Dáil Éireann Debate, Tuesday - 20 June 2023
66. Deputy Matt Carthy asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Defence the establishment figure for the Army, Naval Service and Air Corps; the current number in each; and the number in the years 2020, 2021 and 2022. [29857/23]
Amharc ar fhreagraI am taking this question on behalf of Deputy Carthy. Will the Tánaiste outline the establishment figure for the Army, the Naval Service and the Air Corps, the current number in each branch and the numbers in the years 2020, 2021 and 2022?
I thank the Deputy for raising this issue. As of 31 May 2023, the strength of the Permanent Defence Force stood at 7,764 personnel while in 2022 it was 7,966, in 2021 it was 8,456 and in 2020 it was 8,568. The current establishment of the Defence Forces is 9,500. I note that the Deputy requested a further breakdown of these figures by branch and I have arranged for a table with these details to be provided to her.
Sanction has recently been received for 100 extra positions to facilitate the implementation of the Report of the Commission on the Defence Forces. This is in addition to the recently appointed civilian head of transformation and the pending appointment of a civilian head of strategic HR within the Defence Forces.
I have previously acknowledged the staffing difficulties in the Defence Forces and work to counter these is ongoing. The military authorities advise that current Defence Forces recruitment initiatives include ongoing general service and direct entry recruitment, the re-entry schemes and the "Be More" recruitment campaign. As part of a Naval Service-specific recruitment campaign, a Naval Service recruitment advertisement launched last week and will be rolled out across all media platforms in the coming weeks. A contract has recently been awarded to a marine specialist recruitment body to target individuals with the skills and expertise required by the Naval Service. The maximum age of entry was recently increased to 29 years for general service recruits, cadets, Air Corps apprentices and certain specialists. In addition, the Defence Forces have established a joint induction training centre in Gormanston with a view to increasing the throughput of recruits. A range of financial and non-financial retention measures have been introduced by the Government such as service commitment schemes, tax measures and the recent agreement to further extend the service of post-1994 privates, corporals and sergeants, allowing for their continuance in service to the end of 2024.
There has also been significant progress on pay. Current pay rates, including military service allowances for recruits on completion of their training, start at €37,147 in year 1, rising to €38,544 in year 2 and €39,832 in year 3 of service. On commissioning, a school-leaver cadet is paid €41,123. After two years, such cadets are promoted to lieutenant and their pay rises to €46,406. Where a graduate joins, the pay rate on commissioning begins at €46,406.
My immediate focus is on stabilising the numbers of personnel in the Defence Forces and thereafter increasing strength to meet the agreed level of ambition arising from the Report of the Commission on the Defence Forces.
The number of personnel in the Permanent Defence Force, PDF, stood at 8,828 in 2019. In March of that year, it was 8,366 while today it stands at what I had understood to be 7,797, although I believe the Tánaiste gave a different number.
It is 7,764.
It is 7,764. I note that in the response to a recent parliamentary question tabled by my comrade, Deputy Carthy, the Tánaiste stated that his immediate focus would be on stabilising the number of personnel in the Defence Forces. I welcome that because retention is the most important thing. We have to retain the military personnel who are already trained and in whom money has been invested. I agree with that. Will the Tánaiste outline the timeframe within which he believes the number of personnel will be stabilised? Will he give me an idea of how long he believes it will take to reach the establishment figure?
For clarification, I have the table here and can be straight up with the Deputy. The strength of the Army in 2023 is 6,305 while that of the Air Corps is 704 and that of the Naval Service is 755. I am extremely concerned. I have been in this position for six months now and I am very worried about the situation in the navy. We have had meetings with the flag officer, the Chief of Staff and Department officials on the matter. Obviously, there is full employment in the country with the unemployment rate at 3.8%. I outlined a range of initiatives we are undertaking earlier. One of the areas to be addressed earlier, as part of an interdepartmental approach, is that of the current retirement age. We have extended that to 2024 but in my view, we need to extend it further. Discussions on that are ongoing because such action would potentially have read-across to members of the Garda and fire brigades with regard to fast accrual pensions. There are issues there but it is one effective route that we can take to retain people within our Defence Forces for longer. As I said earlier, with regard to the navy, we are looking at other measures and at what we can do in respect of specialist positions and disciplines where we are losing personnel. Industry is now offering very high rates to people, particularly trained personnel in the Army. That is a significant phenomenon given the buoyancy of the economy and the skill levels of many within our Defence Forces. Others are seeking those particular skills. This is a matter I keep under active examination. Today, I again met with the Chief of Staff and the Secretary General of the Department to maintain the pressure on this issue.
In April, Lieutenant Colonel Conor King, general secretary of RACO, said that we cannot recruit ourselves out of a retention crisis. He is right because we would just be putting water into a leaky bucket. The figure I have for the number of discharges in 2022 is 891. That was higher than the figure for any year since 2017. The Tánaiste mentioned the working time directive at a recent meeting with PDFORRA.
Can the Tánaiste confirm whether the Defence Forces have begun recording the working time of their personnel as is necessary to progress this? Can he provide any indicative timeframe as to how long it will take to get it to fruition?
I can report that good progress has been made on the working time directive. I asked my officials some time back to engage again with the organisations representing our Defence Forces - PDFORRA and, of course, RACO. Concentrated meetings were held over a period of time in the past number of weeks. I do not have an exact timeline yet, but I am confident-----
Have they been recording the working times?
We have not. That will be part of the broader organisation of the working time directive. I am very clear that we want to introduce the directive. The pressure will be maintained in the discussions under way with the representative organisations. That is a very important factor. It does present some challenges, but that said, it is an important part of not just of the broader culture within the Defence Forces, but also ensuring the wellbeing of members and providing a good environment within workplace that can both facilitate recruitment and retention in the Defence Forces. There are people coming into the Defence Forces all the time. The issue is that we have to get a sufficient number of recruits that is higher than the number of members retiring and leaving.
