Jim O'Keeffe
Ceist:42 Mr. J. O'Keeffe asked the Minister for Tourism, Sport and Recreation the up to date position in relation to plans and funding for a national stadium; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [19830/99]
Other Questions. - National Stadium.
Eamon Gilmore
Ceist:58 Mr. Gilmore asked the Minister for Tourism, Sport and Recreation when he will receive the report of the working group established to examine the feasibility of a national stadium; if it is intended to proceed with the project; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [19915/99]
Seán Ryan
Ceist:64 Mr. S. Ryan asked the Minister for Tourism, Sport and Recreation if he will commit substantial grant aid towards the construction of the FAI's proposed stadium in the event of it securing planning permission. [19961/99]
John Bruton
Ceist:66 Mr. J. Bruton asked the Minister for Tourism, Sport and Recreation if the sum of £380,000 for the feasibility study on a stadium for the new century has been paid; and, if so, if an adequate return has been obtained from this expenditure. [17322/99]
Seán Ryan
Ceist:69 Mr. S. Ryan asked the Minister for Tourism, Sport and Recreation the Government's proposals, if any, for a national sports stadium in view of the decision of the FAI to proceed with its own proposals for a stadium. [19962/99]
I have already given this reply to Deputies and, at the risk of being accused of filibustering, if they want, I can read the reply again. I will read the last part as an add on if they wish.
The question was in the name of Deputy Allen, so perhaps we can take supplementary questions.
I have other questions on a related subject.
Deputy Allen will ask a question first. Questions Nos. 42, 58, 64, 66 and 69 are being taken together.
Assuming the FAI will proceed with its stadium in west Dublin and the GAA will have its ultra-modern stadium in Croke Park completed shortly, if the Minister decides to press ahead with his white elephant 80,000 seater stadium in Abbotstown, who will use it? Has a cost effectiveness analysis of this project been conducted?
I hope the Deputy lives to regret the day he called it a white elephant. He is a sportsman and I am sure we all want to see a national stadium and our sporting infrastructure upgraded.
I asked a simple question.
We are the only country in Europe which does not have a national stadium. There may have been people like the Deputy in other countries who criticised everything before it started. I would prefer to have the Deputy's support on this issue.
I asked the Minister a question.
The Deputy keeps calling it a white elephant. I look forward to the day we have this national stadium because it is something in our sporting infrastructure of which we would all be proud.
Who will use it?
It has been talked about in the past but there is now a golden opportunity, with the economy in its current state, to proceed with it, and I am sure we would have the support of all sides of the House for that.
Regarding who will play in it, we have commissioned a feasibility study which is not money ill-spent. There must be a feasibility study, if one is spending taxpayers' money, to discover exactly what reasons we have for it and how the stadium could and should operate. That is the reason we appointed a steering committee and gave it funding to conduct a feasibility study.
Any answers?
This has been on the cards for ten years and, when we have the feasibility study at least, then perhaps the Deputy will have an opportunity to ask some relevant questions on this matter.
The Minister did not answer the question.
I raised this earlier with the Taoiseach but the relevant Minister is now present. Regarding the Minister's undertaking earlier in the year, possibly around July, that he was prepared to give £11 million to the FAI, did he make it a condition that the FAI would abandon its project and row in with the national project? Would he develop on the statement he made? Does he accept it could be seen as a bribe or threat to the FAI that, if it did not go along with the Minister's plans, it would not receive the cash?
No, I did not make it a condition. As I have already explained, the FAI estimated that it would cost approximately £11.5 million to bring a certain number of its football grounds up to standard because they are in a dilapidated condition at present. We are proceeding with our national stadium and it is proceeding with its arena project. I wish it well with that and I have no problems with it. However, I have made known to the FAI my views on this matter, that I would have liked it to have been on board with the national stadium. However, in no way was I making it a condition and that I would not otherwise grant it £11 million for upgrading its stadia. I gave Shelbourne and Bohemians approximately £600,000 out of national lottery funding this year. It will take approximately 20 years to bring the stadia of FAI clubs up to scratch. The £300,000 grant I gave to a number of them on this occasion is only a fraction of what is being asked of me for one club. One can imagine the length of time it would take to refurbish the stadia on that basis.
The matter of the national stadium is running concurrently and is the subject of a feasibility study at present. I am confident that, with the support of the Taoiseach and the Minister for Finance, with the economy in its current state and with the exceptional offer from J. P. McManus, we will proceed with the project. If we do not do so now, it will never happen.
I note and welcome the allocation of £14 million for the development of clubs throughout the country. Given that the FAI is, next to the GAA, probably the largest sporting body in the country, consisting of 4,343 clubs, 10,581 teams—
Ceist, le do thoil.
I will develop it. There are 187,000 players affiliated to the FAI throughout the four provinces. Will the Minister give a commitment that the FAI will be entitled to a sub stantial State grant, possibly as much as £20 million, towards the development of its arena project which includes a national training centre? Will he give a commitment on behalf of the Government that such a grant will be forthcoming for this arena project on account of all the people involved and the great facilities they are providing to youth and sport generally.
I am familiar with the figures. The Deputy is correct. It is the second largest organisation in the country. As far as I can recall it also received the second largest number of national lottery grants this year – 17 per cent to my knowledge. I cannot make any commitment because the FAI has not asked me or the Government for any commitment towards the arena project. It has told me it will build the arena project at its own expense and has brought in outside consultants to do that. It has not asked for a single penny. It has indicated that down the road, it may look for some funding after the arena project has been finalised but, to date, it has not asked for any funding. With due respect to the Deputy, it is a matter for the FAI to ask me to make a commitment whenever it feels it should do so.
Does the Minister agree that it does not make economic sense to duplicate facilities, given that there is such a big investment in the new Éircom stadium in Dublin? Is the Minister not also aware that in north-west Sligo there is a huge totally derelict ground which made an application to the Minister's office for funding for a major stand which was refused. While there are state of the art facilities in the capital, people around the country are entitled to equally good facilities within driving distance. I welcome the ambitions and the talk about the development of soccer in the region. It is disappointing that one of the oldest soccer clubs in the country, Sligo Rovers, has totally inadequate facilities.
Cheist, le do thoil.
While we are talking about spending £200 million, would it not be advisable to do an assessment of the needs and demands of the region and bring up the facilities in different counties before we start duplicating a facility that is being funded by private investors and by the FAI itself? Why are we duplicating it here in Dublin?
The Deputy has a point but I disagree with him. This is the only country in Europe that does not have a national stadium. I have always indicated that if the private sector came forward with a reasonable and substantial offer we would listen. The private sector, with Mr. J. P. McManus, has put forward a substantial offer with no strings attached. He said the country has been good to him and he wants to give something back. That is the only way I would go ahead. We will have a national stadium on that basis. The private sector has made a substantial offer and the country needs it. I understand what the Deputy is saying about Sligo Rovers, and if I and the Government are spared, we will look after Sligo Rovers and all the rest before we are finished.
Given that the Government gave £25 million to the GAA for the development of Croke Park, which I very much welcomed, would the Minister not agree that in equity and fairness a substantial grant should be made available to the FAI for the development of its arena, on the basis of an application from it? Second, in the context of the national stadium, given that we are reluctant to allow soccer to be played in Croke Park, what discussions, if any, has the Minister had with the GAA on the possibility of allowing rugby to be played there and using Croke Park as a national stadium as an alternative to the Government's proposed national stadium?
It is not the job of any Minister to tell national governing bodies what they should do. I am here to formulate policies on sport. Regarding rugby or soccer in Croke Park, my views are well known throughout GAA circles. Soccer and rugby and all the rest should be played in Croke Park. However, I am not here to tell the GAA authorities what to do. I submit that there have been tremendous steps forward in GAA thinking in recent years, particularly with the accession of Joe McDonagh as President of the GAA. I hope that will continue into the future. I have also said in the past that I believe a financial reality will one day dawn there and these games will be allowed to be played. Let us face facts. Cultural change here is very slow. It probably takes 50 years to get a process through. I have not had discussions with the GAA, because that is a matter for the GAA.
Regarding the second part of the question, there has not been a submission to me from the FAI. That does not mean I do not expect one in the near future. I know Pat Quigley and I know Bernard Byrne. I know they are cute enough to know they have enough money to go where they are going now. The Deputy should not think I do not expect to be hit with an application in the hear future. I can do nothing until that time arrives.
At the risk of pushing the Minister into another bout of hyperventilation, in the context of Croke Park developing its stadium at a cost of about £120 million and the FAI going ahead with its stadium in Dublin West, who does he see using the Taj Mahal in Abbotstown? Will it be used for tiddlywinks? Who will use it? Has the Minister done any cost effective analysis on this project?
We await the results of a feasibility study on this matter which will be brought to Government. The Deputy will then have a chance to ask appropriate and meaningful questions on the issue. The national stadium which is envisaged is a stadium which will have an outdoor and an indoor area to it. It will encompass all sports, not just the FAI, GAA and IRFU. I see other sports being encompassed in this area as well.
Tiddlywinks?
Yes. If a tiddlywinks championship happens to be held, I am sure we could facilitate it as well. I can see everything happening in the national stadium. If the Deputy could possibly wait for another few weeks, I can update that information.
How are we going to fill it? Is the Minister expecting to get 70,000 or 80,000 people.