Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 29 Nov 2023

Vol. 1046 No. 5

Capital Supply Service and Purpose Report Bill 2023: Second Stage [Private Members]

Deputy Matt Shanahan

I move:

"That the Bill be now read a Second Time."

This Bill provides that each Government Minister shall, annually, report on large capital expenditure in the Department five years after the expenditure occurs. As a people, we will spend €13 billion on publicly funded capital projects this year. It is projected that we will spend €165 billion by the end of this decade. This is a substantial accomplishment of our society and it has come about as a result of the discipline and pain of the austerity years.

It is also from the hard work in crafting a strong Irish economy after the nadir of the 1950s.

We all hope that our society continues to invest wisely in ever better services and resources for our citizens. As a nouveau riche country, we have massive infrastructural deficits that have built up over generations. As we unwind that inheritance, funding better railways and roundabouts, play parks, ports, schools and sewers, quays and, I hope, future wind farms and solar projects, the people and the backbenchers representing them will need better visibility on where this public money goes. It is a curious feature of our parliamentary budgetary process, remarked on by the OECD and others, that rather large sums of Exchequer spending that are earmarked through Departments are never seen or heard of again in this House. It is remarkable that the Dáil is never supplied with a list of approved or completed projects. The Where Your Money Goes website, for all its multicoloured glory, breaks things down only to the nearest billion. Parliamentary questions on capital spending need to be very consistently addressed and answered if we are to assemble any sense of the overall pattern. We need, in my opinion, this simple and robust Bill to tease out, in a gentle way, consistent and appropriately granular historical details so that over time, we can achieve a clear picture of public spending. This Bill proposes to close the loop between approval and reporting.

At the moment, the only formal oversight of expenditure is when the Comptroller and Auditor General or a committee of this House finds something exceptional. We parse the venial or the calamitous and we miss the broad issues of overall priorities and patterns. I am reliably advised that reporting five years after completion will steer well clear of any competitive sensitivities that might blunt the State's ability to negotiate. This Bill also provides a mechanism to allow a Minister to delay reporting should the need arise. I am also reliably advised that recent advances in the Government's ICT system make this form of reporting relatively straightforward.

This Bill, in a gentle way, will strengthen our democracy. If taken up, it will certainly strengthen this House's ability to discharge its duty of oversight over expenditure. This becomes a slightly more pressing matter as we contemplate a larger Dáil and a fixed number of Cabinet seats. We will need future measures to rebalance the powers between our Executive and Legislature. The simple act of seeing where the money goes will improve the quality of our debate on how best we should spend public money. It supports transparency in our politics and policymaking. It will make for more informed policy and strengthen tax cohesion, as people can see where tax income goes.

I am very grateful for the support and advice from the Office of Parliamentary Legal Advisers, which supported the crafting of this modest Bill. I also thank the Parliamentary Budget Office for its supply of information when requested. I would like to sincerely thank my Regional Group colleagues for the support they have given to me in promoting this Bill, and also Cáit Nic Amhlaoibh, our parliamentary assistant, for her help. I thank Senator Michael McDowell in particular for his help, advice and vigilance with regard to the drafting of this Bill.

The very act of reporting back to this House on where capital voted expenditure goes and on what, even five years after capital funds were approved and spent with all the appropriate protections and caveats, will make us a better, even if only slightly better, Republic. For a long time, this State has needed a comprehensive reporting method on Exchequer spending, and I hope this Bill will deliver it to the House.

Deputy Seán Canney

I compliment Deputy Shanahan for his foresight and vision in bringing forward this very simple, clear-cut and clearly worded Bill. I believe the Government is not going to oppose this Bill, and I welcome that. The important thing is we see this as something that actually brings back accountability for our public finances, and that we report on them. When I was in college, when we were teaching students, we had outcomes from the programmes we delivered. We need to know what the outcomes are going to be if this Bill is enacted.

I will tell the Minister of State straight up that between 2008 and 2018, the economist John Daly was the author of a report for the Northern and Western Regional Assembly in which he showed that there was a serious lack of funding in the eight counties of the region. This was to such an extent that the region has been downgraded to a region in transition from what was called before that a developing region. This has been done by the EU, and it is based on the expenditure per capita in the area. We are the lowest. We have a two-tier system going on in spite of all the rhetoric we get about balanced economic development, regional development and all of that.

I will point out a few things on that. There is serious discrimination, first of all, in the area of investment in health. About 20 years ago, Galway regional hospital, as it was once known, was designated as a centre of excellence for healthcare for over 1 million people in our area. Today, we still have people working out of prefabs, and we still have Nightingale wards. We do not have a cancer treatment area. We have a temporary emergency department, ED. We do not have proper maternity or paediatric units, and we are slowly grinding to try to get there. We are delivering worse outcomes with regard to health in this region. That is how it has manifested itself.

In the area of transport, Ireland West Knock Airport is probably the least-funded of our airports, and for what reason, I do not know. Back in time, if officials got their way, it would never have been built but we have over 1 million passengers coming into the west through that airport, and it is important that we support it. If one looks at the western rail corridor, phase 1 of which was completed in 2011 from Ennis to Athenry, we are still trying to get it pushed on from Athenry, through Tuam, Claremorris and all the way up to Collooney. I know the Minister for Transport is very supportive of that project but I want to see speedy progress there so that we can actually start building out what we need.

On education, what was once Galway-Mayo Institute of Technology, GMIT, is now Atlantic Technological University, ATU. When I was there over eight years ago as a lecturer, we were getting a new science, technology, engineering and mathematics, STEM, building. We are still getting it but have not got it to date. The rate of progress in the development of educational facilities in the west of Ireland is very slow. It is probably slow all over the country. In Athenry, for example, there are two new schools but there is still a waiting list of over 180 students trying to get into first year in school. There are no places for them, and they are coming from the catchment area and the feeder schools. There is something really lacking in that.

When we talk about development, and we look at our ports, we look at Galway Port. For years, it has been trying to get permission to build a new, deeper port outside the existing port, and to develop inside the port for residential and business use. It has been a slow, grinding process. One can look at Ros an Mhíl, where there is a good, deep sea port that needs investment, Killybegs and Foynes. I acknowledge that at long last, we are building a rail connection to Foynes Port. I want to thank the Minister, Deputy Ryan for that as well. That is coming from Limerick out to the port. We need to do this at a pace that will give us an edge and allows the region to move from one that is struggling to one that can develop.

The feeling we have in the west of Ireland is that we get some crumbs from the table. We need to get more than crumbs if we are going to develop a balanced economy in this country. I would say that one of the biggest issues we have in that development process is a lack of housing. Our global industries that are located in Ireland are finding it very difficult to get into expansion mode due to the fact that housing is not available for their workers or additional workers.

I am at pains to point out that if our towns and villages across the region were to get investment in wastewater treatment plants, we would then be able to build affordable houses in those villages and towns. At the moment, we cannot build anything because An Bord Pleanála has frozen all planning in respect of a plethora of villages and towns due to the fact we do not have a wastewater treatment plant. Local authorities are saying it is up to Irish Water, and that organisation is saying it does not want to be involved because it is too much trouble. If we are to develop the west or any other region, we need to ensure that we have that infrastructure in place.

My final point on regional development is this. If we do not get up off our backsides and get on with the Galway ring road or decide to do something else in respect of the transport problems in Galway, the city will die. It is the nucleus of economic development in the west of Ireland. Everybody talks about the transport issues in Galway. On the radio, "AA Roadwatch" will probably mention Bothar na dTreabh first thing every morning. At this stage, it is just repeating the report from previous mornings. Transport has stagnated in the city. People are left sitting in their cars for hours trying to get to and from work. We have not provided the required bus lanes for public and private transport and we need to speed up the process of providing additional train services to get people to work. There is much to be done. Ultimately, in our region, there should be positive discrimination regarding investment. The EU can provide that enabler by giving us additional funding through structural funds. All we need to do is apply for this funding and get on with it.

Deputy Peadar Tóibín

Ba mhaith mo thacaíocht a thabhairt don Bhille seo agus gabhaim buíochas leis an Teachta Matt Shanahan as é a chur os comhair na Dála. Gabhaim buíochas freisin le baill an Ghrúpa Réigiúnach atá ag úsáid a gcuid ama chun é seo a chur os comhair na Dála.

I welcome this Bill. I thank Deputy Matt Shannon for putting it before the Dáil today. I also thank the Regional Group for using our Private Member's Business time to put it before the Dáil.

There is a saying in business that you cannot manage if you cannot measure. It is very clear that if we want to make the correct decisions, we need to know what is actually going on. If we cannot see what is happening in a business, an organisation or society, then we are operating blind. That is a very dangerous place to be because it means we are not spending money efficiently and where it is needed. This is a significant characteristic of the Government. Capital infrastructure is often considered a dusty issue, but it is really important. It encapsulates the issues that we, as a society depend on, whether that be a person depending on a hospital, a school, transportation or energy. As a society, we are all very dependent on the proper delivery of capital infrastructure. This country has a bad record in the context of the delivery of capital infrastructure. For the decade after austerity, Ireland was second lowest in the EU in the delivery of capital infrastructure. Only Romania beat us to the bottom when it came to capital infrastructure spending. For a solid ten years, we were not even keeping up the quality of the capital infrastructure we already had through investment. There was significant depreciation in capital infrastructure, which means that we now have to spend more just to stand still.

One of the aspects of the Bill that is extremely important is that which relates to accountability. The Government has been an accountability free zone in terms of the delivery of capital infrastructure for the past number of years. There has been a €1.4 billion overspend on the national children's hospital. The project is six years behind schedule. For metro north, €300 million has been spent and not a shovel has yet been put into the ground. We talk about the Green Party and its influence in relation to the development of sustainable energy but yet planning permission has not been given for a single wind farm in the country in the past 12 months. I heard the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, talk about the fact that he had brought all of the energy ministers from Europe to Ireland to discuss offshore wind energy. The State has built seven offshore turbines in 20 years. It is astounding how slow we are in the development of really important capital infrastructure.

Reports in the papers this week tell us that An Bord Pleanála is sitting on a backlog of 22,000 planning applications for homes. In the middle of a housing crisis, we have a State organisation called An Bord Pleanála which is so underfunded for delivery of planning, it is holding back delivery of 22,000 homes. The Government is the biggest blockage in the delivery of houses. We have seen the Government spend €22 million on dodgy ventilators that did not work during the Covid crisis. It is now spending €75,000 storing those same ventilators. This is absolutely incredible. The HSE is spending €10 million on an overpayment because someone mismeasured a room that it is being rented out.

My issue is that nobody is ever held responsible for these kind of things. I spoke to the Secretary General of the Department of Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform. I asked had anybody ever lost a job in this State because of massive overspends or delays. His answer was "No". I asked had anybody ever been moved sideways or had there been a cost in relation to these wrong doings and his answer was again "No". That is the key issue here. If there is no cost to these types of mistakes or bad decisions, that means there will be no change. If this was happening in any business whereby a person making that level of bad decision that had such a cost, there would be a cost to that individual and, as a result, there would be a change in delivery as well. There is no accountability. The wonderful thing about this Bill is that it offers an opportunity to give decent, transparent analysis of the expenditure of the State on projects.

The other aspect of this Bill that is really important is how it deals with regional development. We are living in a State which is fast becoming a city state. Dublin is an outlier in terms of its size compared with the rest of the State and most capitals in the rest of Europe. London, for example, is considered to be too big for the British economy. Yet London has a smaller impact on the British economy than Dublin has on the Irish one. Because of this lopsided development as a city state, we have a massive area now that is a commuter belt. People are commuting from Munster, Connacht and Ulster into Dublin every day. They are killing themselves with three-hour return journeys. Because most of the jobs are being located in Dublin, most of the young people have to move from provincial towns into the Dublin area to get a graduate-type jobs. The problem is that they cannot afford to live in Dublin. They have to live 40 miles outside the city in order to be able to afford a house and then commute in every single day. This throws the Minister's sustainability objectives out the window. The average age of a person in Killarney is now 44 years, while in Balbriggan it is 30. This is because young people are being forced to move en masse as a result of the lopsided development in this country.

This Bill offers an opportunity to analyse the infrastructure spend and the damage it is doing in relation to that. It will also help to develop analysis in relation to socioeconomic delivery of infrastructure. Many parts of our society are not getting the investment needed. As a result, it is leading to dereliction and disaffection in those areas. The north inner city is an example of an area that is not receiving investment. I would like for this Government to begin to look beyond the Liffey into the north side of Dublin in terms of investment and to make sure that those communities have the investment they need in order that they can prosper and live properly.

Debate adjourned.