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Home Help Service

Dáil Éireann Debate, Wednesday - 3 May 2017

Wednesday, 3 May 2017

Ceisteanna (3)

Louise O'Reilly

Ceist:

3. Deputy Louise O'Reilly asked the Minister for Health if his attention has been drawn to a restriction on not-for-profit home helps providing additional services to clients over and above that allocated by the HSE; the reason these restrictions are in place, especially when those vulnerable persons in receipt of care may not be getting sufficient hours from the HSE; if there is a plan in place to bridge the services that these restrictions have impacted on in view of the fact that supply is not meeting demand; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [20882/17]

Amharc ar fhreagra

Freagraí ó Béal (8 píosaí cainte)

This question is quite simple. In an ideal world, all home help hours should be provided directly by the State. However, since the State is not doing that, the question relates to the not-for-profit service providers and the restriction arbitrarily imposed on them from providing additional hours where demand clearly exists.

Home care services are critical to support older people to stay in their own homes and communities, to prevent early admission to long-term residential care and to support people to return to their homes following an acute hospital admission. These services may be delivered directly by HSE staff or indirectly through not-for-profit and private providers contracted by the HSE.

In 2012 as part of a quality improvement programme the HSE introduced a tendering process for new home care packages sourced from private and not-for-profit providers. This process was most recently repeated in 2016.

I understand that some not-for-profit providers who are funded by the HSE to provide mainstream or core home help services were operating a limited service for clients who wished to pay for additional hours. This approach appears to have happened in a small number of cases but it was raised with the HSE in the context of a legal challenge by a group of 42 private providers in respect of the planned 2014 tender for enhanced home care. The not-for-profit providers referred to in the legal challenge were almost wholly funded by the HSE at that time, and continue to be significantly funded by HSE to provide home help services. In circumstances where a client-funded element of service was developing, concern was expressed that such arrangements may constitute cross-subsidisation or could amount to state aid.

Agreement was subsequently reached between the HSE and representatives of the private providers. Under that agreement and to avoid any doubt, the HSE made it clear that the type of arrangement I described earlier was not acceptable to the executive and was to cease. If a not-for-profit provider wishes to develop the private element of its business, in the same way as a commercial entity, it may withdraw from HSE-funded home help arrangements. This is not an issue of the State not wishing to provide support or help, but a legal issue to which we must adhere.

It is not a legal issue at all, but I wish to see the detail of the agreement reached between the HSE and the for-profit providers. We are talking about global, multinational corporations. They are people who are in the business of making a huge amount of money. The Minister of State will be aware of my views on the private sector in health care. I see the Minister nodding beside the Minister of State. He is well aware of them. However, these people make huge profits that fund big offices, branded cars and the like. The small, not-for-profit providers are effectively being locked out of this market. If somebody has an elderly relative who is receiving their home help from a small, not-for-profit provider but they wish to get an additional amount, which the State should be providing but is not, they must give money to a global corporation or a multinational company for it. It does not make sense.

Will the Minister of State publish the details of the agreement between the HSE and the private providers? Every penny that goes to the not-for-profit providers is put directly into service provision. In the case of private providers and the big global multinationals, we are giving taxpayers' money to fund their offices, corporations, backroom operations and so forth. It is not good value for money.

We wish to ensure home care is affordable for everybody. Not-for-profit organisations are not restricted, but under the current framework they must adhere to the same regulations. I understand that some of the groups might like to develop a private element of their business. They will be able to do so next year. However, based on a legal challenge that took place and a possible legal challenge in the future, we cannot have a situation where an organisation receives a block grant of funding from the State and then provides private care on that basis. What we must ensure, and we are working on this, is that we can provide a proper framework and a proper statutory home care scheme that will be affordable, accessible to everybody, sustainable for the State and that will provide choice and certainty for people into the future. Again, this is not about not wanting to provide affordable home care or about protecting private enterprise. It is the situation in which we found ourselves. I believe the only way we can rectify it is by providing a statutory framework, and we are working on that. The Health Research Board, HRB, report was published two weeks ago. We will be opening a public consultation to ensure that every group, be it statutory or non-statutory, public or private, will have its say on what that framework should be.

The providers do not get a block grant. They are funded on a per-hours basis. The Minister of State knows that. Saying they get a block grant is an attempt to make it sound as if they are part of the HSE or the Department of Health, which they clearly are not. The Minister of State knows they are not. Will she publish the details of the agreement that was reached between the Department and these global multinational corporations? With respect, the Minister of State is driving the small providers out of business. We should be encouraging these people. They respect the rate for the job, do not drive down conditions and are trying their best to be decent employers, yet here they are fighting with the Department of Health and the HSE and effectively being closed out of the market. Will the Minister of State publish the details of the arrangement she has reached with these global multinational corporations, which effectively excludes not-for-profit providers? The not-for-profit providers respect the rate for the job and put all the money into service provision, whereas others fund the global corporations that are offering services at present. It might interest the Minister of State to know that this is not a case of value for money. They charge up to €44 per hour, while the not-for-profit providers do not charge anywhere near that.

To ensure the Deputy is not under any illusion, we are not trying to protect private business here. We are trying to ensure there is a fair system. The system currently in place means we cannot provide a block grant. Most of the not-for-profit organisations receive a significant amount of their funding from the HSE. They provide an excellent service and I am not saying otherwise. They provide a service where there is a gap. However, the framework currently in place means we must have a fair system. We are working on the development of a new statutory home-care scheme, which is how we will deal many of the issues that are arising at present. I will be happy to meet with the Deputy to discuss the arrangements and the talks that have taken place with regard to the private and not-for-profit organisations.

Will the Minister of State answer my specific question? Will she publish the details?

I cannot answer that now. I will meet with the Deputy to discuss it.

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