asked the Minister for Health if he will state in relation to the White Paper issued by him in July last the total number of persons in each county borough whom it is estimated comprise each of the following categories referred to in the White Paper: (1) lower income group (i.e., persons in the present public assistance class); (2) persons in the middle income group who are compulsorily insurable under the Social Welfare Act, 1952, or dependents of such persons; (3) persons in the middle income group whose main income is derived from farming and whose rateable valuation does not exceed £50 or dependents of such persons; (4) persons in the middle income group whose family income does not exceed £600 a year or dependents of such persons and (5) persons not included in the above categories.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - White Paper on Health Services.
There are no statistics available to enable me to reply in full to the Deputy's question. It is estimated very roughly that one-third of the population is in the lower income group. On this basis the numbers in the lower income group in the four county boroughs would be as follows:—
|
Dublin |
174,000 |
|
Cork |
25,000 |
|
Limerick |
17,000 |
|
Waterford |
9,500 |
The total estimated numbers of persons who are compulsorily insurable under the Social Welfare Act in the four county boroughs are:—
|
Dublin |
169,000 |
|
Cork |
31,000 |
|
Limerick |
14,000 |
|
Waterford |
8,000 |
There are, however, no figures available as to the income, or as to the number of dependents of such persons. It is not possible, therefore, to indicate how many of these persons are in the middle income group, or what is the number of their dependents. There are no statistics available which would enable me to give a reliable estimate as to the numbers of persons in categories 3, 4 and 5 of the Deputy's question.
Could the Minister obtain for circulation some estimate of the number of persons who are intended to benefit under the proposals in his White Paper, showing in respect of each case the approximate number who will benefit in the lower income group, i.e., the public assistance group, in the middle income group and so on? Surely the Minister must have an estimate of that kind. Would the Minister make the figures available?
We will try to give some estimate by the time the Bill comes along. It would be extremely difficult to give a reliable estimate.
Surely the Minister must have had an estimate before he prepared a White Paper?
Not a reliable estimate.
An estimate, reliable or not?
No, it is impossible to have a reliable estimate.
To what Bill is the Minister referring?
The Bill to implement the White Paper.
When is it proposed to introduce that?
Before Christmas, I hope.
What Christmas?
Not Christmas 1951 as the Deputy opposite promised.
asked the Minister for Health if he will state in regard to the proposals for new health services outlined in his recent White Paper the total estimated cost of the proposed services showing the cost in respect of the services which it is proposed to make available to each of the following categories of persons enumerated in the White Paper: (1) lower income group (i.e. persons in the present public assistance class); (2) persons in the middle income group who are compulsorily insurable under the Social Welfare Act, 1952, or dependents of such persons; (3) persons in the middle income group whose main income is derived from farming and whose rateable valuation does not exceed £50 or dependents of such persons; (4) persons in the middle income group whose family income does not exceed £600 a year, or dependents of such persons, and (5) persons not included in the above categories.
It is not possible at this stage to estimate the cost of the new Health Services. Details of the scheme will not be settled until discussions have been held with local authorities and other interested bodies. For the reasons given by me in reply to the previous question by the Deputy it will not be possible, even when the over-all cost has been determined, to give a reliable estimate as to the proportions of the cost which would be applicable to the different groups mentioned in the Deputy's question.
asked the Minister for Health if he will state in relation to the proposed health services outlined in the recent White Paper, the estimated number of maternity cases which will have to be dealt with in a year in respect of each of the following categories: (1) lower income group (i.e. persons in the present public assistance class); (2) persons in the middle income group who are compulsorily insurable under the Social Welfare Act, 1952, or dependents of such persons; (3) persons in the middle income group whose main income is derived from farming and whose rateable valuation does not exceed £50, or dependents of such persons; (4) persons in the middle income group whose family income does not exceed £600 a year or dependents of such persons and (5) persons not included in the above categories.
The average number of births per year is about 65,000. For the reasons given by me in reply to a previous question by the Deputy together with the fact that statistics are not available regarding the birthrates among the different classes mentioned by the Deputy, it would not be possible for me to give a reliable estimate as to the number of maternity cases which will have to be dealt with in each class.
Again, surely, the Minister must have some estimate as to the number of maternity cases?
The one estimate I mentioned to the Deputy was that one-third of the population is in the lower income group. It is possible that more than a third of the births is in the lower income group but I am not sure about that.