I ask leave to introduce the Unemployment Insurance (No. 2) Bill, 1924, which is "A Bill to amend the Unemployment Insurance Acts, 1920-24, and for purposes connected therewith." The object of the Bill can be stated very briefly. It is to renew in this fourth benefit year the benefit which might have been exhausted in the third benefit year, and to put in benefit all ex-National Army soldiers, whether they were in insurable occupations at any period or not.
UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE (No. 2) BILL, 1924.—FIRST STAGE.
We do not know very much of what is in the Bill except what has been stated by the Minister, very shortly. So far as it was stated, I think it will give a good deal of satisfaction throughout the country. I would like if it had been possible for the Minister to elaborate, somewhat, and tell us whether, in addition to amendment of the Unemployment Insurance Acts, the Ministry have been able to accelerate employment in those public works which have been so often referred to, such as the development of the Marino building scheme, the clearing of the destroyed area sites, and other public works of that kind in Dublin and elsewhere. It would have been very satisfactory if we could have had some definite information on that point, in addition to the proposal to amend the Unemployment Acts.
Would the Minister also elaborate his statement as to the putting in benefit of ex-National Army soldiers whether they were in insurable occupations or not? If they were not in insurable occupations presumable they had no stamps and no cards before they joined the National Army. To what extent will they be entitled to receive benefit? Is it to the extent of the value of the stamps put on during military service, or will they be in full benefit as if they had been in insurable occupations and had their cards regularly stamped before enlistment?
Might I draw the Minister's attention to the position of ex-National Army men who live over the Border. My attention was called to the case of an ex-National Army man who lives in Derry and who, since his demobilisation, has not been able to get benefit for the want of some arrangement between the two Governments. I think the Minister ought to consider that point in the Bill. I do not believe there are more than 100 of such cases.
I propose, with the leave of the Dáil, to have the Second Reading of this Bill on Thursday, and, as it is a matter of urgency, to ask the indulgence of the House to get the Bill through with all possible speed. I shall take whatever steps are necessary to facilitate the House if they are anxious to facilitate me in that way. On the Second Reading on Thursday I propose, if it is possible that my doing so will not lead to a general debate, to make a statement with regard to the public works to which Deputy Johnson refers, and to a certain Supplementary Estimate which it is hoped will be asked for on that day with regard to the relief of distress, generally, in the country. I said on a previous occasion, when asked to extend the Unemployment Insurance Acts, that it would have to be looked at in conjunction with relief schemes, and I want to have it considered on Thursday in conjunction with our proposals for the relief of distress during the coming winter and spring. There will be a statement made on the Second Reading as to what it is proposed to do to relieve the distress that undoubtedly prevails.
With regard to what Deputy Cooper says, it is proposed that ex-National Army men who were not in insurable occupations, prior to joining the Army, should be put in benefit for a period of fourteen weeks in the present benefit year. That means that in order to enable them to draw benefit for the full period the Bill would have to be passed somewhere about the 20th of this month. If passed about the 25th they would be available for benefit for every week up to the 20th March.
With regard to the point raised by Deputy Byrne, as to the case of ex-National Army men over the Border, that does not require, to enable me to make arrangements, reciprocal or otherwise, with regard to these men, any amendment of the present Act. I have before now under the present Act, entered into negotiations, and they have been proceeding for some time, to secure benefit for the men to whom Deputy Byrne refers.
Has the Minister's attention been called to the statement of the Minister for Labour in the Northern Parliament, speaking in Derry, to the effect that the Free State Minister had declined to enter into satisfactory reciprocal arrangements. If his attention has not been called to this, I think it would be well if he made some inquiries and then made a public statement in contradiction of the statement made by the Minister for Labour in the Northern Parliament.
I did not see a statement phrased exactly as the Deputy put it. I saw a statement to the effect that the Minister for Industry and Commerce in the Free State was living in splendid isolation in regard to these men. That was all I say, but I may say I have not been living in isolation. I have had conferences in the Summer with the Minister for Labour for Northern Ireland; there has been a volume of correspondence going on for several months, and I think there have been Departmental conferences. If it is thought advisable, I could bring forward evidence on these matters on the Second Reading of this Bill and make a public statement supporting all the things we have done to secure reciprocity benefit.
Mr. BYRNE
Does that apply to seamen also?
No. The case of seamen is different altogether. I was addressing myself to the point of Deputy Johnson's complaint about ex-National Army men.
I think the reference of the Minister for Labour in the North applied to general reciprocity arrangements. The Northern Minister spoke of reciprocity arrangements between Great Britain, Northern Ireland and the Free State.
I think that may be the effect of his statement, but the question with regard to what Deputy Byrne asked is a wholly different thing. While there have been certain conversations and conferences between my Department and certain Seamen's Associations, I cannot say anything other than that an attempt to secure reciprocity of that kind has been made. The whole question is being examined, and whatever arrangement is found suitable will be made. There is a tremendous difficulty in having anything like a reciprocal arrangement in regard to seamen.
Mr. BYRNE
I have given notice of a question for Thursday, and I hope I will not be referred to the Minister's statement to-day as a reply to that question.
That is never done.
Shall we have copies of the Bill distributed to-night?
It would be very difficult to have them distributed to-night. It will be in time for the purpose of the Second Reading on Thursday, as I would like to have the Committee Stage on Friday. Having that as my aim, I will endeavour to have the Bill circulated as quickly as possible.
Leave given; Bill read a First Time. Ordered for Second Reading, Thursday, December 4th.