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Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 15 Jul 1931

Vol. 39 No. 16

Adjournment Debate. - Drainage Works on the Glyde River.

I had a question down to the Minister for Finance to-day, the object of which was to get him to give fair treatment to the people in the districts bordering the Glyde river in the Counties of Louth and Monaghan. Roughly the position is this: that in 1923 the Minister for Finance during an election campaign met several voters in that district on a bridge called Ballyhoe. He indicated to them that he was going to give them a free grant to drain the River Glyde. It was quite obvious to the Minister, and would have been to anybody, that the river wanted draining very badly. The people wanted drainage and the Minister wanted votes, so he Ballyhoed them for a while on the bridge. The drainage was carried out. Five years after the farmers bordering the Glyde river got demands for drainage rates. If the lands had been improved it would be quite fair to ask the farmers to bear a portion of the expense—that is, if they had been told prior to the incurring of the expense that they would have to pay. But they were led to understand, first of all, that any drainage done was going to be free.

The second point is that as a result of the drainage there was no improvement along the lower and the middle reaches of the river. Instead of an improvement resulting the conditions became very much worse after the drainage works were carried out. Flooding took place on the lower and the middle reaches to an extent that had never been experienced in the years prior to the drainage. Last winter and the winter before as much as 600 acres of tillage land were flooded. That land was not subject to floods prior to the carrying out of the drainage works. The Minister to-day, in announcing that an additional 25 per cent. grant was going to be given towards the relief of the drainage rates, admitted that the job was not carried out properly by the Government, and admitted responsibility for the damage. I cannot take the announcement with regard to the 25 per cent. additional grant in any other way than that. If they had no responsibility they would not give the grant. That 25 per cent. does not satisfy me at all. First of all, if the Minister had carried out the promise he made on Ballyhoe Bridge during the election campaign there would have been no cost whatever to the farmers. As a result of the drainage works the lands of a large number of farmers have been disimproved and worsened, and certainly they should not have to pay anything. Instead, they should be compensated. It is all very well for the Minister to flood their lands in order to get votes, but the people should not have to pay for that. The farmers whose lands have been flooded because the Minister wanted votes should be compensated instead of having to pay the drainage rates.

I know one man, and his case is typical of others, who has to pay £14 in additional drainage rates because of this scheme. As a result of this 25 per cent. additional grant he will be paying 25 per cent. less, but even allowing for that he will still be paying 75 per cent. too much. That man should not have to pay anything. In fact he should be compensated. Take the ordinary case where lands have not been improved. The people concerned should not have to pay any additional drainage rates. I am not speaking now of the damage done during the recent floods because the floods during May and June were abnormal. But in the ordinary normal winter weather the position has been worsened as a result of the work done. The floods come more frequently and remain longer on the lower and middle reaches because they were not properly excavated to take the increased flow of water. Consequently the water came down and flooded land which used not be flooded. At one or two points along the lower and the middle reaches if proper excavation work had been carried out and the river widened and deepened it would have taken the increased flow of water. I think the Government should carry out at once and free of charge to the farmers the work that is required to be done.

In many cases the people affected are small farmers. In that particular district there are small farmers who make a living from putting plants in the bogs. Some of them grow thorn quicks. It takes four years to bring them to the condition when they can be sold in the market. These quicks have been flooded out so that the farmers have lost not alone the grass on their lands, but their total income over the past four years. There are other farmers who, this year, have had to replant their oats and potatoes as they were flooded out. I have seen myself many fields in which potatoes and turnips were absolutely destroyed. The turnips are not so bad, but as a result of the flooding the potatoes are absolutely destroyed. In view of that, I think, it is too bad that farmers should be asked to pay additional rates for the supposed benefits they got from this drainage. They got no benefits. Their condition has been rendered worse as a result of the work done, and in my opinion they should get compensation for the damage they have suffered. The works necessary to leave them in at least as good condition as they were in prior to the drainage works being undertaken should, in my opinion, be carried out at once and without any additional expense being put on the farmers concerned. Ministers are very fond of this game of going around before an election, of meeting people at some particular point and of doing what the Minister for Finance did at Ballyhoe. It is not fair that Minister should carry on like that. The farmers in this district got no demand for the increased rates for five years. They got the surprise of their lives when they received a bill for rates for the five years after the Minister had promised them that a scheme was going to be undertaken free of charge to them. I was speaking to some men who were Ballyhoed by the Minister. They told me that if there was going to be any increased charge because of the drainage works proposed to be carried out, that they did not want them.

That was quite definite and I am sure the Parliamentary Secretary is aware that one of the people who got the biggest surprise was the Cumann na nGaedheal Senator who took the Minister to Ballyhoe Bridge that night. When the farmers of Ballyhoe district got the rate demand notes, they took them to the Senator and the Senator bore out their statement that the Minister for Finance had left them under the impression that the total drainage works were to be free. Under these circumstances, the Ministry should do more than give this additional 25 per cent. The giving of 25 per cent. is an indication that their consciences are annoying them. They should go the whole way and relieve those farmers who got no benefit, but who were rather worsened by the total drainage rate being placed upon them. They should make restitution by undertaking free of charge the works necessary to leave the lands in as good condition as it was.

I support what Deputy Aiken has said in regard to the position of the farmers along the Glyde. There is no doubt that the position there was very bad. On the last occasion of the flooding I saw—I am sure Deputy Aiken also saw—the crops, consisting of oats, potatoes and turnips, covered to a depth of at least four feet. Some of these flooded lands were at least a quarter of a mile from the river basin. I do not want to pillory the Government on the failure of its deepening operations. I am sure the Government acted with the best intentions, but it cannot be denied that the flooding in that district is worse since these operations were carried out than it was previously. Old men from the district have told me that within their memories, dating back 50 or 60 years, there never have been such floods as were experienced this year. Even allowing for the abnormal rainfall, there must be something wrong. The Parliamentary Secretary is, I am sure, aware that the major portion of the money expended on these drainage operations was devoted to works which were not essential to the river at all. I do not want to go into the history of that. I am sure the Parliamentary Secretary knows all about it. I think it is most inequitable that the farmers on the upper and middle stretches of the river should be compelled to pay rates on supposed additions to their lands as a result of the drainage operations when, as a matter of fact, their position has been worsened. The farmers in that particular district are not of the type who are always out "agin the Government." They are sensible men who do not complain unless they have good reason. It is a hardship on a farmer who, as Deputy Aiken has said, having ploughed his land and sowed his seed, sees his crops when they come up covered with water to a depth of four feet and is then served with a demand note for rates, amounting in some cases to fourteen or twenty pounds. It is utterly impossible for them to pay this rate. I quite appreciate, and I am sure Deputy Aiken does also, the difficulties of the Parliamentary Secretary. At the same time, if the Minister for Finance promised that these works would be carried out and that there would be no charge, that promise should be fulfilled and I do not think an extra 25 per cent. is at all sufficient to meet the conditions there.

While the Government must in the near future undertake a new scheme altogether and extend the narrow portions of the river to relieve this flooding, I think they should go to the assistance of these farmers at the present time. The Louth County Council passed a resolution asking the Minister to send down an engineer to see the position for himself. Candidly, I was greatly disappointed that his Department did not act on that resolution. There is this to be said for immediate inspection—that the engineer could, right off, get at the root of the trouble. Going there after the flooding, he is not in as good a position for obtaining complete knowledge. I do not want to magnify the conditions, but the lands, when I saw them, could be compared with nothing less than a new Lough Erne. This district was looked upon as one of the finest tillage districts in County Louth. It had the reputation of growing the best oats in Louth. I join with Deputy Aiken in asking the Parliamentary Secretary to take immediate action, either by way of remission of rates or by assuring these farmers that in the immediate future something will be done to rectify what, owing to the flooding, is, in my opinion, an intolerable state of affairs.

The drainage district about which Deputy Aiken has raised this question, is in the usual position in this respect—that there was a very great volume of support for the works to be carried out in that area before the works were started; in this respect also; that we received a great deal of praise for the manner in which the works were carried out, when they were carried out; and in this respect, that since the charge was put upon the people whose lands were affected we have heard complaints on all sides, but not until then. It is an unusual case in this respect, that we have increased the grant from 25 per cent. to 50 per cent. It is the only case under the 1924 Act in which that has been done. That has been done not, as Deputy Aiken has said, because we considered the works defective, but because as a result of unforeseen circumstances—things that the engineers were not aware of at the time, owing particularly to the fact that a syphon which should have been maintained for a long period had not been maintained necessitating a great deal of work—the cost of carrying out those drainage works greatly exceeded the original estimate.

Not by 50 per cent.

Mr. Bourke

For that reason the Government decided to increase the grant. On the question of the people being deceived, I am not going to join with Deputy Aiken in talking "Ballyhoe." There should not have been any misunderstanding on the part of the people down there as to how this scheme was to be financed. A letter was sent to the County Council on July 4, 1925, explaining in detail how this scheme was to be financed, and stating that the Government was willing to give a 25 per cent. grant. It was explained in that letter that the charge, on a rough estimate, would amount to about 1s. 6d. per acre on the farmers whose lands were flooded. That was placed before the County Council, and a copy was sent to the T.D.'s representing the constituency at the time. As well as that, a copy of the 1924 Act was sent down to the secretary of the County Council explaining the whole working of the scheme.

What was the first estimate?

Mr. Bourke

About £5,000.

And what was the ultimate estimate?

Mr. Bourke

The original estimate was greatly exceeded, and the ultimate estimate was about £10,000. It was a very exceptional case.

The major portion of it was spent on the site?

Mr. Bourke

A great portion of it. As regards the floods, naturally when you clean up the drains in a district the floods come down more quickly. That has occurred in this case, as it has occurred in other cases. If that did not happen there would be no point in cleaning up the drains. If the floods come more quickly they are carried away more quickly. This is a wholly exceptional year, as both Deputies have admitted, and last year was also a very exceptional year from the point of view of floods. This year has been the worst year for floods, not merely in County Louth, but all over Ireland, during the last quarter of a century.

As regards sending down an inspector, I have already been approached by other Deputies on this point. I agreed to examine what the possibilities were, but when we went into the matter we realised that an inspector could do no good. Under the present Act we have no powers to carry out any additional work, and we have no funds to do so.

With regard to the Deputy's point about surveying the scheme while the flood is actually at its height, it is impossible for an engineer to work under such conditions. It is very easy for engineers to find out what levels the floods have reached and to make investigations afterwards, but we never carry out any inspections while flooding is actually at its height. If we were to send an inspector there the only result would be to raise false hopes on the part of the people, and we do not believe in doing that.

Not necessarily false hopes.

Mr. Bourke

We have no means of assisting them under the Act, and it would be a cruel thing to raise false hopes.

That is what the Minister for Finance said in regard to Ballyhoe.

Mr. Bourke

At the present moment if we were to give way on this point of sending down an inspector we would have to do the same all over the country. I do not know of any part of the Free State from which similar representations are not being made to send down inspectors.

The Dáil adjourned at 10.55 p.m. until 3 p.m. on Thursday, 16th July, 1931.

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