given is that it is already clearly outlined that any processing of data must be done in accordance with the law. If the situation under the Bill were to be otherwise, we would have to explicitly provide for it in the Bill. Clearly, we have not done so.

We will ensure the agency works closely with the data protection officer, who will be appointed at the earliest stage possible in order that appropriate data protection policies and procedures are in place. That is another element of the Bill. A data protection officer will be appointed to ensure data protection legislation is upheld at every stage.

On a separate but related point, it is worth noting the existing funding agreements between Tusla and the relevant service providers strongly emphasise the need for service providers to be fully compliant with their data protection obligations. That is already in place within the arrangements that are currently in situ. As they transfer over to the agency, that will very much align with the new laws and agency. It is already stated in law. If every piece of legislation were to restate or clarify what is already the law, that would make legislation more complex. I am absolutely assured by the Data Protection Commissioner and by the Attorney General that this will not be allowed and is not contained in the legislation.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

I move amendment No. 3:

In page 31, between lines 32 and 33, to insert the following:

“(4) Nothing in or under this Act, including a designation under this section, of itself operates to constitute a service provider to be a public body within the meaning of the Data Sharing and Governance Act 2019.”.

This is a similar amendment around data protection. I presume the Minister will give us a similar answer. It relates to data protection and seeks to insert the following line: "Nothing in or under this Act, including a designation under this section, of itself operates to constitute a service provider to be a public body within the meaning of the Data Sharing and Governance Act 2019." There is concern about it that is understandable given the sensitivity of the nature of the agency that the Minister is establishing, which we support. The assurances she is giving give comfort to me and, I am sure, to Deputy Daly. Perhaps she can expand on them. I do not necessarily intend to press the amendment. If the Minister can give more assurances on the record of the House as to the intention that she has around data protection, it would give some comfort to those who have questions in this regard.

In the same regard, I do not think the amendment is necessary on the basis that there is no way that this Bill, as it currently stands and is drafted, could be interpreted as designating a service provider as a public body within the meaning of the 2019 Act. The only way that the Bill could actually have such an effect is that if it contained a specific provision amending the 2019 Act to state that, and to that effect. From the advice that I have received, if the Bill did intend to allow the Minister to designate a particular NGO as a public service body for the purpose of this Bill, the proper means of enabling this would have to be by way of a specific provision to that effect. We would have to specify it very much along the same lines as the previous amendments. I appreciate the intention behind the amendment to make sure that information that should not be shared is not shared. However, it has been made very clear to me that in order for that to happen, we would have to specify it in this Bill, and we have not done so for very obvious reasons.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
Bill received for final consideration.
Question proposed: “That the Bill do now pass.”

I sincerely thank all of my colleagues for their support in the passing of these Stages. This is extremely important legislation, not least because of what it means for the future. It will ensure that irrespective of who is in this Chamber and what year we are in, the issue of domestic, sexual and gender-based violence will remain firmly on the agenda. It will allow for the establishment of an agency for the first time whose sole focus and responsibility will be combating domestic, sexual and gender-based violence, working collectively with all of the wonderful organisations and support services that have been doing amazing work for many years. It places a particular focus on it and, above all, it puts the structures in place for the future to make sure that we continue to deal with what is an absolute epidemic not just in this country, but globally. Again, I thank colleagues for their support and, indeed, my own team and also those working in those space. Above all, I acknowledge victims and survivors of domestic and sexual abuse. It is their lived experience and it is because of them that we have this legislation here today.

I thank the Department for everything and thank the Minister for her own good work on the legislation. Obviously, when she took on the role as Minister for Justice she recognised, as we all recognise, the lacuna in services in this regard and she is trying to do something about it. Credit is due to the Minister and her team for the work that they are putting into it. It is not really something to be scoring political points on. I credit them all for the work they are doing and the support that will follow when we can see that there is good progressive legislation going through, notwithstanding some of the concerns that have been expressed. It is our duty to put them to the Minister. When we have brought up particular points, she has responded in kind. We will support her on that.

This is a huge achievement for the Minister. It speaks volumes of her ethics, values and what she is trying to achieve in her role. We, in the Labour Party, congratulate her. Far too many women, in particular, are being killed by men. Far too many women in Ireland are being assaulted and raped by men. Anybody who has a girl or a women in their life is horrified by the all-too-often news reports of another assault, rape or murder. At some point in the history of this country of ours, we have to shout, "Stop". The Minister is shouting, "Stop", and is making a difference in the role she has. I congratulate her on that. As Deputy Daly said, the party politics goes out the window when we are trying to collectively deal with this. In terms of the amendments we put down, we were genuinely trying to strengthen the Bill. They were an attempt to work collaboratively. What we want, as a body politic, is to speak with one voice when it comes to this issue. We pledge to work with the Minister constructively into the future.

Question put and agreed to.
Barr
Roinn