Michael Moynihan
Ceist:58. Deputy Michael Moynihan asked the Minister for Social Protection if consideration is being given to extending the duration of carer’s benefit beyond the current 104 weeks. [46385/23]
Amharc ar fhreagraTuesday, 24 October 2023
Ceisteanna (58, 90, 95, 109)
Violet-Anne Wynne
Ceist:90. Deputy Violet-Anne Wynne asked the Minister for Social Protection her views on the recent changes to the means test for the carer’s allowance; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [46416/23]
Amharc ar fhreagra
Robert Troy
Ceist:95. Deputy Robert Troy asked the Minister for Social Protection if consideration is being given to abolishing the means test for the carer’s allowance. [46383/23]
Amharc ar fhreagra
Colm Burke
Ceist:109. Deputy Colm Burke asked the Minister for Social Protection when the new system to enable long-term carers to qualify for a State pension will take effect; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [46186/23]
Amharc ar fhreagraFreagraí ó Béal (13 píosaí cainte)
Does the Department have any plans to extend the payment of carer's benefit beyond 104 weeks? Many people go on the benefit to look after a parent, partner or child who has become chronically sick, and that care often must continue for longer than 104 weeks. These people may have years of stamp contributions.
I propose to take Questions Nos. 58, 90, 95 and 109 together.
Carer's benefit is a payment made to insured people who leave the workforce to care for someone in need of full-time care and attention. It is payable for a maximum of 104 weeks for each person being cared for. It can be taken in one block or in separate periods as long as the combined total does not exceed 104 weeks. The average duration of a carer's benefit claim is 76 weeks. I do not consider it necessary to extend the duration of the benefit for longer than 104 weeks at this point.
Since my appointment as Minister, I have made a number of improvements within the social welfare system to enhance the supports available for carers, including significant improvements to the means test for carer's allowance. There have been improvements in the latest budget and the previous one. Last June, the income disregards were increased from €332.50 to €350 for a single person and from €665 to €750 for carers with a spouse or partner. As part of budget 2024, the weekly income disregard will be increased from €350 to €450 for a single person and from €750 to €900 for carers with a spouse or partner. That will kick in next year. Since June 2022, this amounts to cumulative increases in the disregards of €117.50 for a single carer and €235 for a carer who is part of a couple. These are the highest income disregards in the social welfare system. In addition, the capital and savings disregard for the carer's allowance means test was increased last year from €20,000 to €50,000. I am satisfied that raising the general weekly income disregard will mean more carers with modest incomes are brought into the system.
However, the reality is that no matter where I draw the line with the means test, there will always be some people who fall on the other side and do not qualify. Removing the means test for carer's allowance in its entirety would create a new universal social protection scheme for those meeting the scheme's basic caring condition. Carer's allowance does not purport to be a payment for care and I do not intend to deviate from the underpinning principle of the allowance being an income support payment. I propose, though, to establish, with the Department of Health, an interdepartmental working group to examine and review the entire system of means tests for carers' payment.
The weekly rates for carer's allowance and carer's benefit have increased by €29 over the past three years. During my tenure, the rate of the carer's support grant has increased to €1,850, which is its highest ever level. In September 2022, I announced the introduction of State pension provision for long-term carers by attributing the equivalent of paid contributions to cover gaps in their contribution record. I hope to bring that into effect from 1 January next year. These long-term carer's contributions will be available to those who provided full-time care to incapacitated dependants for 20 years or more. I expect to bring the necessary legislation before the Oireachtas soon, with the scheme to be fully implemented from January 2024. Last month, my Department launched an online system for people to register for long-term carer's contributions to facilitate the early processing of claims upon enactment of the legislation. I hope to be in a position to get the legislation through and the system up and running from the beginning of January. I thank Deputy Moynihan for raising the matter.
I thank the Minister and congratulate her on the disregard increases she has introduced and the amount of work she has done in facilitating the carer's means test. I am fully aware of the work that had to be done to get those figures together. Well done to her on that.
She referred to an interdepartmental group. There are a number of issues it could look at. The Minister said the average duration of a claim for carer's benefit is 76 weeks. How many people who come off the benefit cease getting any payment from the State but continue to qualify for the carer's support grant? That would give a figure for how many people do not go back to paid employment and continue to provide care. I understand her point about a universal payment, all that goes with it and the challenges that are there, but there is this cohort of people to consider.
I also understand the issue regarding the State pension. The Minister has achieved a very welcome development in that regard and the legislation will be very beneficial-----
I thank the Deputy.
Will the Minister look at the figures for those who come off the carer's benefit?
I welcome the increase in the income disregard for the carer’s allowance announced in the budget. I, like many colleagues from throughout the House, lobbied extensively on this, so it is a move I warmly welcome. I note the interdepartmental working group and review the Minister mentioned. Like many others, I met representatives of Family Carers Ireland ahead of the budget. The best way to support family carers, as the Minister will know, is to work towards the phasing-out of a means test over the next four years, and I hope that whoever is in government at that point will replace the carer's allowance with a participation income.
I welcome also the €400 one-off payment for those in receipt of the carer's support grant and the domiciliary care allowance, but this increase was nowhere near enough. As I have said previously, the Government refusing to make the increases permanent is an example of electioneering. The domiciliary care allowance and the carer's allowance should both have been increased to €325, an ask from Family Carers Ireland that I support, and I will push for those important and permanent increases for the 9,000 carers in Clare.
Like the Deputies, I meet carers all the time in my constituency office. We help them fill out their forms and follow up on their applications in the same way the Deputies do, and I can only say they do great work. One of my priorities since I became Minister for Social Protection has been to do whatever I can to support our carers because I know the huge work they do and the contribution they make to our society.
In my first budget, therefore, I increased the carer's support grant to €1,850. In budget 2022, I was the first Minister in 14 years to make any changes to the carer's means test, and I followed that up in this year's budget with further increases, whereby it will rise to €450 for a single person and €900 for a couple. The €400 lump-sum payment for carers will be paid in November and carers will also receive double payments at Christmas and at the end of January. From January, therefore, the carer's allowance payments will have increased by €12, which means that over the past two budgets alone, I will have increased the weekly payments carers receive by €24. When we take the increase to the weekly payments together with the lump sums, carers will have more than €1,500 in their pocket in this year, which works out at roughly €30 a week.
I will address the other question in my follow-up response.
In the review that is taking place, could we establish how many people who come off the carer's benefit and continue with the carer's support grant do not get the carer’s allowance? Perhaps that information could feed into the interdepartmental discussion group.
I was delighted to meet Vicky and Fiona from Family Carers Ireland before the budget and we spoke at length about the importance of family carers and how under-appreciated they are. As the Minister knows, unpaid family carers save the State about €20 billion per year, or the equivalent of a second HSE, a point that is timely given the statements taken earlier in the House. Before I became a Deputy, I was a family carer. The carer's allowance has now increased for the second time since 2008, as the Minister noted, and I welcome that, but the allowance increased by 250% over the previous eight years, so we still have some way to go. While a €12 increase in weekly social payments may provide some relief to those receiving the carer's allowance or the carer's benefit, it falls short of Family Carers Ireland's call for both payments to be increased to €325. This increase would acknowledge the substantial and unavoidable expenses that family carers encounter.
Two further Deputies are indicating. I ask them to keep to 30 seconds each.
Both questions relate to the carer's allowance and means-testing. I am dealing with a huge number of reviews for the carer's allowance and they are being done in an incredibly intrusive way, with people being asked to submit bank statements. Instead of it being a qualification just on income grounds, they are being asked to produce bank statements, which are being returned with transactions highlighted where the Department is querying what they relate to. That is not the way to do it; it should be based on income criteria versus justifiable costs. It is incredibly demeaning for many people to have to justify each line of their bank statement.
I agree with Deputy McAuliffe. I too work with a lot of people who apply for the carer's allowance in Carlow. I live in the same area as Catherine Cox, who is a spokesperson on this issue, and the means-testing is a serious issue. Again, it involves constantly filling out forms and looking for bank statements and this, that and the other. There has to be a change of system. It is not working and it takes weeks before the applicant even gets payment. It needs to be looked at and the means-testing is a huge issue.
I want to be clear: my job in social protection is to provide people with a basic income. I cannot pay carers for the work they do; that is just the way it is. That is why I am setting up an interdepartmental group with the Department of Health in order that we can look at this whole area, have an open and frank discussion about it and see how we can adequately support carers for the work they do.
Deputy Moynihan asked how many carers who come off the carer's benefit and continue to get the carer's support grant do not get the carer's allowance. It is a fair question and I will get the figure for him. We should feed that information in when we are looking at this and I will be happy to take on board those views. If I had unlimited resources, we could do everything but, unfortunately, I have limited resources and have to target them at those who need them most. As in the case of disabilities, there are people who provide 24-7 care and there are others who have less onerous care responsibilities, but at the moment it is a flat payment. Maybe that is another question we need to look at. These are all discussions we can tease out over time.
Question No. 59 taken with Written Answers.