Coiste Airgeadais. - An Bille um Thionscail na Gaeltachta, 1957—Ceim an Choiste.

ALT 1.

Tairgim leasú Uimh. 1:—

Ar leathanach 5, líne 29, i ndiaidh an fhocail "Teoranta" an méid seo a leanas a chur isteach "ná an scéim bailithe muirthorthaí atá ag gabháil leis sin".

Mar is eol do Theachtaí cheana, b'fhéidir, déanann mo Roinn cuidiú a thabhairt maidir le bailiú feamainne d'eagrú agus ceannaítear feamainn ar bhonn gníomhaireachta thar ceann an ghnóluchta Arramara Teoranta. Ritheann sé liom gur féidir amach annseo go gceapfaí go mba chóir an obair sin d'aistriú chuig an mBord faoin mBille seo, cé go mbeadh sé deacair feidhmeanna na Roinne ina thaobh seo a mheas mar thionscal. Cun nach mbeidh dabht ann, áfach, beartaím an t-alt a leasú.

D'aontaíodh an leasú.

Cuireadh agus d'aontaíodh Alt 1 mar a leasaíodh é.

English version of Bill.

I move amendment No. 1:—

In page 4, line 29, after "Teoranta" to insert "or the marine products collection scheme associated therewith".

Deputies will remember that under Arramara Teoranta, arrangements are made for the collection of seaweed, and although I do not think it could be interpreted as an industry, in order to remove doubts I thought it advisable to move this amendment so that the position would be clear and that this work would not come under the new board.

We agree.

Amendment agreed to.
Section 1, as amended, agreed to.
ALT 2.

Pádraig Mac Loingsigh

Tairgim leasú Uimh. 2:—

Ar leathnach 5, line 31, an méid seo a leanas a chur leis an alt:—

"ach ní cheapfaidh an lá sin roimh an lú lá d'Eanair, 1959."

My objects in moving this amendment and in having it tabled, in the first place, were manifold. The date which I have set out here as 1st January, 1959, will not necessarily mean that the date must be so far extended, if the Minister can see his way to meet my point of view. Pursuant to the appointment of such a day, the Minister would normally nominate a chairman, managing director and three members of the board envisaged under the provisions of this Bill and I am assuming, not for purposes of argument, but as a matter of fact, that the people to be selected will be people of business experience, if possible, or if not, certainly people of business acumen and that they will be men, or in case they may not all be men, men or women of integrity versed in business methods and endowed with that necessary amount of the patriotic ingredient in their approach to these industries that will take them out of the category of those selected by reason of Party allegiance and that Party allegiance will not be accepted as compensation for lack of business experience or adequate business experience.

Some time ago in this House, apropos of this particular section of the Department of the Gaeltacht, I gave instances of the conduct and management of affairs in Gaeltarra Éireann, the import of which is sufficient in my opinion—and indeed sufficient in the opinion of many people outside the House and of many periodicals of influence and importance circulating in this country—as to give rise to grave concern. Within some short time past I again raised this question of irregularities. I use the word “irregularities”——

I feel the Deputy is out of order in pursuing that line on this particular amendment and section. Might I point out that the section deals with the establishment day and the Deputy's amendment is "shall not appoint such day before 1st January, 1959"?

My respectful submission is that I am giving reasons— perhaps they are not apparent so far— that will be adequate to show the Chair that there are substantial grounds for the postponement of the appointed day until the date I have specified in my amendment.

Within the recent past I have enumerated—not in the same detail as I did on the Vote for the Estimate for this Department—irregularities in the conduct and management of the Gaeltarra Éireann section of this Department. I use the word "irregularities" in deference to the fact, and only in deference to the fact, that these have not been proved in a proper arena, so far. They have not been so proved because I have been denied, and this House has been denied, by the Minister's predecessor, and again by the Minister himself on the Second Reading of this Bill, the opportunity of inquiring into the charges which I made.

I now repeat those charges, not verbatim, but as they are to be found in the relevant columns of the Dáil debates. I refrain from doing so verbatim because, subject to the approval of the Ceann Comhairle, Deputy Patrick O'Donnell and I have tabled a motion asking for a committee to be set up by the Committee of Selection with the usual powers to send for persons and records and to inquire generally into the conduct of affairs of this organisation within the Department known as Gaeltarra Éireann and with particular reference to the production and marketing of Gaeltarra Éireann goods over the last five years.

The Minister's predecessor says he examined all of the matters of which I complain and that he did not see any need for an inquiry. The Minister himself says he has gone thoroughly into the matter and he does not see any reason why there should be an inquiry. The Minister's predecessor and the Minister himself have sufficient knowledge of a branch of our law as to know that these things merit, at least at this stage, a civil inquiry. It is for that reason I am asking the Minister to accept this amendment before an organisation like this is handed over to any board composed, as I assume it will be, of decent business men of high standards. Before that is done, I am asking that there will be a full and ample inquiry into the production and marketing and the affairs generally of this organisation. Otherwise, you will have a situation of affairs which I allege positively exists and has always existed in this organisation. You will be passing it over to a board which it will be possible to blame afterwards if anything goes wrong as a result of irregularities, which I positively assert exist at this moment and have existed over the past few years.

The Minister might meet me and meet this amendment this way. He might give me an undertaking that he will not appoint this establishment day until such time as this motion of Deputy O'Donnell and myself, if acceptable to the Ceann Comhairle, shall have been discussed fully here and this House has decided whether such a committee should be set up or not. This House will be the final arbiter on that.

I strongly commend to the Minister that such an inquiry should be held, not alone in the interests of people, apart from myself, who allege these things, but in the interests of the people against whom they are alleged. If the Minister gives me that undertaking that he will not appoint the establishment day prior to a full discussion and decision upon this motion, then I shall be content.

Ní féidir dom glacadh leis an leasú seo. Ní fheicim go bhfuil aon chúis fhónta ann chun teacht i réim an bhoird a chur siar go ceann bliana. A mhalairt ar fad is fíor mar tá gach aon chúis ann leis an mbord a bheith ann go luath. Tá géar-gha ann go mbainfí an tairbhe is mó ab fhéidir as na tionscail atá i gceist sa Bhille ar mhaithe le muintir na Gaeltachta a luaithe agus is féidir.

I cannot accept this amendment. I do not see the use of it, and I certainly cannot understand the reason of Deputy Lindsay in moving it. He asks that the appointment of this board be postponed for a very considerable time. It would appear that this whole Bill, to put such a board in charge of the affairs of Gaeltarra Éireann, has been hatching for years, and the suggestion of Deputy Lindsay now is that we should still sit on it for another couple of years in order that he can bring out, through some type of inquiry things he says he found wrong. I do not know what the purpose of that inquiry would be because the effect of it would be, in the Deputy's own words, to inquire into the operations of Gaeltarra Éireann over the last few years, during practically all of which time this section, first, under the Department of Lands and then, under the Department of the Gaeltacht, was under the authority and direction of Deputy Lindsay himself, and of his colleagues.

I do not want to go over all the matters that were discussed on Second Reading, but it is undeniably true that Deputy Lindsay was for a period Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for the Gaeltacht, and it is equally true he was himself Minister for the Gaeltacht for at least four or five months. During that period, he was in direct control and had direct responsibility for Gaeltarra Éireann. Those five months should have given him ample time to conduct all inquiries he thought necessary, or wanted, into that Department. I am not going into the details of this matter because I assume from what the Deputy has said we will have this matter before the Dáil in the form of a motion. Without going into the pros and cons, I suggest there is no sense to the amendment. It is essential that the new board should be appointed as soon as posible in the interests of the people of the Gaeltacht and in the interests of the industries which must be fostered and looked after. If there were any substance whatever in the allegations of Deputy Lindsay, which I do not for a moment admit——

That is a good word.

If he thought there was something wrong with Gaeltarra Éireann, he should be the most anxious man in the House to have it placed under a new independent board in the interests of the people of the Gaeltacht.

Why did you not clean up the house first?

Bí cúramach. I might clean up the Deputy. I want to say that the reasons advanced by Deputy Lindsay in moving this amendment do not commend themselves to me. I do not see that any purpose would be served by postponing the appointment of this board.

It is a matter of great urgency and has been considered for a long time by my predecessors in charge of this Department. In the interests of the industries concerned, this board should have been set up long ago, and it is self-evident in these times, with the position of the tweed industry abroad, that it is essential that a board of business men should exploit the situation in the interests of the people whom we say we serve here. I cannot see my way to accept this amendment.

Tarraingíodh siar an leasú, faoi chead.

English Version of Bill.

I move amendment No. 2:

In page 4, line 30, to add to the section:-"but shall not appoint such day before 1st January, 1959."

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
D'aontaíodh Alt 2.
English Version of Bill.
Section 2 agreed to.
ALT 3.
Tairgeadh an cheist: "Go bhfanfaidh Alt a 3 ina chuid den Bhille."

Ba mhaith liom ceist a chur ar an Aire. Tá sé luaite anseo go gcuirfear an Bord ar bun "chun na feidhmeanna a bheirtear dó leis an Acht seo a chomlíonadh." Ba mhaith liom ceist a chur ar an Aire an bhfuil aon dualgas á chur ar an mBord chun labhairt na teangan ins na ceantracha Gaeltachta a chur chun cinn?

Tuigim go bhfuil sé sin intuigthe sa Bhille.

Bhfuil sé sin san Bille in aon áit mar fheidhm?

Sé mo thuairim nach bhfuil aon ghá leis. Bá mhaith liom an méid seo a rá: ta sé leagtha síos san Act faoinar cuireadh Roinn na Gaeltachta ar bun gurab é:—

"Feidhm do Roinn na Gaeltachta leas cultúrtha, sóisialach agus geilleagrach na Gaeltachta a chur chun cinn; cabhrú le caomhaint agus leathnú na Gaeilge mar ghnathurlabhra."

Tá cumhacht fágtha agam agus mar sin de sílim nach bhfuil aon ghá le halt speisialta a chur isteach san Bhille seo.

Cá bhfuil se ráite san Bhille seo go bhfuil an chumhacht aige? Nach bhfuil sé ag cur an Bhoird speisialta seo ar bun? Más amhlaidh atá an scéal, caidé an chumhacht a bheadh ag an Aire le cur isteach ar an mBord chun cúrsaí na teangan a spreagadh? Ní dóigh liom go mbeidh aon chumhacht ag an Aire muna bhfuil aon scéim chumhachta san Bhille. Cá bhfuil an fheidhm sa Bhille seo a bhfuil baint aige leis an teanga? Má deireann an tAire go bhfuil an chumhacht aige cá bhfuil an chumhacht sin sa Bhille?

Tuigim go bhfuil sé intuigthe sa Bhille. Tá an Bord seo faoi Roinn na Gaeltachta agus tá an dualgas orm na rudaí sin a chur in íul don Bhord. Tá cumhacht agam faoi Alt 32.

Ní dóigh liom go bhfuil aon bhaint aige sin leis.

Beidh an Bord sin faoin Roinn.

Pádraig Mac Loingsigh

Nach mbeidh an Bord seo neamhspleách?

Tá cumhacht agam an Bord a bhriseadh.

Is beag an leigheas é sin.

Sin é an chumhacht is mó. Ar aon nós sílim go bhfuil sé intuigthe sa Bhille.

Ach sa chéad Alt eile, Alt 4, cuirtear síos go soléir na dualgaisí a bheidh ar an mBord. Conus is féidir leis an Aire a rá go bhfuil dualgas ann muna bhfuil sé curtha síos anseo? Má fhéachann an tAire ar Alt 4, chífhidh sé go bhfuil dualgaisí an Bhoird curtha síos ann. An bhfuil feidhmeanna nó dualgaisí ar an mBord seachas na dualgaisí atá in Alt 4? Ní dóigh liom go bhfuil.

Féach ar Alt 4 (1):—

Is é dualgas an Bhoird na tionscail tuaithe a sheoladh, a rialú agus a bhainistí, na feidhmeanna d'fheidhmiú ina leith a bheas, díreach roimh an lá bunuithe, dílsithe san Aire agus, le toiliú an Aire, pé tionscail agus scéimeanna somhaoineacha fostaíochta eile is oiriúnach leis an mBord a sholáthar, a sheoladh, a rialú agus a bhainistí sa Ghaeltacht.

Nach bhfuil sé go soiléir ansin, ó bheith á labhairt ins an Roinn, fé mar a bhfuil sé, agus idir na daoine, mar a bhfuil siad anois. Ar chuma ar bith, is dóigh liom, faoin Acht eile, go bhfuil dualgas ar an Roinn agus go bhfuil dualgas orm faoin gceist seo agus beidh dualgas orm mar gheall ar an gceist seo freisin tar éis don Bhord neamhspleách seo a bheith ann. Beidh an dualgas céanna orm faoin gceist seo agus faoi cheist na Gaeilge uilig. Níl anseo ach rud amháin, tionscail, faoin mBille seo. Tá iomad rudaí eile faoin Roinn. Beidh dualgas maidir leis an teanga faoin Roinn agus faoin Aire.

In Alt 4 (1) deireann an tAire:—

"Is é dualgas an Bhoird na tionscail tuaithe a sheoladh, a rialú agus a bhainistí, na feidhmeanna d'fheidhmiú ina leith a bheas, díreach roimh an lá bunuithe, dílsithe san Aire agus, le toiliú an Aire, pé tionscail agus scéimeanna somhaoineacha fostaíochta eile is oiriúnach leis an mbord a sholáthar, a sheoladh, a rialú agus a bhainistí sa Ghaeltacht."

Má bhí dualgas ag baint leis an teanga á chomhlionadh ag an mbord, cad ina thaobh nach luaitear apseo é, fé mar a luaitear na ceithre dualgaisí eile? Ba mhaith loim, dá mba rud é go raibh dualgas ar an mbord céanna mar gheall ar an nGaeilge, go ndéarfadh an tAire conus a cuireadh an dualgas sin orthu agus cad iad na rialacháin a bhí ag baint leis na dualgaisí sin. Muna raibh siad ann, níl aon mhaith a bheith á rá go bhfuil sé sa mBille. Ba chóir go mbeadh sé scríofa agus curtha síos ann.

Nach bhfuil an dualgas sin ann cheana? Nach í sin an chúis go bhfuil na tionscail bunaithe ins an nGaeltacht? Nach í an chéad chuspóir í? Marach sin, ní bheadh a leithéid sin ann. Ní dóigh liom gur gá é sin a scríobhadh. Mholfainn, mar sin féin, don Aire, má tá aon sórt faitíos ar an Teachta go mbeadh an Bord nua seo faillitheach i dtaobh na Gaeilge, an Teachta a chur ar a shuaimhneas sa scéal agus pé leasa a ba mhaith leis an Teachta a chur isteach sa mBille a chur ann. Bíodh sin mar atá, ní dóigh liom go bhfuil aon chás déanta ag an Teachta faoi go mbeadh na baill faillitheach. Freisin, sa Bhille seo, nach bhfuil cead agus cumhacht ag an Aire agus ag an Rialtas éinne a chur as bheith ina bhall muna bhfuil siad sásta go bhfuil sé feiliúnach don obair atá ar siúl. Má tá duine faillitheach i dtaobh an Gaeilge a chur chun cinn sa Ghaeltacht, chomh fada is a bhaineas sé le bheith ina bhall den Bhord seo, sílim go mbeadh leathscéal ann agus lánchúis ag an Rialtas chun a bhallraíocht a chur ar ceal. Is maith liom go bhfuil an Teachta ag iarraidh é a bheith deimhneathach nach mbeidh faillitheacht den tsórt sin ann.

Níl rud ar bith uaim ach a bheith cinnte de sin.

Má tá cumhacht ag an Rialtas éinne a chur as oifig in aon chás a luaitear anseo sa mBille, is dóigh liom go bhfuil an chúis chlamhsáin atá ag an Teachta leigheasta go sásúil.

Tuigim an scéal anois. Is féidir Alt 3 a rith.

Cuireadh agus d'aontaíodh an cheist.

English Version of Bill.

Question—"That Section 3 stand part of the Bill"—put and agreed to.
ALT 4.

Tairgim leasú 3:

I bhfo-alt (1), leathanach 7, líne 4, "toiliú an Aire", a scrios agus "toiliú an Aire arna thabhairt tar éis dó dul i gcomhairle leis an Aire Tionscail agus Tráchtála", a chur isteach ina ionad.

Sé cuspóir an leasuithe seo ná a chinntiú go ndéanfar beartas agus gníomhrachtaí an bhoird i leith tionscail nua a thionscnamh a chó-oirdniú leis an mbeartas ginearálta.

The purpose of this amendment is to ensure that the policy and the activities of the board in relation to the initiation of new industries will be coordinated with general policy in the matter. It is usual for the Department of Industry and Commerce to have some connection.

Would the Minister agree, if I might put it bluntly, that this is giving the Minister for Industry and Commerce rather too much of a say in the affairs of the board or in the affairs of a Minister for the Gaeltacht?

I do not agree. I want to point out, and this gives me an opportunity of doing so, that there was a certain amount of criticism or allegations, shall I say, about unfair competition in other matters by Gaeltarra Éireann from other people engaged in similar businesses. I think it is undesirable that a State sponsored board should be allowed to start some industry that might unduly interfere with other existing industries in the country. For that reason, I think it is desirable that the Department of Industry and Commerce would be made aware of the fact before the board would enter into pew commercial activities.

In any event, it is only after consultation with the Minister for Industry and Commerce. The Minister for the Gaeltacht is not necessarily bound by what happens at that consultation.

Ós rud é gur féidir leis an Aire Tionscail agus Tráchtála dul i gcomhairle le hAire na Gaeltachta, má leigeann sé do thionscail ar bith in aon áit comhgarach don Ghaeltacht b'fhéidir go gcuirfeadh sé sin isteach ar roinnt oibre a bheadh beartaithe ag an mBord.

Tá fhios ag an Teachta nach é an tAire Tionscail agus Tráchtála a cuireas tús leis na tionscail sin—gur dreamannaí príobháideacha a thosnaíos iad. Mar shampla, má théann siad isteach ins na háiteacha neamh-fhorbartha, tá cead acu deontas a fháil faoi Acht na Limistéirí Neamh-fhorbartha agus níl cead ag an Aire Tionscail agus Tráchtála cur isteach ar aon duine maidir le pé baile nó pé áit in a mbeidh an tionscail suite. Bíodh is go bhfaghann siad deontas airgid faoin Acht, tá a lán rogha acu laistigh des na limistéirí. Ní h-ionann an dá chás beag ná mór. I gcás amháin, tá cead ag an mBórd tionscail a roghnú agus áiteanna a phiocadh amach lena n-aghaidh. Sa chás eile, is ag dream phríobháideach a bhéas roghnú na n-áiteanna agus na dtoinscal. Ní dóigh liom go gcuirfidh an tAire Tionscail agus Tráchtála isteach air in aon chaoi.

An fhaíd a bheidh Aire againn atá comhgarach don Aire Tionscail agus Tráchtála.

D'aontaíodh an leasú.

English Version of Bill.

I move amendment No. 3:—

In sub-section (1), page 6, line 4, to delete "with the consent of the Minister", and substitute "with the consent of the Minister given after consultation with the Minister for Industry and Commerce".

Amendment agreed to.

Tairgim leasú Uimhir a 4:—

Roimh fho-alt (2), fo-alt nua a chur isteach mar leanas:—

Is é dualgas an Bhoird cabhrú le caomhaint agus leathnú na Gaeilge mar ghnáthurlabhra sa Ghaeltacht; agus chuige sin deimhin a dhéanamh de gurb í an Ghaeilge an ghnáth theanga ghnótha ins gach gné de ghnó gach tionscail tuaithe agus scéime somhaoineach fostaíochta a sholáthraíonn, a sheolann, a rialaíonn agus a bhainistíonn an bord sa Ghaeltacht.

Ón chaint a bhí againn ar an leasú deireanach, tuigfidh gach éinne go bhfuil dualgas ar an mBord nua seo cabhair a thabhairt don teanga agus an Ghaeilge a leathnú más féidir é. Féach ar an alt seo mar atá sé anois. Deireann sé:—

Is é dualgas an Bhoird na tionscail tuaithe a sheoladh, a rialú agus a bhainistí, na feidhmeanna d'fheidhmiú ina leith a bheas, díreach roimh an lá bunuithe, dílsithe san Aire agus, le toiliú an Aire, pé tionscail agus scéimeanna somhaoineacha fostaíochta eile is oiriúnach leis an mBord a sholáthar, a sheoladh, a rialú agus a bhainistí sa Ghaeltacht.

Leanann fó-alt (2):—

(2) Beidh ag an mBord na cumhachta go léir is gá chun na gcríoch a sonraítear sa bhfo-alt sin roimhe seo.

An dualgas agus an chumhacht. Má támuid i ndáiríre faoi shábháil na teangan, agus má támuid i ndáiríre faoi chabhair a thabhairt do mhuintir na Gaeltachta ina gcuid eacnaimíochta, ba cheart na focla seo a chur isteach san alt. Tar éis fo-ailt (1), ba cheart na focla seo a chur isteach:—

"( ) Is é dualgas an Bhoird cabhrú le caomhaint agus leathnú na Gaeilge mar ghnáthurlabhra sa Ghaeltacht; agus chuige sin deimhin a dhéanamh de gurb í an Ghaeilge an ghnáth-theanga ghnótha ins gach gné de ghnó gach tionscail tuaithe agus scéime somhaoineach fostaíochta a sholáthraíonn, a sheolann, a rialaíonn agus a bhainistíonn an Bord sa Ghaeltacht."

Is dóigh liom go gcaithfimid a chur in iúl do mhuintir na Gaeltachta go bhfuil rún againn an teanga a chaomhnadh agus a leathnú. Caithfimid a chur in iúl dóibh go mbeidh bord neamhspleách ann ag a mbeidh cumhacht tionscail tuaithe a chur ar bun sa Ghaeltacht chun é a chaomhnú agus a leathnú. Caithfidh Bord a thuiscint gur chuige sin atámaid, agus caithfidh muintir na Gaeltachta an tuiscint chéana a bheith acu. Tá fhios ag éinne faoi scéim Tithe na Gaeltachta agus tá fhios aca freisin go bhfuair a lán daoine brabach as an scéim sin d'aimhdheoin nach raibh an Ghaeilge acu. Níl mórán eolas agam faoin scéim béilí scoile. Fostaíodh a lán daoine freisin, daoine nach raibh Gaeilge acu, daoine a raibh Gaeilge acu ach a chaill í.

Nuair a thosnaíomar ar an obair seo bhí orainn eolas ar leith d'fháil — eolas i dtaobh limistéir na Gaeltachta agus na n-áiteanna ina raibh sí. Tá an t-eolas sin go soiléir ag an Aire anois. Tá mé ag iarraidh tagairt a dhéanamh do na tionscail agus na scéimeanna a cuireadh ar bun ar son muintir na Gaeltachta. Cuireadh Ordú ar leith amach le déannaí ach b'fhéidir go bhfuil ceartú ar na figiúirí a bhí san Ordú sin ó aimsir an mór-áireamh. Tá fhios againn ón Ordú cá bhfuil limistéirí na Gaeltachta; tá fhios againn go bhfuil áiteanna ina bhfuil an Ghaeilge mar ghnáth-theanga. Ach tá limistéirí eile comhgarach do limistéirí na Gaeltachta agus faoi na limistéirí seo deireann Alt 2 (2) den Acht Airí agus Rúnaithe (Leasú), 1956:—

"Féadfaidh an Rialtas ó am go ham le hórdú a chinneadh gur limistéirí Gaeltachta limistéirí sonraithe, is limistéirí ar Gaeiligeoirí mórchuid de na daoine iontu agus limistéirí ina n-aice sin ar dóigh leis an Rialtas gur cheart iad d'áireamh sa Ghaeltacht d'fhonn an Ghaeilge a chaomhaint agus a leathnú mar ghnáth-urlabhra."

Tá a lán Gaeilgeoirí ins na limistéirí in aice na Gaeltachta. San Ghaeltacht ceart, tá 18,411 líon tí a labhrann an Ghaeilge amháin nó Gaeilge agus Béarla. Níl sa limistéir sin ach 361 líon tí nach bhfuil acu ach Béarla amháin. Ins na ceantracha comhgarach don limistéir sin, tá 6,859 líon tí agus orthu sin tá Béarla amháin ag 1,775 líon tí. Idir 17,000 agus 18,000 líon tí atá san Ghaeltacht cheart.

Tá fhios ag chuile dhuine anois cá bhfuil an Ghaeltacht ceart. Is do na daoine atá ina gcónaí ansin atá an chreidiúint ag dul faoi go bhfuil Gaeltacht ann in aon chor. Is orthu siúd a bheidh an Bord nua seo ag freastal agus ní dóigh liom go bhfuil rud ar bith sa Bhille seo a chuirfidh in iúl don Bhord seo go bhfuil dualgas orthu an teanga a choimeád beo mar ghnáth urlabhra na ndaoine i limistéirí na Gaeltachta. De réir mar atá ráite ag an Aire, níl de leigheas ach an Bord do bhriseadh agus daoine eile do chur air. Ní dóigh liom gur ceart dlithe do leagadh síos mar sin. Ba mhaith liom ceist do chur ar an Aire. Cad é an díobháil a dhéanfadh sé dá gcuirfeadh sé an méid seo a leanas isteach:—

"Is é dualgas an Bhoird cabhrú le caomhaint agus leathnú na Gaeilge mar ghnáth-urlabhra sa Ghaeltacht; agus chuige sin deimhin a dhéanamh de gurb í an Ghaeilge an ghnáth-theanga ghnótha ins gach gné de ghnó gach tionscail tuaithe agus scéime somhaoineach fostaiochta a sholáthraíonn, a sheolana, o rialaíonn agus a bhainistíonn an Bord sa Ghaeltacht."

Muna gcuirtear é sin isteach nach saghas ceap magaidh é an obair a bheidh ar siúl againn? Nuair a bhí Bille na hAireachta dhá phlé againn dúirt a lán daoine go mbeadh an scéal i bhfad níos fearr sa Ghaeltacht dá measfadh muintir na Gaeltachta go raibh muintir na tíre uile dáiríre i dtaobh labhairt na Gaeilge. Conas is féidir linn a rá go bhfuilimíd dáiríre ag cur boird den tsaghas seo ar bun chun cabhrú le staid gheilleagrach na Gaeltachta muna mbeadh dualgas orthu an Ghaeilge do chaomhaint?

Is oth liom nach féidir liom glacadh leis an leasú so. Ní bheadh sé inoibrithe. Do bheadh an bord ró-cheangailte.

Ró-cheangailte i dtaobh na Gaeilge?

Tá deacrachtaí sa scéal. Tuigim go maith an cuspóir a bhí in aigne an Teachta nuair a chuir sé an leasú seo ar aghaidh. Is léir gur mian leis a chur in áirithe go mbeidh dualgas reachtúil ar an mBord féachaint chuige go n-úsáidfear an Ghaeilge mar ghnáth-theanga ghnótha i gcomhliónadh feidhmeanna agus dualgaisí an Bhoird. Is inmholta ar fad a bhfuil ar aigne ag an Teachta agus ní fhéadfainn cur ina choinne. Ba mhian linn araon go mór gurb í an Ghaeilge teanga an Bhoird ó bhun go barr, mar adéarfá, ach caithfidh mé a rá nach n-aontaím leis go bhfuil foráil den tsórt seo riachtanach nó go n-éireodh leis, dá nglactaí leis, cuspóir an Teachta a thabhairt chun críche. Tá scóip an-leathan ag an leasú mar deir sé, i bhfocla an leasuithe féin, gurb é a chuspóir "deimhin a dhéanamh de gurb í an Ghaeilge an gnáth-theanga ghnótha ins gach gné de ghnó gach tionscail tuaithe agus scéime somhaoiní fostaíochta" dá mbeidh baint ag an mBord leis.

Sa Ghaeltacht agus taobh amuigh.

An rud atá á léamh ag an Aire sin é atá sa leasú.

Do réir mar atá faoi láthair, ní fhéadfaí glacadh leis an leasú gan neamh-áird a thabhairt ar an scéal mar atá sé. Ní féidir na tionscail tuaithe atá i gceist a choinneál ar siúl sa Ghaeltacht amháin. Ba chóir gur léir don Teachta nach féidir an gnó a stiúradh trí Ghaeilge amháin lasmuigh den Ghaeltacht, agus is taobh amuigh den Ghaeltacht a caitear an bun-ábhar a cheannach agus na hearraí críochnaithe a dhíol. Dúras cheana go dtuigim go maith an fonn atá ar an Teachta go bhféachfaí chuige go dtuigfidh an bord go soiléir na dualgaisí a bhéas air i dtaobh na Gaeilge.

Táim sásta gur féidir é sin a dhéanamh gan foráil reachtúil a bheith sa Bhille atá ós cómhair an Tí. Meabhróidh an Teach go bhforáltar mar leanas san Acht Airí agus Rúnaithe (Leasú), 1956, faoinar bunaíodh Roinn na Gaeltachta. "Is é is feidhm do Roinn na Gaeltachta leas cultúrtha, sóisialach agus geilleagrach na Gaeltachta a chur chun cinn; cabhrú le caomhaint agus leathnú na Gaeilge mar ghnáth-urlabhra; agus, a mhéid is gá nó is cuí, dul i gcomhairle agus comhairle a ghlacadh le Ranna eíle Stáit i dtaobh seirbhísí a riaras na Ranna sin agus a bhaineas le leas cultúrtha, sóisialach nó geilleagrach na Gaeltachta nó a bhaineas leis an gcuspóir náisiúnta an Ghaeilge d'athbheochaint."

Táimse sásta gur leor an fhoráil seo chun a chinntiú nach ndéanfar faillí sa Ghaeilge i ngnóthaí an Bhoird. Beidh an Bord faoi urlámhas díreach Aire na Gaeltachta agus, ar an ábhar sin, ní mór glacadh leis go mbainfidh na horduithe reachtúla céanna leis i leith na Gaeilge is a bhaineas leis an Roinn féin. Ba mhí-réasúnach agus ba sheafóideach freisin, b'fhéidir, go mbeadh a mhalairt de scéal ann agus is féidir liom a rá leis an Teach go bhfuil ar intinn agam a mheabhrú don Bhord nuair a ceapfar é, an fhreagracht a bheas orthu i leith na Gaeilge. Beidh an t-ordú a bhéarfas mé gach pioc chomh feidhmiúil leis an bhforáil is mian leis an Teachta a bheith sa Bhille mar tá ar intinn agam a chur in iúl don Bhord nach foláir leas na Gaeilge a chur san áireamh ina ngnóthaí uile.

Tá súil agam go sásóidh an méid sin an Teachta mar, ar na fátha a thugas, ní féidir glacadh leis an leasú. Tá cúpla duine ag obair anois faoin Roinn, Gearmánach, Sasanach agus daoine den tsaghas sin. Teicneoirí atá iontu. Ní bheidh an teanga acu agus is rud an-tábhachtach é go mbeadh ag an mbord daoine maithe le cáilíochtaí, go mór-mhór na teichneoirí.

Pádraig Mac Loingsigh

Ní chuirfidh an leasú isteach ar Ghearmánach, ar Shasanach ná ar éinne eile. Sílim nach bhfuil aon rud in aghaidh an leasaithe ráite ag an Aire. Níl san leasú ach an Ghaeilge a chothabháil agus a chaomhaint. Bheadh sin mar dhualgas ar an mbord. Níl aon deacrachtaí ann. Seo pointe tábhachtach. Nuair a bhí mise im Aire is cuimhin liom go bhfuair mé gearán géar ó scríbhneoir Ghaeilge a bhfuil clú mór air sa tír seo — an scríbhneoir is mó b'fhéidir. Usáideann an duine seo an leagan Gaeilge dá ainm i gcónaí agus i nGaeilge a scríobhann sé ach, mar sin féin, is minic a gheibheann sé freagra i mBéarla. Mar adúirt mé, fuaireas an gearán géar sin. D'aontaíos go raibh sé droch-mhúinte agus go raibh sé in aghaidh polasaí an Stáit go dtarlódh rud den tsaghas sin. Dá bhrí sin, d'ordaíos don Roinn litir do chumadh a chuirfinn ós cómhair an Rialtais chun deimhin a dhéanamh de nach dtarlódh a leithéid feasta. Tháinig an t-athrú Rialtais agus níl a fhios agam cad a thárla ó shin. B'fhéidir go gcuirfidh an tAire ceist ar an Roinn, ach is é seo an pointe is tabhachtaí ar fad.

Bhunaigh an Rialtas deireannach aireacht agus roinn fé leith chun an Gaeltacht a chaomhnadh agus, fé mar is ceart, rinneadh obair na Roinne i nGaeilge ó thús. Is cuid den Roinn sin Gaeltarra Éireann agus is ar mhaithe leis an Ghaeltacht agus leis an nGaeilge a bunaíodh é. Mar sin nuair is é polasaí an Stáit an Ghaeilge agus an Ghaeltacht a chaomhnadh caithfear deimhin a dhéanamh de nach ndéanfaidh an bord seo faillí sa Ghaeilge. Anois an t-am chuige sin.

Níor mhaith liom slabhra a chur ar an mbord ach caithfidh siad a thuigsint ó thús gur ar mhaithe leis an nGaeltacht agus an Ghaeilge atá siad ann. Níl aon tslí eile chun sin a dhéanamh ach glacadh leis an leasú seo. Focal deireannach, an é atá á rá ag an Aire gur éifeachtaí treoir don bhord ná coinníoll reachtúil san Acht.

Bíonn an Ghaeilge mar gnáth-theanga i ngach gné do thionscail tuaithe, ach tá an bord ag glacadh cúram thionscal árd-teicniúla agus tá sé fíor riachtanach go mbeidh na teicneoirí a bheidh ar fostú acu oilte ar an obair. Dá gcuirtí coinníoll isteach fé eolas ar an nGaeilge mar atá molta ag an Teachta, is eagal liom go gcuirfeadh sé sin isteach ar an mbord ag iarraidh teicneoirí d'fháil a mbeadh an t-eolas agus an taithí riachtanach acu. Is mór an trua, ach is fíor é mar sin féin, nach bhfuil mórán teicneoirí árd-oilte ar fáil a bhfuil an Ghaeilge, ar eolas acu. Fé láthar tá beirt teicneoirí ón iasacht ar fostú, sin Gearmánach agus Sasanach agus cé gur ionmholta ar fad intinn an Teachta, ní dóigh liom gur féidir srian a chur ar an mbord. Dá bhrí sin ní thig liom glacadh leis an leasú.

'Sé an rud a bhí uaim sa leasú ná go ndéanfaí deimhin de gurb í an Ghaeilge an gnáth-theanga sa Ghaeltacht agus dá mbeadh an tAire sásta an tarna cuid a ligint ar lár agus an méid seo leanas d'fhágaint ann, ghlacfainn leis sin:—

"Roimh fho-alt (2) fo-alt nua a chur isteach mar leanas:—

‘( ) Is é dualgas an Bhoird cabhrú le caomhaint agus leathnú na Gaeilge mar ghnáth-urlabhra sa Ghaeltacht;'"

Bheinn sásta stad ansin agus gan coinníoll do shaghas a bheadh ró chúng a chur isteach fé mar atá sa tarna cuid den leasú. 'Sé a theastaíonn uaim ná go dtuigfeadh muintir na Gaeltachta, an Bord, agus na hoibritheoirí go bhfuil cúram na Gaeilge orthu-san agus sin é aidhm an chéad cuid den leasú. Tá súil agam go nglae faidh sé leis sin agus le rún 13 agus 14.

Nílim ag cur in aghaidh an chéad cuid den leasú. Bheinn sásta glacadh leis an méid seo:—

"( ) Is é dualgas an Bhoird cabhrú le caomhaint agus leathnú na Gaeilge mar ghnáth-urlabhra sa Ghaeltacht;"

One tends to get a little more suspicious not so much about this Bill but about the entire Gaeltacht. It seems very peculiar, seeing that this Bill was introduced to encourage the use of the Irish language in the Gaeltacht and to try to further expand the Gaeltacht, that it should be necessary in the Committee Stage for a member of the Opposition, Deputy Mulcahy, to insert, by amendment, what to my mind should be the most important part of the Bill. The Bill as originally introduced does not mention a word, as far as I can gather, about the preservation of the Irish language. To provide economic relief for those people who happen to be living in a part of the country that we call the Gaeltacht is laudable in itself because those people are as deserving of assistance from the State as the people on the southern coast.

I think it is a good gesture on the part of the Minister, even though he may have been amiss in the initial stages in drafting the Bill, to be big enough to accept this amendment put down by Deputy Mulcahy. The usual pattern in this House is that when an amendment is proposed by anyone not on the Government side of the House, it can be taken for granted it will not be accepted, however good it may be. I hope the new Minister for the Gaeltacht will continue the attitude he has now adopted on the Committee and Report Stages of any measure he may be in charge of. While Fianna Fáil may be in the majority for the time being, good ideas can come from this side of the House and the real purpose of a Committee Stage is to try to make a Bill a better Bill.

I think the inclusion of the first part of this amendment would indeed be a gesture, or an indication, that the Minister intends not alone to provide economic relief for the Gaeltacht, but that, in providing that type of relief — for instance, the formation of industries and that sort of thing — he is doing so in order to preserve and revive the Irish language. Therefore, I should like to support it and again congratulate the Minister on doing what is not done usually in this House — accepting an amendment from the other side of the House.

May I say to the Deputy that he may be under a misapprehension? My view in connection with this matter, which I have argued with Deputy Mulcahy, was that under the Ministers and Secretaries Act, under which this Department was set up, there was an overriding duty on the Department to preserve and expand the Irish language and for that reason I thought there was no need to have a specific power and direction to the board under this Bill. I myself was advised by the Attorney-General that I have the power under this Bill to direct the board. However, Deputy Mulcahy appears to be of the view that it would be better to have that matter specifically written into the Bill, although I myself think it is inherent in the Bill. To meet the Deputy's viewpoint, I will accept the amendment, but I consider I have the overriding power to direct the board on this matter.

Cad is brí le leathnú na Gaeilge ins an Gaeltacht?

Nuair a bhíos ag labhairt cheana, chuireas síos na figiúirí i dtaobh an chuid is Gaelí den Ghaeltacht. Conus tá an scéal ann? Tá 7,535 líonta tí ann agus Gaeilge amháin mar gnáth-theanga sa tig acu. Tá 2,608 go mbíonn Gaeilge agus Béarla in úsáid acu, ach gur treise ar an nGaeilge ná ar an mBéarla, tá 1,273 líonta tí ann go mbíonn an Ghaeilge agus an Béarla acu, ach gur treise ar an mBearla ná ar an nGaeilge, agus tá 361 líonta tí ann nach bhfuil ach an Béarla dá labhairt acu. Dá dtagadh athrú ann i dtreo go mbeadh an Ghaeilge in úsáid acu go léir, fé mar atá sna 7,000 seo adeirtear nach bhfuil ach Gaeilge amháin ar siúl mar theangan acu, nárbh shin láithreach leathnú na Gaeilge sa Ghaeltacht?

Níl ann ach cur i gcéill. Tá an Ghaeilg beo sa Ghaeltacht. Ní féidir í leathnú san Gaeltacht. Tá Béarla ag beagnach chuile duine anois agus tá sé sin amhlaidh de bharr beartas oideachais sa tír seo.

Is cuma dá mhéid tionscail dá gcuirtí ar bup sa Ghaeltacht ní shábháilfidh sé sin an Ghaeilge mura leathnófar í ar fuid na tíre. Is fánach bheith ag ceapadh go mairfidh an Ghaeilge sa Ghaeltacht amháin. Is amaideach an rud é d'aon Teachta a bheith ag iarraidh, le focla beaga a chur isteach mar leasú in Acht Pharlaiminte anseo, rud a dhéanamh nach féidir a dhéanamh mura bhfuil an sprid ann agus mura bhfuil an sprid sin san mBord a cuirfí ar bun fén mBille seo. Is cuma cén sort forála nó leasú a chuirfear ar an mBille, tá sé fánach bheith ag iarraidh dualgas a chur ar an mBord seo le forálacha muna bhfuil sprid ionnta féin é sin a dhéanamh. Má táimid chun Bord fé leith a chur ar bun le tionscail a bhunú sa Ghaeltacht, nach luigheann sé le réasún gur ar mhaithe leis an nGaeilge atá sé á dhéanamh?

Dúirt an Teachta Ua Maolchatha nach raibh fhios againn cá raibh an Ghaeltacht. Níl sé sin fíor. Tá a fhios agam, mar dhuine amháin, cá raibh sí san iarthar, agus is féidir liom a rá leis an Teachta Ua Maolchatha go bhfuil tórainn na Gaeltachta i gConamara san áit a raibh sé dhá scór bliain ó shoin. Bhí fhios againn cá raibh an Ghaeltacht nuair a chuir an Teachta Ua Maolchatha Coimisiún na Gaeltachta ar bun. Molaim é dá bharr sin. Uaidh sin amach bhí Gaeltacht oifigiúil againn, ach ní raibh Gaeltacht reachtúil againn go dtí gur ritheadh Acht Aireacht na Gaeltachta.

Molaim an tAire de bharr glacadh le n-a bhfuil molta ag an Teachta. Is cuma ann nó as é. Maidir leis an gcuid eile den leasú sin, theaspeán an Teachta Ua Maolchatha ciall nuair tharraing sé an chuid eile den leasú siar. Dá mbeadh siopadóir ag ceannach stuif ón mBórd, chaithfeadh an Bórd scríobh chuige i nGaelige is cuma pé acu a mbeadh Gaeilge ag an siopadóir sin nó nach mbeadh. Bheadh dualgas reachtúil ar an mBórd scríobh i nGaeilge chuig siopadóir nach mbeadh Gaeilge aige, agus an siopadóir sin ag iarraidh stuif an Bhóird a cheannach. Nach mbeadh sé sin thar a bheith amaideach ar fad? Tá súil agam go bhfuil sé sin feicthe ag an Aire. An dochar a bheadh sa leasú seo, tá sé bainte as anois.

An é seo an leasú anois:—

"Roimh fho-alt (2), fo-alt nua a chur isteach mar leanas:—

‘( ) Is é dualgas an Bhoird cabhrú le caomhaint agus leathnú na Gaeilge mar ghnáth-urlabhra sa Ghaeltacht; '"

Agus an méid eile a scrios amach?

D'aontaiodh Leasú 4, mar a hathraíodh é.

English version of Bill.

I move amendment No. 4:—

Before sub-section (2), to insert a new sub-section as follows:—

"( ) It shall be the duty of the board to encourage the preservation and extension of the use of Irish as a vernacular language in the Gaeltacht; and for that purpose to ensure that Irish will be the normal business language in every phase of the business of every rural industry and every productive scheme of employment which the board provides, carries on, controls and manages in the Gaeltacht."

Amendment altered to read:—

Before sub-section (2), to insert a new sub-section as follows:—

"( ) It shall be the duty of the board to encourage the preservation and extension of the use of Irish as a vernacular language in the Gaeltacht."

Amendment, as altered, agreed to.

Tairgim leasú 5:

I bhfo-alt (3), mír (c), leathanach 7, líne 17, roimh an bhfocal "scor" na focail "le toiliú an Aire", a chur isteach.

Chuir an Teachta Ó Blathmhaic in iúl, le linn an Dara Léimh, go raibh imní air mar gheall ar na cumhachta neamhshrianta a bhí á dtabhairt don Bhord faoin Alt seo. Mhol sé nach gceadófaí don Bhord tionscal ar bith a dhúpadh síos gan toiliú an Aire. Tar éis dom an cheist a bhreithniú, táim tagaithe ar an tuairim go bhfeabhasófaí an Bille le foráil den tsaghas sin a chur ann. Mar sin, tá leasú le moladh agam chuige sin. Sa tslí seo, beidh an Bord faoi cheannas an Aire agus ceapaim go mba leor sin. Ní dóigh liom go bhfuil gá ar bith leis na forála a mholas an Teachta Mac Loingsigh san leasú atá curtha síos aige.

The Minister has referred to the amendment which I have put down in relation to this particular paragraph of the sub-section. I think he understood my anxiety when I put it down and I think he has answered that anxiety by agreeing to the words: "with the consent of the Minister." Historically, these industries are scattered. Strictly commercial enterprise might not have scattered them so much. The cessation of any one of these would have the result of creating considerable economic chaos in any little village such as the Minister knows and I know in this area.

The reason I put down this amendment was so that the House would be given notice as to the likelihood of such a happening and the reasons for it. I take it that—on my withdrawal of this amendment now and being content with the one which he has and which Deputy Blowick has put in, "with the consent of the Minister"— the Minister will undertake that due notice will be given of any such happening. I do not want to tie the Minister down.

On consideration, I think it will be agreed that the amendment I have moved will meet both the amendment of Deputy Lindsay and that of Deputy Blowick under this heading. Once it is clear that none of these existing industries can be closed down in an area without the consent of the Minister, I think it will be considered quite sufficient protection. That should allay the fears which Deputies may have in mind in connection with the powers of the new board.

Isé an tAire a bheidh freagarthach?

Isé an tAire a bheidh freagarthach.

D'aontaíodh an leasú.

English version of Bill.

I move amendment No. 5:—

In sub-section (3), paragraph (c), page 6, line 17, before "to" to insert "with the consent of the Minister."

Amendment agreed to.
Níor tairgeadh leasú 6.
English version of Bill.
Amendment No. 6 not moved.
Cuireadh agus d'aontaíodh an Cheist: "Go bhfanfaidh Alt 4, mar a leasuíodh é, in a chuid den Bhille."
English version of Bill.
Question—"That Section 4, as amended, stand part of the Bill"—put and agreed to.
ALT 5.

Pádraig Mac Loingsigh

Tairgim leasú 7:—

I bhfo-alt (2), leathanach 7, line 34, na focail "an tAire" a scrios agus na focail "an Rialtas" a chur ina n-ionad.

This amendment is a simple one. It is to substitute in sub-section (2) for the word "Minister" the word "Government". This amendment, like subsequent amendments seeking to have the word "Government" used instead of the word "Minister", does not represent a denigration of the Minister himself. It is an effort to make this the responsibility of the Government and not of the Minister alone. In that, I am acting in accordance with the spirit of the provisions of two very well-known statutes — the Electricity Supply Board Act, No. 27 of 1927, and the Turf Development Act of 1946, No. 10 of 1946. That is the scheme in those two Acts and I do not think anybody has any reason to quarrel with it.

It is for that reason and for that reason alone, to have a certain amount of conformity in statutory provisions, that I desire to put in the word "Government" instead of "Minister". I might put it this way, that it is in ease of the Minister, that whatever is happening, whoever is appointed and whoever is removed — I will come to that later — it should be Government responsibility and not ministerial responsibility alone.

Ní aontaím leis an leasú seo agus ní féidir dom glacadh leis. Ní dóigh liom go bhfuil sé riachtanach no inmhianuithe, fiú amháin a thabhairt ar an Rialtas na ceapacháin seo a dhéanamh. Ins na Billí is deireannaí a ritheadh agus ar bunaíodh Boird fúthu, fágadh dualgas ceapacháin na gcomhaltaí ag na hAirí. Níl aon dabht agam ach go mbeidh an socrú céanna sásúil sa chás seo agus dá bhrí sin cuirim i gcoinne an leasuithe.

This power has already been given in this House in other legislation, particularly in dealing with An Bord lascaigh Mhara and the more recent boards which were set up under legislation passing through this House. It is true that the power suggested by Deputy Lindsay was vested in the Government in earlier days, but perhaps lessons were learned from that time. At all events, the Deputy well knows from his experience in Government, that no Government would act in a matter of this kind without having the advice of the particular Minister concerned. As I say, it has been the most recent trend of legislation in this House to leave these powers to the Minister concerned. I propose to continue that trend and retain these powers as Minister for the Gaeltacht.

Really it is a selection as between the old established practice and the pew trend; and if the Minister thinks the new trend is the desirable one, I am willing to withdraw the amendment.

If I may say so, I think the Deputy was of the same opinion when he was Minister for the Gaeltacht.

Ministers have to go to the Government for too many things, anyhow.

Tarraingíodh siar leasú 7, faoi chead.

English version of Bill.

I move amendment No. 7:—

In sub-section (2), page 6, line 32, to delete "Minister" and substitute "Government".

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Tá leasú Uimh. 7 ar siúl le leasuithe Uimha. 8, 9 agus 10.

Tá siad ar aon dóigh.

I shall not move amendment No. 8. Has the Minister included in his reply the new section which I proposed to put in as an amendment to Section 8? Will the Minister not accept that one, on the removal of the members of the board?

Nílimíd ach ar Alt 5 fós.

It would be inconsistent with the principle.

In view of what the Minister has said, I shall not move amendment No. 8.

Níl leasú 8 dá thairgeadh—agus leasuithe 9 agus 10.

Fan leat. Níl Alt 6 curtha fós.

Níor tairgeadh leasú 8.

English version of Bill.

Amendment No. 8 not moved.
Cuireadh agus d'aontaoidh an cheist: "Go bhfanfaidh Alt 5 in a chuid den Bhille."
English version of Bill.
Question —"That Section 5 stand part of the Bill"— put and agreed to.
D'aontaiodh Alt 6 agus Alt 7.
English version of Bill.
Sections 6 and 7 agreed to.
ALT 8.

Tá leasú 9 ag dul leis na leasuithe eile a tarraingaíodh siar.

Pádraig Mac Loingsigh

Níl sé sin riachtanach.

Nílimíd tagaithe go dtí leasú 9 ach anois.

Pádraig Mac Loingsigh

Tairgim leasú Uimh. 9:—

Roimh Alt 8 alt nua mar leanas a chur isteach:—

(1) Más dóigh leis an Rialtas tráth ar bith gur gá gach duine nó aon duine de chomhaltaí an Bhoird a chur as oifig ar mhaithe le comhlíonadh éifeachtúil eacnamúil feidhmeanna an Bhoird faoin Acht seo agus ar mhaithe le leas an phobail féadfaidh an Rialtas gach duine nó pé méid daoine de chomhaltaí an Bhoird is riachtanach leis an Rialtas ar mhaithe leis na nithe adúradh a chur as oifig.

(2) Féadfaidh an Rialtas, tráth ar bith, aon chomhalta den Bhord a chur as oifig má éiríonn dó bheith éagumasach de dheasca easláinte ar a dhualgais mar chomhalta den tsórt sin a chomhlíonadh go héifeachtúil nó má bhí sé gan fáth nó gan fáthanna lena mbeidh an Rialtas sásta as láthair ó gach cruinniú den Bhord i gcaitheamh tréimhse sé mhí.

(3) Má dhéanann agus aon uair a dhéanfas an Rialtas aon chomhalta den Bhord chur as oifig faoin alt seo leagfaidh an Rialtas faoi bhráid gach Tí den Oireachtas ráiteas i scríbhinn á insint gur cuireadh an comhalta sin as oifig agus ag lua na bhfáthanna gur cuireadh as oifig amhlaidh é.

The acceptance of this amendment would involve the deletion of Section 8 in its entirety. Section 8 at the moment reads: "The Minister may at any time remove a member of the board from office." I regard that provision as too sweeping in character and one which gives too much power to the Minister, on the one hand, and no redress to the person removed on the other hand. With the exception of a few words in sub-section (1), my amendment is taken directly from the Turf Development Act, 1946.

Lest anybody may be under any misunderstanding as to what my amendment proposes to do, I think I can effectively paraphrase it; it places responsibility for the removal of members of the board on the Government and it gives the Government power to remove members: "The Government may at any time remove from office any member of the board who has become incapable, through ill-health, of performing efficiently his duties as such member or who has without a reason or reasons acceptable to the Government being absent from all meetings of the board during a period of six months."

I regard the third sub-section of my proposed amendment as the most important:—

"If and whenever the Government removes from office under this section any member of the board the Government shall lay before each House of the Oireachtas a statement in writing of the fact of the removal from office of such member and the reasons for such removal."

There has been a good deal of undesirable talk throughout the country from time to time because people have been either not reappointed to office or removed from office without any reason being assigned. I think my amendment would remedy that undesirable state of affairs. I do not know what the Minister's view is on this. Perhaps it is something that could be dealt with again on the Report Stage if he is willing to go any bit of the way with me, particularly in relation to giving reasons for the removal of members of the board.

I am quite satisfied to give the Minister the power to remove members for stated incapacity, misbehaviour or misconduct but I would urge upon the Minister the necessity, in the public interest and for a proper adjustment of the public mind towards public affairs, that the reasons should at all times be given for such removal. I do not know what the Minister's attitude is. If he objects to the amendment I wonder would he consider either he or I putting down an amendment on the Report Stage, an amendment which would effectively cover my objections to the sweeping character of the section as it now stands.

Is léir go bhfuil an leasú seo bunuithe ar fhorálacha na hAchtana a bhaineas le "cur as oifig" comhaltaí den mBord Soláthair Leictreachais agus de Bhord na Móna. Ní dóigh liom go bhfuil aon ghá leis na forálacha seo i gcás an bhoird atá i gceist againn sa Bhille seo. Cé go mbeidh lán-chumhacht ag an Aire faoin Alt mar atá sé beidh sé freagrach as gach rud a dhéanann sé faoi agus féadfaidh Teachta ar bith é a cheistiú ina thaoibh sa Teach seo. Ceapaim nach ndéanfadh an leasú aon fheabhsúchán ar an mBille agus mar sin ní féidir liom glacadh leis.

The Deputy is well aware that if any member is put off the board to be established under this Bill, the ordinary rights of Deputies are still there to question it or to raise it by question or by motion in this House. I have had to oppose the principle of the other amendment by the Deputy of changing certain duties under this Bill from the Minister to the Government. I must also resist this change. I think it would be inconsistent. I think that where we are specifying duties for the Minister under one section, we should continue to follow that procedure and put the duty on the Minister under this section also.

From a practical point of view, it is made clear to me, from my short experience in Government, that in any event it would be the Minister for the Gaeltacht who would have the duty to inform the Government about the possible failings of some member of the board so that the Government may remove him. I think that is largely a waste of time and that the Minister should have this power. It is the main protection, perhaps, that this House might have, that the Minister is answerable for matters of this kind.

This, I would point out to the House, is no new or revolutionary provision. Exactly the same provision was made under Section 7 of the Voluntary Health Insurance Act, 1957. The Sea Fisheries Act, First Schedule, subparagraph (vii) is almost identical, as is also paragraph 4 (1) of the Schedule to the Tourist Traffic Act, 1952, with reference to the members of Fógra Fáilte.

I think Deputy Lindsay is very naive when he suggests that the reasons for the removal should be set out by somebody or other. There may be very good reasons for removal that one could visualise and it might not be very wise, certainly unless there were adequate statutory protection, to set them out. I am sure Deputy Lindsay is very familiar with the statement we have heard over and over again in connection with some justices or judges, that their decision was perfectly good but that their reasoning was terrible and that it would be far preferable if they did not set out the reasons for the decision. The same thing may well apply in matters of this kind. At least one could visualise instances arising where it would be, to say the least of it, more politic not to give any reason.

As I say, there is always the protection that every citizen has through his Deputy for airing something that he thinks is wrong in this House, and I am quite sure that if something should occur from the point of view of removing some member unjustly, it would be very quickly debated in this House. As far as I am concerned and, I am sure, as far as any Minister is concerned, a Minister would not take advantage of this power to remove a member from a board of this kind without very good reason and he would need to have the gravest reasons before exercising that power.

I would suggest to the Deputy that he should withdraw this amendment. I think this power is very necessary. It comes back to my mind that, on Second Reading, some people were complaining that I had no sooner gone into the Department of the Gaeltacht than I was getting rid of all my responsibility and handing the responsibility over to a board and that that board would not be responsible to this House. Under this section, I will be responsible to this House for any action I may take, and from that point of view I suggest to the Deputy that he should withdraw his amendment and that any Minister for the Gaeltacht will be answerable to this House for anything he may do wrong in the exercise of his powers under this section.

In any case, the complaints will be, not about the people you will dismiss, but about the people whom you will appoint.

Tarraingíodh siar an leasú, faoi chead.

English version of Bill.

I move amendment No. 9:—

Before Section 8, to insert a new section as follows:—

8.— (1) If at any time it appears to the Government that the removal from office of all or any of the members of the board is necessary in the interests of the effective and economical performance of the functions of the board under this Act and in the public interest the Government may remove from office all or so many members of the board as the Government considers necessary in the interests aforesaid.

(2) The Government may at any time remove from office any member of the board who has become incapable through ill-health of performing efficiently his duties as such member or who has without a reason or reasons acceptable to the Government been absent from all meetings of the board during a period of six months.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
Cuireadh agus d'aontaíodh an cheist:—"Go bhfanfaidh Alt 8 in a chuid den Bhille."
English version of Bill.
Question —"That Section 8 stand part of the Bill"— put and agreed to.
ALT 9.

Pádraig Mac Loingsigh

Tairgim leasú 10:—

I bhfo-alt (1), leathanach 9, líne 12, na focail "an tAire" a scrios agus na focail "an Rialtas" a chur ina n-ionad.

I cannot accept the amendment.

Tarraingíodh siar an leasú, faoi chead.

English version of Bill.

I move amendment No. 10:—

In sub-section (1), page 6, line 13, to delete "Minister" and substitute "Government".

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Pádraig Mac Loingsigh

Tairgim leasú 11:—

I bhfo-alt (2), leathanach 9, líne 15, an méid seo a leanas a chur leis an bhfo-alt:—

"faoi réir forála ailt 8 den Acht seo."

This is a very simple amendment and I do not think there will be any quarrel with it. I think it is a matter of interpretation. The Minister, in Section 8, has the power at any time to remove a member of the board from office. Section 9, sub-section (1), provides that a casual vacancy occurring among the members of the board shall be filled by an appointment by the Minister. Sub-section (2) of Section 9 says that a person appointed under this section shall hold office for the remainder of his predecessor's term. In my view, the Minister is precluded in such a case for the remainder of a predecessor's term from using the powers of Section 8 to dismiss him. Therefore, I am proposing the simple amendment that, subject to the provision of Section 8, a person appointed under this section shall hold office for the remainder of his predecessor's term. What I want to do is to give the Minister the power of dismissal of somebody who has been appointed at a later stage. It is only a question of interpretation.

I must say that I do not agree with Deputy Lindsay's interpretation. It is quite clear that the Minister may at any time remove a member from the board, no matter how he came into office or when, whether he was there by way of filling up the term of his predecessor or not. I shall look into the matter again, but I disagree with the Deputy's interpretation.

Think about it.

Tá an tAire chun machtnamh a dhéanamh air.

Tarraingíodh siar an leasú, faoi chead.

English version of Bill.

I move amendment No. 11:—

In sub-section (2), page 8, line 15, to add to the sub-section:—

"subject to the provisions of Section 8 of this Act."

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
Cuireadh agus d'aontaíodh an cheist:
"Go bhfanfaidh Alt 9 in a chuid den Bhille."
English version of Bill.
Question —"That Section 9 stand part of the Bill,"— put and agreed to.
ALT 10.
Tairgeadh an cheist: "Go bhfanfaidh Alt 10 ina chuid den Bhille."

Dá mba mhaith leis an Aire duine a raibh ghnáth-chónaí air i mBéal Feirste do chur ar an mBord an bhféadfadh sé é a dhéanamh? Do réir mar atá fo-alt (2) níor mhór do dhuine bheith ina ghnáth-chónaí sa Stát.

Níor mhór. Tá mé sásta leis an bhfo-alt mar atá sé. Tá go leor daoine sa tír seo.

Is deputy Mulcahy asking what does "ordinarily resident" mean?

Nach féidir leis an duine bheith ina ghnáthchónaí i mBéal Feirste?

Did we hear aright on the question Deputy Mulcahy asked? Does it mean that a person resident outside the Republic of Ireland——

Tell us what is the Republic of Ireland?

The Deputy is in the Government; let him tell us.

We have not a dictionary handy.

Wait a minute——

Never mind that. What is "ordinarily resident"——

I think it is most objectionable to be continuously referring to the Twenty-Six Counties when you have——

It is twice as objectionable when you are running away from it.

What does Deputy Corish mean when he uses the words "Republic of Ireland"? I certainly would prefer them to mean the whole thirty-two counties.

So would I, but the fact is that the Republic of Ireland now means the Twenty-Six Counties——

Why does it? Does not everybody using the term in that sense, contribute to this idea?

If a man is resident in Belfast is he qualified for this board?

I know there is a good basis for the use of it in the 1948 Act——

We are only asking the Minister a simple question.

And the Minister will try to give a very simple answer.

And he is not as impudent about it as Deputy Bartley.

Without going into this matter the State, as I remember it, as defined in the Constitution, is the thirty-two counties of Ireland, its islands and territorial waters.

Then the man in Belfast would be eligible.

Níor thuigeas an chéad fhreagra a thug an tAire.

Do thugas an t-eolas díreach. Ní maith liom dul lasmuigh de sin.

Cuireadh agus d'aontaíodh an cheist.

English version of Bill.

Question: "That Section 10 stand part of the Bill"—put and agreed to.
D'aontaíodh Altanna 11 go 14 go huile.
English version of Bill.
Sections 11 to 14, inclusive, agreed to.
ALT 15.

Tairgim Leasú 12:—

Roimh fho-alt (2), fo-alt nua a chur isteach mar leanas:—

Beidh sé ina choinníoll ar gach duine a ceapfar ina oifigeach nó ina sheirbhíseach don Bhord é bheith cáilithe agus toilteanach an Ghaeilge a úsáid mar ghnáth-theanga ins gach gné d'obair an Bhoird.

Deireann Alt 15 go sealbhóidh oifigeach nó seirbhíseach don Bhord a oifig nó a fhostaíocht ar pé téarmaí agus coinníollacha a chinnfeas an Bord ó am to ham.

Toisc go bhfuil an dualgas sin ar an mBord maidir leis an dteanga molaim go gcuirfear isteach an fo-alt nua.

Tá fhios ag an Aire go bhfuil morán den obair sin ag dul ar aghaidh le fada an lá i dtreo is go mbeadh eolas inniúil ag na daoine atá ag freastal ar muintir na Gaeltachta san Roinn Talmhaíochta, san Roinn Sláinte agus san Roinn Rialtais Áitiúil. Chuir i gcás, foilsíodh lonstraim Reachtúil i Mí Feabhra, 1957, ag na Airí Rialtais Áitiúil, Sláinte agus Leasa Soisialaigh a rá:—

"Forálann Rialacháin na nOifigeach Áitiúla (An Ghaeilge) 1944, arna leasú le Rialacháin na nOifigeach Áitiúla (An Ghaeilge), 1956, i gcás duine ar bith a ceapfar chun oifige lena mbaineapn na Rialacháin sin, agus dualgais no hoifige a bheith le déanamh in aon chuid nó maidir le haon chuid den Ghaeltacht, agus nach mbeidh eolas inniúil ar an nGaeilge aige tráth a cheaptha, go scoirfidh sé de sheilbh na hoifige sin i gceann trí bliana ó dháta a cheaptha nó ar an 31ú d'Eanair, 1957 (pé acu is déanaí), mura gcruthóidh sé roimhe sin chnn sástachta an Aire iomchuí i gcás na hoifige sin go bhfuil an t-eolas sin. aige ar an nGaeilge.

Is é feidhm do na rialacháin seo an 31ú lá d'Eanair, 1958, a chur in ionad an 31ú lá d'Eanair, 1957, sna Rialacháin sin."

Tá an rialachán sin ann maidir le Stát Seirbhísigh agus dá bhrí sin is dóigh liom go bhfuil sé riachtanach i gcás na daoine a cheapfar ag an mbord go mbeadh eolas inniúil san acu ar an dteanga.

Ba mhaith liom tuille eolais a fháil fá rud amháin. Chuir i gcás go bhfuil rud éigin le díol ag an mbord, rud éigin a deintear ins na tionscail a cuirfear ar bun. Chuir i gcás go scríobhann siopadóir ná fuil aon Ghaeilge aige chuig an mbord ag iarraidh na n-earraí sín agus go scríobhann sé i mBéarla. Má cuirtear an leasú seo ins an mBille, an mbeidh cead ag an bord nó ag a seirbhísigh scríobh thar nais don siopadóir as Béarla? Is é mo thuairim ná beadh an cead sin aige. Cén bhrí atá leis an dá fhocal "gach gné"?

"Gach gné"? Féach na focail thábhachtacha atá anso, iad a bheith cáilíthe agus toilteanach — na hoifigigh agus na seirbhísigh a bheadh san mbord atá i gceist. Níl sa leasú ach ceangail a chur orthu san atá cáilithe agus toilteanach an obair a dhéanamh.

Tá go maith. Tá sin mínithe ag an Teachta anois ach tá ceist eile agam air. Cad a thuitfidh amach i gcás ceardaithe fé leith bheith ag teastáil, "teicneoirí" mar a tugtar orthu? Feicim anois go leor focal nua ag dul thart. Ceann acu is ea "teicneoiri" agus níl a fhios agam cé acu "technologist" no "technician" atá i gceist. Abair go dteastaíonn ón mbord duine den tsaghas seo agus nach bhfuil ar a gcumas duine a bheas cáilithe sa Ghaeilge d'fháil, an mbeidh cead ag an mbord, faoin leasú seo, an duine sin a fhostú nó fanúint go dtí go mbeadh duine le fáil acu? Táim ar aon fhocal leis an Teachta maidir leis an gcuspóir atá ar intinn aige ach níor mhaith liom go mbeadh amadántacht ann de bhárr na deacrachta atá idir an Aire agus an Teachta.

Ba chóir go mbeadh ar oifigigh agus seirbhísigh an Bhoird — íad súd atá cáilithe agus toilteanach—gach gné den obair a dhéanamh tré Ghaeilge. D'fheadfainn leasú a cheapadh chuige sin.

Bhéinn sásta. Tá na rudaí ginerálta céanna le rá faoin leasú seo a bhí le rá faoin leasú a mhol an Teachta céanna i dtaobh Ailt 4, agus ní dóigh liom gur gá dhom iad d'athrá ach amháin a dheimhniú go bhfuilim sásta gur feidir feidhmeanna Roinn na Gaeltachta, mar atáid leagtha sios san Acht a bhunaigh an Roinn, a shíneadh mar oblagáid ar an mBord nua.

Ba mhaith liom a rá arís go dtuigim mian an Teachta go gcoinneofaí an Ghaeilge chun tosaigh i ngnóthaí uile an bhoird. Ach caithfimid áird a thabhairt ar an scéal mar atá sé agus sinn ag féachaint ar an bhforáil seo den Bhille. Glacfaidh an bord cúram tionscal árd-teicniúla orthu féin agus beidh orthu iad d'fhorbairt. Tá an leasú róleathan agus ba chóir go mbeadh an Teachta sásta.

Deanfaidh mé machnamh air. B'fhéidir go mbeidh leasú eile ann nuair a bhéas an Bille faoi dhíospóireacht arís.

Tarraingíodh siar an leasú, faoi chead.

English version of Bill

I move amendment No. 12:—

Before sub-section (2), to insert a new sub-section as follows:—

( ) It shall be a condition of appointment for every person appointed as an officer or servant of the board that he shall be qualified and willing to use the Irish language as a vernacular language in every phase of the work of the board.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
Cuireadh agus d'aontaíodh an cheist: "Go bhfanfaidh Alt 15 in a chuid den Bhille."
English version of Bill.
Question—"That Section 15 stand part of the Bill"— put and agreed to.
D'aontaíodh Altanna 16 agus 17.
English version of Bill.
Sections 16 and 17 agreed to.
ALT 18.
Tairgeadh an cheist: "Go bhfanfaidh Alt 18 ina chuid den Bhille."

Ba mhaith liom cúpla focal do rá fé dhream fé leith d'oibritheoirí i nGaeltarra Éireann. Nobody, it would appear, thought of dealing with one small section of workers who have been employed for many years under Gaeltarra Éireann. I am referring to their manageresses who in many respects pioneered some of these industries. They were largely responsible not alone for learning but bringing to a success the knitting industry and embroidery industry in parts of the Gaeltacht.

I find there was no provision made for them when they retired by way of pension, gratuity or otherwise. Many of them had given their whole lives to this work. In many instances, they were dedicated people who went to the most isolated parts of the Gaeltacht in order to teach the people there knitting, embroidery and the other handicrafts with which they have been so successful.

Deputies will have noted that Section 18 of this Bill requires the setting up of a pension scheme by the board. It is the intention to press the board to institute this scheme at the earlies possible date. It is in mind that the scheme should be financed partly by contributions by the board and partly by contributions by its employees.

The board will be asked to include manageresses in the classes to be admitted to pensionability under the scheme. Were it not for the setting up of the board a proportion of the total number of manageresses would have been given an opportunity of securing established status in the Civil Service. Those who secured establishment would have been allowed to reckon half their previous unestablished service for pension, in accordance with the usual practice.

It would be inequitable that the proportion who might have secured establishment should be penalised by reason of the transfer of the service, particularly when a number of them had rendered long and faithful service. To resolve this difficulty it has been decided that provision be made in the board's scheme which will enable the board to reckon for pension purposes— in the case of any manageress found eligible for the board's scheme in respect of age, health and service — half the unestablished service rendered in the Civil Service, by any manageress appointed to the board's service who at the date of her transfer had rendered not less than ten years' continuous service in the Civil Service. When these officers come to retire from the service of the board it would be unreasonable to impose on the board the charge for this element of pensionable service. To relieve the board it is the intention to pay from the Exchequer an amount which would reimburse the board for accepting this liability in their pension charges. The amount to be reimbursed would be included in the Exchequer grant provided for in Section 25.

It is the intention to make provision for these manageresses under the pension scheme to be provided for under this section.

Does this mean all manageresses at present employed in the Gaeltarra Éireann section?

It will mean all of them, as I have said, who comply with the usual qualifications.

As the Minister is probably aware, there are some very old manageresses, probably only three, who are having some difficulty becoming established.

I understand there may be difficulty in only one case—one or two at the most. At all events, the vast majority of them will be brought in under this scheme and I think we are doing very well in making this provision for them.

I would earnestly urge the Minister to give the fullest possible consideration to each one of them, particularly the older ones. I know of one who had to retire and is now living outside this country and dependent on the social welfare benefits of another State. There are only two or three left. Cer tainly, their pioneering work, to which the Minister referred, should not be neglected, even at this late hour.

I will have examined what the Deputy has said.

Cuireadh agus d'aontaoidh an cheist.

English version of Bill.

Question —"That Section 18 stand part of the Bill" put and agreed to.
D'aontaíodh Altanna 19 go 31.
English version of Bill.
Sections 19 to 31, inclusive, agreed to.
ALT 32.

Tairgim leasú Uimh. 13:—

Roimh fho-alt (2), fo-alt nua a chur isteach mar leanas:—

( ) Bhéarfaidh an Bord sa tuarascáil bhliantúil sin, i gcás gach tionscail agus scéime somhaoineach fostaíochta a bheas fé chumhacht an bhoird, faisnéis i dtaobh staid na Gaeilge mar ghnáth-urlabhra —

(a) in obair gach tionscail agus scéime somhaoineach fostaíochta fé leith, agus

(b) sa cheantar go bhfuil an tionscal agus an scéim sin ag freastal dó.

Do réir alt 32 (1), deanfaidh an bord é seo:—

Bhéarfaidh an bord gach bliain, ar pé dáta a ordós an tAire, tuarascáil don Aire ar imeachta an bhoird faoin Acht seo i gcaitheamh na bliana roimhe sin agus cuirfidh an tAire faoi deara go leagfar cóipeanna den tuarascáil faoi bhráid gach Tí den Oireachtas."

Molaim go mbeadh fo-alt (2) mar seo:—

Roimh fho-alt (2), fo-alt nua a chur isteach mar leanas:—

"( ) Bhéarfaidh an bord sa tuarascáil bhliantúil sin, i gcás gach tionscail agus scéime somhaoineach fostaíochta a bheas faoi chumhacht an bhoird, faisnéis i dtaobh staid na Gaeilge mar ghnáth-urlabhra—

(a) in obair gach tionscail agus scéime somhaoineach fostaíochta faoi leith, agus

(b) sa cheantar a bhfuil an tionscal agus an scéim sin ag freastal dó."

Admhaíonn gach éinne go bhfuil dualgas ar an mbord an teanga a leathnú sa nGaeltacht agus gur chuige sin atá an obair iomlán á dhéanamh. Tuigim na deacrachtaí. Chíonn gach éinne go bhfuil deachrachtaí ann maidir leis an lucht oibre agus maidir leis na daoine eile a bhfuil baint acu leis tionscail. B'fhéidir go mba chóir go mbeadh coinníollacha sa mBille ina dtaobh. Ach, má ligtear ar lár iad, sílim go mba choir go mbeadh sé mar dhualgas ar an mbord, sa tuarascáil bhliantúil, fios a thabhairt ar staid na Gaeilge i ngach tionscal faoina churam. Má tá an dualgas sin orthu thabharfadh sé cumhacht don bord ceist na Gaeilge a choimead faoi bhreithniú i ngach tionscal. Sa tslí sin, thuigfeadh na daoine i mbun na hoibre agus na daoine ag obair sa tionscail gur chun an Ghaeilge choimead beo agus da chur chun cinn atá an obair sin go léir ar súil.

Tuigim (a) den leasú seo go reasúnach maith ach ní thuigim, beag ná mór, conas a bheadh dualgas ar an mbórd tuarascáil a thabhairt ar staid na teangan sna ceantair. Dá mbeadh a leithéid sin de dhualgas ar aon udarás stáit nó aon údarás poiblí ceapaim gur faoi réim na Roinne Oideachais a bheadh sé sin.

Faoi mar a thuigim an Bille, is docha go mheadh an bord agus a chuid oifigeach tógtha suas le cursaí gnótha agus tionscail. Ní dóigh liom gur cóir dualgas a chur orthu turascáil a thabhairt ar staid na teanga in aon áit ina gcuirfear monarcha ar bun.

D'aontoinn go bhfuil pointe ag an Teachta ansin.

Ní féidir liom glacadh leis go bhfuil gá leis an Leasú seo. Tá cumhacht ag an Aire faoi Alt 32 mar atá sé a threorú don Bhord cur síos a dhéanamh ina dTuarascáil Bhliantúil ar éinni go dteastaíonn colas uaidh ina thaobh. Tá dhá rud luaite go sonrach ag an Teachta san leasú — ceisteanna a cheapann sé go mba chóir iad a bheith mar gnéithe seasmhacha de Thurascáil an Bhoird. Béidir gur rudaí tábhachtacha iad ach isé mo thuairim nach gá iad a lua san Acht. Caipéis tábhachtach a bheas i dTuarascáil an Bhoird agus ní bheidh sé sásúil mura mbíonn cur síos iomlan ann ar na ceisteanna éagsula a bhaineas leis an mBord. Ar na ceisteanna sin ní hí an cheist is lú tábhacht an oiread feidhme a baintear as an Gaeilge mar theanga ghnótha ag an mBord agus ar ndóigh bheadh sé de dhualgas ar an Aire, ag féachaint dá fhreagracht reachtúil, féachaint chuige go dtúirfadh an bord eolas iomlán ina thaobh sin. Tá rudaí eile ann dar ndóigh go bhféadfadh an tAire iad a lua mar rudaí go mba chóir tagairt a bheith déanta dóibh i dTuarascáil an Bhoird agus ní doigh liom go dtiocfadh maitheas ar bith as dhá rud a bheith luaite go sonrach thar na rudai eile. Ar an ábhar sin is oth liom nach féidir liom glacadh leis an Leasú.

Tá an leasú eile sa mBille anois agus is soiléir go bhfuil an dualgas seo ar an mBord agus ba chóir go mbeadh an Teachta sásta leis an leasú sin.

Déanfaidh mé machtnamh ar an méid atá ráite ag an Aire agus, ar a shon sin, tarraingeoidh mé siar an leasú de lathair na huaire.

Tarraingíodh siar an leasú, faoi chead.

English version of Bill.

I move amendment No. 13:—

Before sub-section (2), to insert a new sub-section as follows:—

( ) The board shall give in such annual report, in the case of every industry and productive scheme of employment under the control of the board, information as to the position of the Irish language as a vernacular language—

(a) in the work of each industry and productive scheme of employment, and

(b) in the district served by such industry and such scheme.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
Cuireadh agus d'aontaíodh an cheist: "Go bhfanfaidh Alt 32 in a chuid den Bhille."
English version of Bill.
Question —"That Section 32 stand part of the Bill"—put and agreed to.
D'aontaíodh Altanna 33 go 35, go huile.
English version of Bill.
Sections 33 to 35, inclusive, agreed to.
TEIDEAL.
Níor tairgeadh leasú 14.
Tairgeadh an cheist: "Go bhfanfaidh an Teideal mar Theideal an Bhille."

Tá glactha ag an Aire le leasú Uimh. 14.

Leasú 14, mar gheall ar an dTeideal?

B'fhéidir nach bhfuil gá leis anois.

Ní gá. Braitheann sé ar an leasú eile.

Sea. Maith go leor.

Cuireadh agus d'aontaíodh an cheist.

Tuairisciodh an Bille le leasuithe.

English version of Bill.

Amendment No. 14 not moved.
Question: "That the Title be the Title to the Bill," put and agreed to.
Bill reported with amendments.

An chéad chéim eile?

Má aontaíonn an Teach, ba mhaith liom an chéad chéim eile a thógaint anocht.

Bheadh sé níos fearr an chéim sin a chur siar go dtí seachtain ón lá inniu.

Fear óg mé agus tá deifir orm an obair a dhéanamh.

D'ordaíodh Céim na Tuarascála don Chéadaoin, 27 Samhain, 1957.

English version of Bill.

Report Stage ordered for Wednesday, 27th November, 1957.