Order of Business.

The Taoiseach

It is proposed to take No. 10, motion re Committees of the Houses of the Oireachtas (Compellabilty, Privileges and Immunities of Witnesses) Act, 1997; No. 8, motion re Local Government (Planning and Development) Act, 1983 (Increases in Number of Ordinary Members of An Bord Pleanála) Order, 1998; No. 34a. Industrial Development (Enterprise Ireland) Bill, 1998 [Seanad] — Order for Report and Report and Final Stages; No. 5, Criminal Justice (Release of Prisoners) Bill, 1998 — Order for Second Stage and Second and Subsequent Stages; No. 5a. Firearms (Temporary Provisions) Bill, 1998 — Order for Second Stage and Second and Subsequent Stages.

It is also proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that: (1) The Dáil shall sit later than 4.45 p.m. today and business shall be interrupted not later than 7 p.m. (2) Nos. 10 and 8 shall be decided without debate. (3) Report and Final Stages of No. 34a. shall be taken today and the proceedings thereon, if not previously concluded, shall be brought to a conclusion at 12 noon today by one question which shall be put from the Chair and which shall, in relation to amendments, include only those set down or accepted by the Tánaiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment. (4) The Second and Subsequent Stages of No. 5 shall be taken today; the proceedings on the Second Stage thereof, if not previously concluded, shall be brought to a conclusion at 1.15 p.m. today and the following arrangements shall apply: (i) The opening speech of a Minister or Minister of State and the speeches of the main spokespersons for the Fine Gael Party and the Labour Party shall not exceed 15 minutes in each case. (ii) The speech of the main spokesperson for the Democratic Left Party shall not exceed ten minutes. (iii) The speech of the main spokesperson for the Green Party shall not exceed five minutes. (iv) The speech of each other Member called upon shall not exceed ten minutes in each case. (v) Members may share time; and (vi) A Minister or Minister of State shall be called upon to make a speech in reply which shall not exceed fiveminutes. (5) The Second and Subsequent Stages of No. 5a. shall be taken today; the proceedings on the Second Stage thereof, if not previously concluded, shall be brought to a conclusion at 2.30 p.m. today and the following arrangements shall apply: (i) The opening speech of a Minister or Minister of State and the speeches of the main spokespersons for the Fine Gael Party and the Labour Party shall not exceed 15 minutes in each case. (ii) The speeches of the main spokespersons for the Democratic Left Party and the Green Party and of each other Member called upon shall not exceed ten minutes in each case. (iii) Members may share time; and (iv) A Minister or Minister of State shall be called upon to make a speech in reply which shall not exceed ten minutes. (6) The proceedings on the Committee and Remaining Stages of No. 5, if not previously concluded, shall be brought to a conclusion at 5.30 p.m. today by one question which shall be put from the Chair and which shall, in relation to amendments, include only those set down or accepted by the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform. (7) The proceedings on the Committee and Remaining Stages of No. 5a, if not previously concluded, shall be brought to a conclusion at 7 p.m. today by one question which shall be put from the Chair and which shall, in relation to amendments, include only those set down or accepted by the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform; and (8) The Dáil shall sit tomorrow at 10.30 a.m. and shall adjourn not later than 4.45 p.m.

An Ceann Comhairle

Is the proposal for dealing with the Second Stage of No. 5 agreed?

Mr. J. Bruton

No. It is disgraceful that we are not having a proper Committee Stage debate on legislation concerning the release of some prisoners, but not others, on a discriminatory basis. The criteria for prisoner release should be settled by Statute and as that is not being done in the legislation there should be an opportunity to amend it. It displays very bad ordering of Government business that this legislation was not produced in sufficient time to allow time for a Second Stage debate and a separate Committee Stage debate with a reasonable interval in which to consider amendments.

Mr. Quinn

My party colleagues and I have raised this matter on a number of occasions and we offered assistance to the Government in drafting the legislation. The Government stated that legislation was not necessary. We provided a minimalist Bill that, on the one hand, gave effect to that legal observation and, yet, met the political imperative of introducing legislation on the other. Without any prior consultation, the Government then introduced fairly comprehensive legislation, including provision for a commission. As Deputy Bruton said, the Government is attempting to put all this through in an unacceptably short period. I am not happy with the time provisions that have now been made available, having regard to the nature of this legislation which was not signalled by the Government, either formally or informally, at any stage prior to the circulation of the legislation.

Proinsias De Rossa

I echo the concerns expressed about this Bill by the two previous speakers. It is a more detailed Bill than the Taoiseach indicated would be necessary. Despite that, the functions being provided to the commission are virtually non existent. It is very much a cover for inaction. We should be given adequate time to debate it on Committee Stage.

The Taoiseach

The introduction of this Bill was signalled a number of weeks ago. Legally and technically, we did not require legislation on this matter. We were advised by both the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform and the Attorney General on the matter but because of the wording in the British-Irish Agreement, I said we would bring it forward. Second Stage will be taken this morning and Committee Stage will be taken this afternoon. That is an adequate amount of time to address this issue.

Mr. J. Bruton

Is the Taoiseach seriously suggesting that lunchtime is sufficient to draft amendments on whether some people should stay in jail for up to 20 years and others should be released within a short time? If we are a democracy ruled by law, surely this matter should be debated properly. The Taoiseach's suggestion that lunchtime would be sufficient time to assess what has been said on Second Stage, draft amendments, consider those amendments and, if necessary, adopt them, is not reasonable in any concept of parliamentary business.

Mr. Quinn

I propose amending the Order of Business to extend the time this evening from 7 p.m. to 10.30 p.m. to tease out the amendments to which Deputy John Bruton and others referred. I have raised this matter repeatedly in the past and the time allocation for this Bill is not sufficient. We are due to end our business this evening at 7 p.m. I propose to the Government that Standing Orders be amended to allocate three and a half hours extra time to this legislation.

The Taoiseach

I received no such request. The Whips originally agreed that the two Stages would be taken together. Yesterday I received a request to separate Second Stage and Committee Stage and I agreed to that. Second Stage will be taken today from 12 p.m. to 1.15 p.m. and Committee Stage will be taken from 3.50 p.m. to 5.30 p.m. This legislation is following on from the primary legislation. I did not receive notice from Deputy Quinn or anyone else for additional time. Members have had two midnight sittings and I do not believe more time is needed for this matter.

Mr. Rabbitte

I asked the Taoiseach on Tuesday to split the time so that Committee Stage could be taken separately.

Mr. Stagg

The Whips did not agree to that.

The Taoiseach

We did.

Mr. Rabbitte

It is entirely inadequate. I do not know what the Government Whip was talking about when he said the Whips met yesterday. Nobody here was at such a meeting.

What provision has been made for a separate Committee Stage to ensure that there is adequate time available to consider amendments?

Mr. Stagg

As regards No. 5a, this legislation has been introduced with undue haste. The measure is unwise, undesirable and dangerous. We oppose it being taken today.

Mr. Higgins

(Dublin West): Every songbird in the country is dreading the Firearms (Temporary Provisions) Bill, 1998.

An Ceann Comhairle

We cannot discuss the contents of the Bill.

Mr. Higgins

(Dublin West): It cannot be squeezed into this minuscule amount of time.

An Ceann Comhairle

Is the proposal for dealing with Second Stage of No. 5a agreed?

Mr. Stagg

No.

Question put.

The Dáil divided: Tá , 74; Níl, 62.

Tá

Ahern, Bertie.
Flood, Chris.
Ahern, Dermot.
Foley, Denis.
Ahern, Michael.
Fox, Mildred.
Ahern, Noel.
Hanafin, Mary.
Andrews, David.
Harney, Mary.
Ardagh, Seán.
Haughey, Seán.
Aylward, Liam.
Healy-Rae, Jackie.
Blaney, Harry.
Kelleher, Billy.
Brady, Johnny.
Kenneally, Brendan.
Brady, Martin.
Killeen, Tony.
Brennan, Matt.
Kirk, Séamus.
Brennan, Séamus.
Kitt, Michael.
Briscoe, Ben.
Kitt, Tom.
Browne, John (Wexford).
Lawlor, Liam.
Byrne, Hugh.
Lenihan, Brian.
Callely, Ivor.
Lenihan, Conor.
Collins, Michael.
Martin, Micheál.
Cooper-Flynn, Beverley.
McCreevy, Charlie.
Cowen, Brian.
McDaid, James.
Cullen, Martin.
McGennis, Marian.
Daly, Brendan.
McGuinness, John.
Davern, Noel.
Moffatt, Thomas.
de Valera, Síle.
Molloy, Robert.
Dennehy, John.
Moloney, John.
Doherty, Seán.
Moynihan, Donal.
Ellis, John.
Moynihan, Michael.
Fahey, Frank.
O'Dea, Willie.
Fleming, Seán.
O'Donnell, Liz.
O'Donoghue, John.
Ryan, Eoin.
O'Flynn, Noel.
Smith, Brendan.
O'Hanlon, Rory.
Smith, Michael.
O'Keeffe, Ned.
Treacy, Noel.
O'Kennedy, Michael.
Wade, Eddie.
O'Malley, Desmond.
Wallace, Dan.
O'Rourke, Mary.
Wallace, Mary.
Power, Seán.
Walsh, Joe.
Roche, Dick.
Wright, G. V.

Níl

Barnes, Monica.
Higgins, Michael.
Bell, Michael.
Hogan, Philip.
Belton, Louis.
Howlin, Brendan.
Boylan, Andrew.
Kenny, Enda.
Bradford, Paul.
McCormack, Pádraic.
Broughan, Thomas.
McDowell, Derek.
Browne, John (Carlow-Kilkenny).
McGahon, Brendan.
Bruton, John.
McGrath, Paul.
Bruton, Richard.
McManus, Liz.
Burke, Liam.
Mitchell, Gay.
Burke, Ulick.
Mitchell, Jim.
Carey, Donal.
Naughten, Denis.
Clune, Deirdre.
Neville, Dan.
Connaughton, Paul.
O'Keeffe, Jim.
Cosgrave, Michael.
O'Shea, Brian.
Crawford, Seymour.
O'Sullivan, Jan.
Creed, Michael.
Owen, Nora.
Currie, Austin.
Penrose, William.
D'Arcy, Michael.
Perry, John.
De Rossa, Proinsias.
Quinn, Ruairí.
Dukes, Alan.
Rabbitte, Pat.
Enright, Thomas.
Reynolds, Gerard.
Farrelly, John.
Ring, Michael.
Finucane, Michael.
Ryan, Seán.
Fitzgerald, Frances.
Sargent, Trevor.
Flanagan, Charles.
Sheehan, Patrick.
Gilmore, Éamon.
Stagg, Emmet.
Gormley, John.
Stanton, David.
Hayes, Brian.
Timmins, Billy.
Higgins, Jim.
Upton, Pat.
Higgins, Joe.
Wall, Jack.

Tellers: Tá, Deputies S. Brennan and Power; Níl, Deputies Sheehan and Stagg.

Question declared carried.

An Ceann Comhairle

Is the proposal for dealing with Committee and Remaining Stages of item 5 agreed?

Mr. J. Bruton

On that matter, now that it is agreed by the House that both Bills will be taken today, albeit on a contested basis, I suggest that there be an allocation of time as between Committee and Report Stages so that there will be a Report Stage for each Bill. I suggest that perhaps the Criminal Justice (Release of Prisoners) Bill, 1998, Committee Stage, might run from 3.50 p.m. to 5.30 p.m; followed by the Firearms (Amendment) Bill, Committee Stage, from 5.30 p.m. to 7.30 p.m; the Criminal Justice (Release of Prisoners) Bill, 1998, Report Stage, from 7.30 p.m. to 8.15 p.m; and the Firearms (Amendment) Bill, Report Stage, from 8.15 p.m. to 9 p.m; and that notice requirements with regard to amendments would be such as to facilitate amendments to be submitted after the conclusion of each stage.

The Taoiseach

I have no difficulty with the concept of breaking up the time. I understand that the Whips have already had some discussions on this. Subject to them agreeing, I have no difficulty. I do not know whether the times outlined by the Deputy are the exact times.

Mr. J. Bruton

I know this is the Taoiseach's function, but the proposal which I read is the one which has been put to, and agreed by, the Whips.

The Taoiseach

That is fine.

Mr. S. Brennan

Does the Deputy want to do my job?

An Ceann Comhairle

Is that agreed? Agreed. Is the proposal for dealing with Committee and Remaining Stages of item 5a agreed? Agreed.

Is the proposal for the sitting tomorrow agreed? Agreed.

Mr. J. Bruton

Will the Taoiseach join me in condemning the sectarian attacks on Catholic churches overnight which display the worst features of bigotry and hatred of a kind which we must banish from this land? Will he agree it is inappropriate that this has occurred in particular on a day when such a hopeful sign has been shown in the appointment of a First Minister and Deputy First Minister for the two communities who are pledged to work together for the interests of all?

Mr. Quinn

A number of matters relate to Northern Ireland. Certainly, I join Deputy Bruton, as no doubt other Leaders in this House will, in condemning the sectarian attacks in places of worship. May I ask the Taoiseach——

An Ceann Comhairle

I will return to the Deputy if he has a different question.

Proinsias De Rossa

I, too, join the other Deputies in condemning last night's arson attacks on churches, regardless of their denomination. It is an attempt to drag Northern Ireland back into the past when a major step forward was taken yesterday with the election of the First Minister and Deputy First Minister of the Assembly. I congratulate David Trimble and Séamus Mallon on their election yesterday; it is a major step forward.

The Taoiseach

On the two issues, first, I congratulate David Trimble and Séamus Mallon and all the other Members who took their places at the Assembly yesterday. It was an historic day. Many of us in this House would have thought it was not possible to get all the representatives of Nationalists and republicans, and Unionists and loyalists working together. I certainly wish the First Minister and Deputy First Minister well in their task.

I join Deputy Bruton in utterly deploring the arson attacks on a number of Catholic churches during the night. It is totally inconsistent with any notion of civil or religious liberty.

The Taoiseach

I have the list and will pass it on to the Deputy.

Mr. Kenny

Far be it from me to ask the Taoiseach to adjudicate on remarks made by two honourable lady members of his Government but will he clarify something? In debating the Estimates recently the Minister for Arts, Heritage, Gaeltacht and the Islands said the Broadcasting Bill would be published in July. On Tuesday the Tánaiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment indicated it would be published before the end of the year. As the man in charge, will the Taoiseach make a ruling and indicate clearly when we can expect to see the Bill?

Mrs. O'Rourke

That is a sexist remark.

Mr. Kenny

It was not meant to be.

Mr. Quinn

That is men for you.

The Taoiseach

The matter is being discussed. I hope the Bill will be ready later in the summer.

Mrs. Owen

The Taoiseach is splitting the difference.

Mr. G. Mitchell

I was surprised to learn that 75 members of the Defence Forces died while serving abroad. The Minister for Foreign Affairs has promised to introduce legislation to give effect to the convention on the protection of UN personnel serving abroad. The convention cannot come into effect until 20 countries have signed up. We cannot sign up until the legislation is passed. The Taoiseach informed me recently that it was not far off. Will he ensure it is brought forward in the new session?

The Taoiseach

That was my information but I will raise the matter with the Department of Foreign Affairs.

Mr. M. Higgins

The Taoiseach informed me recently that he intends to make an order to amend other defective orders affecting non-salaried staff in what was CIE so that workers with 45 years' service will receive a pension greater than £45 per week. When will the order be made and will it apply retrospectively?

The Taoiseach

We have not reached the stage of preparing the order. The Attorney General is to present a report on what we can do and it will cover the question of retrospection. I said I would like to make progress before the end of July. I will inform the Deputy when the matter has been brought to a conclusion.

Ms Fitzgerald

Will the Taoiseach confirm that the findings of the Price Waterhouse review of the Naval Service and Air Corps will be published and available before the end of July so that legislation can be introduced providing for the reform of the Defence Forces?

The Taoiseach

The matter is before the Government.

Mr. S. Ryan

What is the current situation on the mental health Bill? Has the Government lost the will to proceed with the ground rents Bill?

The Taoiseach

The purpose of the mental health Bill is to update provisions for the detention and treatment of mentally disturbed persons. It is due to be published during the summer recess. We are awaiting legal advice on the other matter.

Mr. R. Bruton

There has been an extraordinary delay in introducing the school attendance Bill which is of personal concern in the constituencies of the Taoiseach and Tánaiste. Is the Taoiseach aware that no school has been informed of the promised extra teacher allocation? These were announced three months before the end of the last school year.

Dáil Éireann díospóireacht - Thursday, 2 Jul 1998

Order of Business.

Tá

Níl

Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Thursday, 2 Jul 1998