Jim Higgins
Ceist:29 Mr. J. Higgins asked the Minister for Justice if he is satisfied with the operation of the Intoxicating Liquor Act, 1988; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
Ceisteanna-Questions. Oral Answers. - Operation of Intoxicating Liquor Legislation.
Gerry O'Sullivan
Ceist:53 Mr. G. O'Sullivan asked the Minister for Justice if he has any plans to introduce regulations to curb under age drinking; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
I propose to take Questions Nos. 29 and 53 together.
In addition to introducing a licensing system for restaurants and making minor changes in the permitted hours for licensed premises, the Intoxicating Liquor Act, 1988, provided for a wide range of measures aimed at curbing under-age drinking. I am satisfied with the operation of the Act.
Does the Minister not accept that the reply he gave recently to a question from a colleague of his, that is, the number or prosecutions for under-age drinking in 1989 was a mere 129, was derisory in the context of the question? Does he not also accept that teenage drinking and drunkenness are widespread, that the age threshold is coming down all the time and that this is a major social cancer which has not been tackled by this legislation, well intentioned as it might be? Finally, will he have recourse to the suggestion in that Act and introduce ID cards?
The question of a national age card scheme is still being considered. I want to evaluate the workings of other provisions in the Act before I embark on the introduction of a national age card scheme. I also want to see how the voluntary age card schemes which are being operated in various areas, notably in Greystones in County Wicklow where an excellent scheme is being operated, are working. As the Act was only introduced in 1988, I believe this is a reasonable approach in the circumstances. I share the Deputy's concern about the problem of under-age drinking but I do not want to take precipitated action in relation to a national age card scheme.
I, too, fail to understand how the Minister considers the Act to be working well when it is not curbing the rising incidence of under-age drinking. The section of the Act dealing with the regulation and sale of intoxicating liquor in supermarkets has not yet been brought into play. This section provides that the area selling intoxicating liquor has to be divided from the area selling foodstuffs. May I ask the Minister what progress, if any, has been made in the implementation of that section and why it has not yet been brought into play?
The reason it has not been brought into play yet is that the making of an order would have very serious repercussions, financial and otherwise, for both large and small supermarkets. As I said in relation to a national age card scheme, I want to be sure that the measures we put in place to curb under-age drinking are working as effectively as possible before I make this order.
Does the Minister not agree a very good case was advanced for the regulation of the sale of alcohol through supermarkets under the Act? Does he not also agree that supermarkets are too easy a source of alcohol for under-age drinkers?
I would be the first to admit that there is a problem in this area. I have had discussions with representatives of the trade. It is not just a question of making an order; I have to find some practical way of dividing the area of the supermarket selling alcohol from the areas selling other items. I am trying to see if this can be done on a voluntary basis rather than by making an order. I am trying to devise practical solutions to this problem.
Can I take it——
A final question, please.
——that this section of the Act is still acceptable to the Minister and that he is looking at a formula by which it can be implemented?
That is what I am trying to achieve without making an order.
The Minister will have to make an order.
I am hoping to get the co-operation of the representatives of the trade generally so that there will be a natural division of the two areas in stores. This will have major financial and other implications for supermarkets. It will be easier for some supermarkets to separate the areas, for example, it will be very difficult for some of the small family type supermarkets to separate these two areas.
The Minister adverted to the need to have a physical barrier in supermarkets to deal with dividing areas where intoxicating liquor is for sale from other areas and it is over 12 months now since the regulations came into effect so far as the restaurant bar is concerned. Would the Minister accept that the physical barrier, introduced as a late amendment into the legislation in 1988, should be reviewed? Would he accept that the physical barrier in a bar in a restaurant is somewhat farcical, that it is offputting from the customer's point of view and has given rise to a situation where people going into a restaurant cannot engage in the simple exercise of having drink at a counter prior to a meal? I hope that when the Minister is bring forward the regulations he will take that into account.
This was debated at greater length in this House at the time of the passing of the Bill and I have no intention of interfering with it at this stage.