Michael Noonan
Ceist:1 Mr. Noonan asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the recent work of the Information Society Commission; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [7471/02]
Ceisteanna – Questions. - Information Society Commission.
I announced the appointment of a new Information Society Commission on 27 November last. It is being chaired by Dr. Danny O'Hare, former president of DCU. The commission will act as an independent advisory body to the Government and draws on high-level representation from the business community, the social partners and Government itself. It will report directly to me. The secretariat to support the work of the new commission is being provided by my Department.
The remit of the new commission is to highlight the challenges and opportunities presented by information society developments; to monitor Ireland's performance in its evolution as an information society, both nationally and internationally; to identify areas of co-operation with other jurisdictions, including establishment of links with the Northern Ireland information age initiative; and to establish working groups, as required, to provide expert advice on specific areas of public policy development.
I understand the new commission is currently getting its work programme under way, including arrangements for setting up the working groups it has decided to establish. I am confident the new commission will play a key role in shaping the public policy framework for the evolving information society in Ireland.
Does the Taoiseach recall that five years ago the Government stated its ambition that Ireland, as a modern industrial nation, would lead Europe in information technology? Does he realise that out of 30 OECD countries, Ireland is ranked 25th, and that former eastern bloc countries, such as Poland, the Czech Republic and Hungary, are ahead of Ireland in the league table for access to broadband technology? Against this background, will the Taoiseach explain why it took him 12 months to appoint the Information Society Commission, which had been vacant for 11 months? Will he assure people outside the greater Dublin area that they will still be considered competitive locations for inward investment, especially by companies that require access to broadband?
The statistic quoted by the Deputy is correct but it is one of many benchmarks. The OECD publishes reports about different aspects of information communication technology. The World Markets Research Centre, probably the best overseer of information communication technology, ranks Ireland sixth out of 196 nations surveyed in its annual global e-government survey. There are many other studies by the FT and the OECD that rank us highly.
We are low on the list referred to by Deputy Noonan but as a small country we can quickly move into the top ten if we take the necessary corrective action. That action consists of three phases and it is important that they are dealt with for the future of the economy. The first phase, 1998-99, was to establish international activity between Ireland, the Continent and the rest of the world. That was achieved through the major developments carried out by Global Crossing and 360 Networks, two enormous projects that linked this island to the international stage. The second phase was to achieve public and private sector involvement at regional level. That has taken a few years but is being successfully put in place around the country.
The delay arose in the final loop because the private sector, for reasons I have previously explained to the House, did not have the capacity or resources to do it. Two major studies were undertaken by Brian Thompson, a member of the Economic Advisory Group and a world renowned expert in the field, and by an interdepartmental committee. Both have reported and now the local loop around the country remains to be done. The Minister for Public Enterprise announced the commencement of that project recently.
The Deputy asked if resources will be available for the project. A sum of €200 million, including €60 million for the first 19 towns announced recently by the Minister, many of them in the Border, midlands and western regions, has been allocated for this purpose in the national development plan. The towns are Waterford, Wexford, Carlow, Clonmel, Kilkenny, Cork, Shannon, Limerick, Galway, Athlone, Mullingar, Carrick-on-Shannon, Manorhamilton, Roscommon, Portlaoise, Gaoth Dobhair, Letterkenny, Tullamore and Ballina. The money required for the 19 different contracts, €60 million, is available and will be met in full by the State. The costs are mainly civil engineering costs as it is not a major infrastructural project. According to the projections, the 19 schemes will be completed this year.
IDA Ireland and the other development agencies have identified 67 other towns which have to be done. While I hope some of the €60 million within the €200 million allocation in the national development plan will be used for this second group, it will not pay for it all. My hope is that the private sector will get involved and it seems from Brian Thompson's report that it will. This will mean coverage of a further 67 towns in the next three years, of which this year is the first.
The report then identified 123 other areas with populations of more than 1,500 which should also be linked up within five years. This would also have to be partially paid for by the State. That is the overall plan and if we complete even the first part, we will go way up the league table. If we complete the second part, we will rise to number five or six. Therefore, we are in a very good position having done the groundwork in getting the international link.
While I do not want to get into an argument with the Deputy on the matter, the idea that one could complete the local loop before establishing connnectivity with the Continent—
Who said that?
The Deputy.
I did not.
Perhaps in the text of his comments on "Morning Ireland" he is misquoted.
We all know it is at international—
The Deputy said it should have been done five years ago. How could it have been done five years ago when there was no link? It could not because it was a physical impossibility.
The Taoiseach is huffing and puffing.
The Taoiseach is not yet Leader of the Opposition.
One can say anything as Leader of the Opposition. I am just trying to explain how the process works so that the Deputy will be sufficiently knowledgeable on it to be able to tell "Morning Ireland" how it works the next time he is asked.
Does the Taoiseach realise that it costs three times as much to transmit a segment of data from Cork, Galway, Limerick or Sligo to Dublin than to transmit the same segment of data from Dublin to the United States of America? Does he agree that two issues are at stake, an affordability and an availability issue, because certain areas have no access to broadband while in other areas, the major cities outside Dublin, access is unaffordable? Does he also agree that while we welcome the initiative by which local authorities will loop their major towns, to do this without having a regional network outside Dublin is akin to having a ringroad around a town and a boreen from the town to Dublin? What does the Taoiseach propose to do to ensure there is a regional loop network outside the main towns and certain local authority areas?
There is an affordability issue which will continue until we get the entire infrastructure in place. The Minister appointed an expert group to manage the regional broadband strategy, the one asked for by the Deputy. The matter is being organised by people from Iona Technologies, Microsoft, Hewlett Packard, Science Foundation Ireland and the Department. The first two phases will extend broadband to one million people. What we are effectively doing is providing initial key regional towns with quality cheap access to the superhighway. The superhighway is there internationally and regionally and now it is there in the local loop. The initiative will provide the necessary boost to industry and, more importantly, to consumers and to education, and it will do so in a successful way.
The project as announced by the Minister dovetails with the report of Brian Thompson on the Infocoms committee. That referred to the need for greater penetration to reposition Ireland in the light of the technology downturn and being able to pull in direct foreign investment into the regions. If we follow what has been set out in the two reports, allied to the initiative of the Atlantic broadband corridor, we will see an excellent roll-out of metro fibre rings as part of PPPs not just within the cities but, more importantly, as Deputy Noonan points out, within the regions. It will take time – there are 19 centres this year – but the regional strategy is being overseen by the Department with the help of outside experts.
Arising from the Taoiseach's remark relating this distribution of broadband technology to foreign investment, does the selection of towns for broadband and the various phases reflect the Government's priorities regarding different towns as per the still unpublished and secret national spatial strategy? In particular, how was a selection made whereby not one town in Meath was included among the 19 towns of phase 1 and only one was included in the 67 for phase 2? Why is the county with the most rapidly growing population in Ireland the one getting the least priority as far as broadband technology is concerned, particularly given the critical nature of broadband for jobs? There is only 25% of the population of Meath employed in foreign industries while in Kildare, for example, there is 68% employed in such industries.
The whole roll-out is done in conjunction with the development agencies. Those agencies would like us to have 67 towns included as they have identified 67, and the 19 towns are the first of those 67. The 19 are large centres where a big impact can be made in a prompt way, covering one million people. That is the reason behind this. Over the next few years – only three years are involved – we will have 67 towns. The selection was on the advice of IDA Ireland, the local authorities and other State agencies.
Is the Taoiseach blaming IDA Ireland for the fact that Meath is being downgraded in the distribution of broadband? Is it not the case that a mistake is being made? The Government and IDA Ireland are using 1996 census figures which completely understate the population of Meath. If more modern figures were used, at least three towns in Meath, including Ashbourne, would be in the first or second phase. This is blatant discrimination against Meath. There are four towns in Kildare and three in Louth included in phase 2, while only one in Meath – Navan – is included. That is surely not justified.
Within the 67 towns, Dunshaughlin, Kells, Trim and Dunboyne are also listed.
That is phase 3, the never-never list.
That is all within a five year period.
I have read that list too. Live horse and get grass.
It is within a five year period and it is not a never-never list.
The Taoiseach's priorities are manifest.
Within five years every town of more than 1,500 people will be covered.
The Taoiseach played a major role in the peace process. His predecessor, Deputy John Bruton played a role, as did many others. We were promised a peace dividend, but that can only come about if there is infrastructure to facilitate job creation. Counties Monaghan and Cavan, which I represent, are not included in the list of areas to benefit from broadband technology in phase 1, just as they were not mentioned in plans for better roads and gas infrastructure. After 30 years of troubles, hardship and a lack of inward investment, can the Taoiseach outline when this region will be put on the map and given the necessary infrastructure, broadband or otherwise? We were promised public investment some years ago, but we are now told that private public partnership will be used. If this mechanism was insufficient for the needs of the larger tasks, how will it be able to cope with smaller ones?
The State has decided to develop 19 priority towns in phase 1 as the private sector was unable to do so. Many Border towns are among those to be prioritised in phase 2, which will last three years. While every town cannot be included, a number of towns in Deputy Crawford's area will be included in phase 2 and 3, planning for which will start soon. The first 19 connections will be commenced by local authorities this year.
Public private partnerships were unable to do the major job, so how can the Taoiseach justify asking them to roll out the second phase? Can the Taoiseach tell us how that will happen?
The Minister for Public Enterprise has set out how contracts for the first 19 towns will be drawn up with local authorities and the tendering process has already started. I am confident there will be no great difficulties. I have been told the process will take about six months after the agreement of tenders. While it is not a small job, it cannot be said that it is a large infrastructural task. The committee's report stated that it will take between six and nine months. Private sector funds will be needed to develop the full list of 123 towns. The reports of the advisory committee on intercoms and the interdepartmental committee, which involved IBEC, State agencies and others, agreed that State investment in this area would attract the private sector. There is every indication that this will happen after the State has shown itself to be the driving force behind the project. The committees reported an unwillingness to do what was originally hoped, as resources are unavailable as a result of issues relating to 3G licences and other matters, so we can forget about that. The State's seed capital will mean that 67 towns can be connected quickly and a huge part of the population will be covered within three years.
Is the Border area included?
Border towns like Monaghan, Carrickmacross, Cavan, Buncrana and Letterkenny are included.
Can the Taoiseach explain why Tralee was not included in phase 1 of the broadband project, in view of the fact that it boasts one of the finest technology parks in the country? Does he agree that towns like Tralee and Listowel will find it increasingly difficult to attract foreign investment as a result of their lack of broadband capability and that they will be totally disadvantaged compared to towns in the vicinity of Dublin?
Tralee is on the list for phase 2.
Three years is a long time.
Listowel is also on the list. The achievement of the three year target may depend on the level of interest within the private sector. The national development plan provides quite an amount of money to act as seed capital. More work would have been done in this area last year, to be frank, had there been greater interest from the private sector. However, private investors are now showing an interest and a determination to participate in this project.