Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Tuesday, 27 Jan 2009

Vol. 672 No. 2

Order of Business.

The Taoiseach

It is proposed to take No. 8, motion re ministerial rota for parliamentary questions; and No. a4, Residential Tenancies (Amendment) Bill 2009 — Order for Second Stage and Second and Remaining Stages, which is on the second supplementary Order Paper.

It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that (1) No. 8 shall be decided without debate; (2) Second and Remaining Stages of No. a4 shall be taken today and the following arrangements shall apply: (i) the proceedings on Second Stage shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion at 6.35 p.m. tonight; the opening speeches of a Minister or Minister of State and of the main spokespersons for the Fine Gael Party and the Labour Party, who shall be called upon in that order, shall not exceed 15 minutes in each case; the speech of each other Member called upon shall not exceed ten minutes in each case; Members may share time; and a Minister or Minister of State shall be called upon to make a speech in reply which shall not exceed five minutes; and (ii) the proceedings on Committee and Remaining Stages shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion at 7 p.m. by one question which shall be put from the Chair and which shall, in regard to amendments, include only those set down or accepted by the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government; and (3) Private Members’ business, No. 48, motion re child protection, shall be taken for 90 minutes at 7 p.m. or on the conclusion of No. a4, whichever is the later.

Deputy Emmet Stagg

On a point of order, in respect of No. a4, I wish to bring to the attention of the Taoiseach that it was agreed that the time allocated for the main spokespersons would be ten minutes, not 15 minutes.

The Taoiseach

I understand that is correct.

An Ceann Comhairle

There are three proposals to be put to the House. Is the proposal for dealing with No. 8, motion re ministerial rota for parliamentary questions, without debate, agreed to?

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

No, it is not agreed.

The proposal as presented here today, in the context of the economic crisis we currently face, fails to provide for the sharing of all the critical information necessary for Members of this House to fully play their part in addressing and seeking out solutions to the problems now presenting. The Taoiseach circulated a framework document to the social partners today to engage with them on matters pertaining to the agreement signed up to last year. Members of this House are not being made privy to the content and detail of that framework document.

In light of the debate currently signalled for the next two days and given that the substantial amount of work this House will address over the three sitting days of this week are statements on the economy, Members, in the absence of that information, are being asked to participate without the full raft of information necessary to inform their participation. Will the Taoiseach indicate that he will circulate the detail of the framework document that has been presented to the social partners to all Members to facilitate an informed debate and participation, given that he and other spokespersons, including the Minister for Finance, have repeatedly challenged the Opposition voices to come up with other solutions? All Opposition voices have a role in this regard in terms of providing information and making useful proposals, but that can only be done in the context of a sharing of the full information available.

If the Taoiseach is prepared to share with the social partners outside this House the content of the framework document, surely he has a responsibility to share the same information with the elected representatives in this House. I am not prepared to agree to the Order of Business in the absence of the Taoiseach indicating that this information will be shared to enable us to properly prepare for the statements on the economy over the next two days.

An Ceann Comhairle

I will call the Taoiseach to reply, but I must point out that the proposal before the House deals with the ministerial rota for parliamentary questions. There is no proposal before the House on the economy. That is a matter for tomorrow. In any event, I call the Taoiseach to reply.

The Taoiseach

To answer the Deputy on the general point, if agreement is reached, obviously a framework document will be published. Discussions are ongoing. I make the point that we set out a framework based on the principles by which we will seek to deal with the situation this country is facing. We will work together in the weeks and months ahead to make sure that we implement policies that meet the requirements of the situation we face. That is the way we did it before when we introduced the Programme for National Recovery and that is what we should do now. The details we can work out are those that can emerge in due course.

The important political statement to be made in this country at this time is that all stakeholders in this society will work together to try to bring about a resolution to our problems, based on principles we can all share and to which we can all subscribe, and act in a political way to try to drive confidence inside and outside the country. That is what we are trying to do. That is the first prerequisite.

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

It cannot be done by excluding the other parties represented in this country. It cannot be done in that way.

The Taoiseach

If we want to avoid partisanship, and we should have political competition of ideas, let it be said that the Government's approach is that we will find a method by which we will deal with the situation.

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

By excluding——

The Taoiseach

I did not interrupt the Deputy and I am answering his question, which is out of order. Therefore, he might listen with respect to what I have to say.

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

It is not out of order.

The Taoiseach

If he is asking whether, if there is agreement on a framework document, he will have a copy of it, he will because it will be published.

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

No, we want the information now because we have a duty and a responsibility as representatives to participate fully in this debate.

An Ceann Comhairle

I will now put the question. Is the proposal for dealing with No. 8, motion re ministerial rota for parliamentary questions, without debate, agreed to?

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

No. Vótail.

An Ceann Comhairle

Will the Deputies who are claiming a division please rise?

Deputies Ferris, McGrath, Ó Caoláin and Ó Snodaigh rose.

An Ceann Comhairle

As fewer than ten Members have risen I declare the question carried. In accordance with Standing Order 68 the names of the Deputies dissenting will be recorded in the Journal of the Proceedings of the Dáil.

Question declared carried.

An Ceann Comhairle

Is the proposal for dealing with No. a4 agreed to?

Deputy Enda Kenny

I ask the Taoiseach what is the urgency that attaches to this Bill. It has been brought to our attention only since yesterday afternoon.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

The Labour Party does not support the arrangements for this Bill, for two reasons. First, we are on the eve of a major debate on the economy and the Government has not yet informed the House as to what exactly it proposes. It will be somewhat absurd to have a major economic debate tomorrow without having heard what are the Government's proposals. Presumably by the time the Government announces its proposals we will have had the debate. It really is an absurd way of doing business.

I wish to hear from the Taoiseach whether he has any proposals to change the arrangements for the economic debate, either in such a way that we have the proposals and the Government's decisions before tomorrow, or that the time of the debate be changed in order for it to take place after the Government's proposals are announced.

The second reason for opposing this item is that the Bill is further evidence of the Government's incompetence.

Deputies

Hear, hear.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

It is another piece of legislation to plug a legislative hole that the Government created. We already had the experience last year whereby the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, Deputy Gormley, appointed members of local authorities to the Private Residential Tenancies Board, for which he had no authority. We now have legislation which proposes that appointments made within the framework of the Residential Tenancies Act were not valid. That must be corrected. We were told in the documentation circulated yesterday that this problem came to the Minister's attention in December. If it came to the Minister's attention then, why were the Opposition spokespersons not told about it until 24 hours ago? We are now dealing with the matter by emergency legislation.

I know the Minister, Deputy Gormley, has been preoccupied with changing lightbulbs in recent times.

Deputy Liz McManus

Or not.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

It makes one wonder how many Green Ministers it takes to change a light bulb.

(Interruptions).

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

One is not enough.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

This has brought Government incompetence to a new level. I do not believe the House can be used week in, week out, month in, month out, as a means of correcting the incompetent mistakes of Ministers. The Labour Party does not agree to the arrangements proposed.

The Taoiseach

This is in order to ensure that what is known as a dispute resolution committee is set up under section 159 of the Residential Tenancies Act, which empowers the board of the Residential Tenancies Board to establish such a committee and to delegate functions and appoint members to that committee. It came to the attention of the Department that the three-year rule set out in section 159(2) was not complied with in respect of ten members of the board, which was as a result of the board making those appointments as per the Act. As a result, it is important not to have open to legal challenge the work of those tribunals.

I do not think anyone questions the competence and professionalism of those tribunals — that is not in question. However, having to revisit those cases on foot of a technical procedural error would not serve tenants, landlords or the taxpayer well. The solution, therefore, is for emergency legislation to validate the appointments to the dispute resolution committee and the associated work undertaken by the committee and its members. This was approved this morning by Government and is being discussed in the Dáil today. In order to ensure that it not be open to legal challenge, we bring it this afternoon to go through all the procedures.

Deputy Charles Flanagan

There are 25 challenges before the courts.

The Taoiseach

If there are challenges, the whole question is to deal with this matter adequately and not put at risk the work they have done heretofore.

Deputy Charles Flanagan

They have not even replied to correspondence. People are being treated in a disgraceful manner.

An Ceann Comhairle

I must put the question.

Question put: "That the proposal for dealing with No. a4 be agreed to."

The Dáil divided: Tá, 79; Níl, 60.

Tá

• Ahern, Dermot.
• Ahern, Michael.
• Ahern, Noel.
• Andrews, Barry.
• Andrews, Chris.
• Ardagh, Seán.
• Aylward, Bobby.
• Behan, Joe.
• Blaney, Niall.
• Brady, Áine.
• Brady, Cyprian.
• Brady, Johnny.
• Browne, John.
• Byrne, Thomas.
• Calleary, Dara.
• Carey, Pat.
• Collins, Niall.
• Conlon, Margaret.
• Connick, Seán.
• Coughlan, Mary.
• Cowen, Brian.
• Cregan, John.
• Cuffe, Ciarán.
• Cullen, Martin.
• Curran, John.
• Dempsey, Noel.
• Devins, Jimmy.
• Dooley, Timmy.
• Finneran, Michael.
• Fitzpatrick, Michael.
• Fleming, Seán.
• Flynn, Beverley.
• Gallagher, Pat The Cope.
• Gogarty, Paul.
• Gormley, John.
• Grealish, Noel.
• Hanafin, Mary.
• Harney, Mary.
• Haughey, Seán.
• Healy-Rae, Jackie.
• Hoctor, Máire.
• Kelleher, Billy.
• Kelly, Peter.
• Kenneally, Brendan.
• Kennedy, Michael.
• Kirk, Seamus.
• Kitt, Michael P.
• Kitt, Tom.
• Lenihan, Brian.
• Lenihan, Conor.
• Lowry, Michael.
• McDaid, James.
• McEllistrim, Thomas.
• McGrath, Mattie.
• McGrath, Michael.
• McGuinness, John.
• Moynihan, Michael.
• Mulcahy, Michael.
• Nolan, M.J.
• Ó Cuív, Éamon.
• Ó Fearghaíl, Seán.
• O’Brien, Darragh.
• O’Connor, Charlie.
• O’Dea, Willie.
• O’Flynn, Noel.
• O’Hanlon, Rory.
• O’Keeffe, Batt.
• O’Rourke, Mary.
• O’Sullivan, Christy.
• Power, Seán.
• Roche, Dick.
• Ryan, Eamon.
• Sargent, Trevor.
• Scanlon, Eamon.
• Smith, Brendan.
• Treacy, Noel.
• Wallace, Mary.
• White, Mary Alexandra.
• Woods, Michael.

Níl

• Allen, Bernard.
• Barrett, Seán.
• Bruton, Richard.
• Burton, Joan.
• Byrne, Catherine.
• Carey, Joe.
• Clune, Deirdre.
• Coonan, Noel J.
• Coveney, Simon.
• Crawford, Seymour.
• Creed, Michael.
• Creighton, Lucinda.
• D’Arcy, Michael.
• Deasy, John.
• Doyle, Andrew.
• Durkan, Bernard J.
• Enright, Olwyn.
• Feighan, Frank.
• Ferris, Martin.
• Flanagan, Charles.
• Flanagan, Terence.
• Gilmore, Eamon.
• Hayes, Brian.
• Hayes, Tom.
• Higgins, Michael D.
• Hogan, Phil.
• Howlin, Brendan.
• Kehoe, Paul.
• Kenny, Enda.
• Lynch, Ciarán.
• Lynch, Kathleen.
• McCormack, Pádraic.
• McEntee, Shane.
• McGinley, Dinny.
• McGrath, Finian.
• McManus, Liz.
• Mitchell, Olivia.
• Naughten, Denis.
• Noonan, Michael.
• Ó Caoláin, Caoimhghín.
• Ó Snodaigh, Aengus.
• O’Donnell, Kieran.
• O’Dowd, Fergus.
• O’Keeffe, Jim.
• O’Mahony, John.
• O’Shea, Brian.
• Perry, John.
• Quinn, Ruairí.
• Rabbitte, Pat.
• Reilly, James.
• Ring, Michael.
• Shatter, Alan.
• Sheahan, Tom.
• Sheehan, P.J.
• Sherlock, Seán.
• Stagg, Emmet.
• Stanton, David.
• Timmins, Billy.
• Upton, Mary.
• Wall, Jack.

Tellers: Tá, Deputies Pat Carey and John Cregan; Níl, Deputies Paul Kehoe and Emmet Stagg.

Question declared carried.

An Ceann Comhairle

Is the proposal for dealing with Private Members' business agreed to? Agreed. I call Deputy Kenny on the Order of Business.

Deputy Enda Kenny

I have several questions for the Taoiseach. Is it proposed to introduce a supplementary budget given the changed circumstances that apply economically? In respect of the——

(Interruptions).

Deputy Enda Kenny

Perhaps I should wait, a Cheann Comhairle.

An Ceann Comhairle

We must have silence for Deputy Kenny.

Deputy Enda Kenny

The statements on the economy tomorrow will be very bland in that we will have a series of statements about the economic position. Yesterday, I listened to an advocate of the Fianna Fáil Party on television saying that this is an opportunity to set out every one's stall, that people will judge and that this is an opportunity for the Government to lead by setting out its stall. Is the Taoiseach prepared, at the very least, to furnish the Opposition spokespersons on finance with the framework document, so that at least there is some semblance of a structure to a debate which will take place before the Government announces any decisions in respect of the negotiations with the social partners?

If the House is to be accountable in any way or is to have any sense of importance, the framework sent to the social partners should be given to the Opposition spokespersons on finance. After all, the House represents all sectors of society. Everyone here is elected and sent here by the electorate from whatever region and for whatever reason.

With regard to the published list of impending legislation, the Chairman of the Joint Committee on Climate Change and Energy Security, Deputy Seán Barrett, and the committee produced the Offshore Renewable Energy Development Draft Bill 2009 which could replace the foreshore legislation. This is an issue of serious concern as we are constrained, restricted and held up on a range of fronts. The Bill, published and agreed by the committee on a cross-party basis, does not appear on the list. When is it intended to introduce the Bill in the House? It is important legislation. The Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources, Deputy Eamon Ryan, announced that he would introduce it to the House when it was published. I see no evidence of this on the list.

Last week, we dealt with the legislation on the nationalisation of Anglo Irish Bank. Prior to the introduction of that Bill, the Minister for Finance in his own generous way said he would be prepared to come before the House and answer questions about the banking situation for as long as necessary. This has not yet been sorted out. We will give the Minister time to do so if he wishes. Is it intended that the Minister will allow for a real question and answer session? Members have a range of issues concerning the banking crisis and constraints on the flow of credit to business on which we would like to hear the Minister pronounce.

The Taoiseach

I refer to the first matter raised by the Deputy. The issue of an opportunity to discuss the economic situation of the country was unanimously sought by everyone when we returned to the House and was, therefore, accommodated. I do not determine the length of negotiations or discussions taking place with the social partners, in terms of how the Government is trying to address this issue as outlined during Leaders' Questions. It does not take away from the debate on the economy tomorrow and the following day, because it is important that everyone in the House has the opportunity to speak, if they so wish, on the first week in which we return. Had we not said we were bringing forward an opportunity for a debate on the economy, the argument would have been different. It would have been suggested that the Government was not prepared to ensure that a relevant matter of urgent concern to all citizens was not discussed this week. We have accommodated the need and there are many issues that can be raised and articulated by Deputies from all sides of the House in respect of the two-day session on the economy that will take place tomorrow and the following day. That is as it should be.

Deputy Enda Kenny

The Taoiseach has a framework set out for the social——

The Taoiseach

The discussions continue, they are ongoing as we speak

Deputy Alan Shatter

We should have a debate on——

Deputy Richard Bruton

It is inconvenient.

The Taoiseach

Discussions are taking place. It is not available for publication to anyone until it is are signed off and agreed, because it forms the basis of discussions and it is a framework. There may be others who have a different view on how to proceed, but I believe this is the way we should proceed. This is what I believe we should do and this is what we are doing.

Deputy Richard Bruton

Let us see it.

The Taoiseach

If and when there is a basis for agreement it will be available for debate and discussion in the House. That is the situation. The Parliament asked for the debate this week and it is possible. We can also debate other matters during other weeks, there is no problem with this.

Deputy Alan Shatter

It is simply a rubber stamp.

Deputy David Stanton

The Parliament is a rubber stamp.

Deputy Olivia Mitchell

It is like the debate on the nationalisation of Anglo Irish Bank.

The Taoiseach

That is the difference. The whole purpose of this approach is to try to see if we can build a consensus around which we can try to address the problems facing the country. If some parties have no belief in that process, that is fine. That is their view. The Legislature is and will be involved on an ongoing basis.

Deputy Richard Bruton

On what ongoing basis?

Deputy David Stanton

Where are the proposals?

The Taoiseach

On the ongoing basis of dealing with the problems of the country in the months and years ahead. That is the situation. The Opposition cannot have it every way.

Deputy Simon Coveney

There is still no sign of a document.

The Taoiseach

It wants a debate in the House so let us have it. If we come to the basis of an agreement about how to proceed, we can have a debate on that also in the future, that is not a problem.

Deputy Simon Coveney

That will have no impact.

The Taoiseach

Let us deal with the issue as it is and in the way people asked, that is, that there is a debate on the economy this week. Let us do so.

Deputy Simon Coveney

It is irrelevant.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputies should allow the Taoiseach to make his point without interruption.

The Taoiseach

I refer to the second question asked about the Offshore Renewable Energy Development Draft Bill 2009. I must ask the Chief Whip to contact the Deputy regarding that matter as I do not have the detail before me. What was the third issue raised?

Deputy Enda Kenny

I asked about a supplementary budget and the questions from the Minister for Finance about the banking situation.

The Taoiseach

These issues relate to decisions to be taken by Government in due course and which will determine those issues. There is also the opportunity of incorporating whatever changes we introduce on the expenditure side into the Revised Estimates volume, which we believe should be available by early or mid-March.

Deputy Joan Burton

There is a new system and we were always to have it by February. Is the Taoiseach putting it back by six weeks?

The Taoiseach

No, I am simply telling the Deputy and explaining the situation.

Deputy Joan Burton

That is not acceptable.

The Taoiseach

I am simply explaining the situation as it stands at the moment.

Deputy Richard Bruton

It may be early March, but the budget was only in December.

The Taoiseach

The other question asked related to the banking situation. There will be an opportunity for the Joint Committee on Finance at the Public Services to meet at an appropriate time to deal with those issues and hold a question and answer session; that is why we have the committee system. That can be arranged in due course at a time that is appropriate to everyone.

Deputy Simon Coveney

It might tell us the truth.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

I heard the Taoiseach in response to Deputy Kenny saying he seeks to build consensus. Is it the case that the Government has made no decision as of yet regarding the public finances?

An Ceann Comhairle

We cannot go into that now. Leaders' Questions was earlier and we are now dealing with Dáil business. The Deputy must ask a question relevant to the Order of Business. That debate is on tomorrow.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

It is not a debate. We have a series of statements and a stream of consciousness in which we will all engage for two days and we have no proposals from the Government. There is no document. It would appear from what the Taoiseach said that the Government has not yet made any decisions on these matters. Is that the position in advance of tomorrow's debate? Has the Government made decisions in respect of the public finances or not?

An Ceann Comhairle

The Taoiseach has already responded to Deputy Kenny regarding the availability of a document for tomorrow, which was the question raised.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

It is not a hard question.

An Ceann Comhairle

If the Deputy wishes the Taoiseach to reiterate that, it is another matter.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

What is the answer?

The Taoiseach

I will answer any question, there is no problem. I refer to what is before us tomorrow for debate, namely, the economic situation of the country. The Government has set its framework for economic renewal.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

There has not been any decision.

The Taoiseach

It has clearly said it will take €2 billion in savings out of expenditures this year. The Government has met to discuss the matter and will finalise arrangements next Tuesday and then make an announcement. In the meantime, we are in discussions and engaging with the social partners to inform us regarding the choices we wish to make in that matter, and to build support for the effort in which we are engaged. If the criticisms is that we should do so in isolation from other stakeholders in society, that is the Deputy's opinion, but it is not mine.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

I have not suggested that at all.

The Taoiseach

The matter is clear. The Government has indicated the timescale and it is adhering to it. Perhaps to the disappointment of some people we are making some progress.

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

Last week, the Minister for Finance entered the Dáil Chamber and asked Members to sign up for the purchase of a pig in a poke in respect of Anglo Irish Bank. Today, the Taoiseach has told Members that they can have the opportunity to debate the framework document after it has been agreed or in other words, when it is a fait accompli. This is absolutely disgraceful. The Taoiseach has asked the elected Members of the Parliament of the people to blindfoldedly sign off on proposals and measures the Government is bringing forward. Earlier, Members of this House had an opportunity to support a vote calling for the framework document to be shared and unfortunately it did not receive the support it deserved. I welcome those voices that now call for it because this House and its Members are being treated disgracefully by the Government, the Taoiseach and his Minister for Finance. Members are being asked to come into the House over the next couple of days to address statements on the economy with one hand tied behind their backs.

Deputy Billy Kelleher

Two hands tied behind the Deputy's back.

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

My point is that for Members to have a properly informed debate, information must be shared.

Deputy Noel Dempsey

Sinn Féin has no ideas itself.

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

Members of all opinions have a contribution to make. They have both a responsibility and a duty to play such a part in seeking to find solutions to the current difficulties. However, the Taoiseach is not affording that chance to Members. It is a game to ask Members to await the framework document's agreement with the social partners——

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy has made his point.

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

——just as was asking them to sign up for the Anglo Irish Bank——

An Ceann Comhairle

The Taoiseach has already answered this question twice.

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

——-with all the failure to share the necessary information.

An Ceann Comhairle

This is repetition.

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

My final point relates to the programme of legislation, which now validly is within the ambit of the Order of Business. Is the Taoiseach aware that since the general election in 2007, the Government thus far has published 44 Bills, of which 38 have been enacted? Is he aware that at the equivalent point in the life of the 29th Dáil, the Government had published 65 Bills, of which 58 had been enacted? The obvious message relayed by those statistics is that the Government and all Departments are operating at less than 66% of the performance that applied in the previous Dáil.

An Ceann Comhairle

That is not a question at all. The Taoiseach has given an answer to this matter already.

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

Moreover, when one considers the position regarding the Department of Health and Children——

An Ceann Comhairle

That is an observation, not a question.

The Taoiseach

This is ridiculous.

Deputy Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin

——it is absolutely disgraceful.

Deputy Seán Power

There has been a reduction in Sinn Féin Members.

The Taoiseach

What has been agreed for tomorrow's business is that there will be statements on delivering sustainable economic renewal and securing our public finances. This issue is of great importance and during the next two days, all Members of this House will have the opportunity to give their views on what they, their parties or those they represent consider to be the best way to try to solve the problems that face us today.

Deputy Seán Barrett

That is the reason we have elections.

The Taoiseach

On the one hand, some people say we need less borrowing while on the other, people believe we should reflate the economy.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore

Some people state we have nothing to say.

The Taoiseach

Some people consider borrowing to be the problem while others state it is the solution.

Deputy Joan Burton

The Government is borrowing enough.

The Taoiseach

There will be a debate tomorrow and the day after and everyone will have an opportunity to set out their views. I am sure good things will be said by many Members of this House on a range of issues that may be of importance and may be of help.

Deputy Seán Barrett

The Taoiseach could call an election.

The Taoiseach

That is the business before the House. At present, discussions are taking place with the social partners and no agreement has been reached on anything. People are working constructively, while recognising the size and difficulty of the problem we face——

Deputy Enda Kenny

No agreement has been reached.

The Taoiseach

——to ascertain whether there is a basis on which we can proceed. These discussions continue and if and when they are agreed, we all will be the better for it and will know the outcome of that exercise.

Deputy Thomas P. Broughan

Will there be financial statements then?

The Taoiseach

In the meantime, we will continue with the policies needed to address the issues before us.

Deputy Charles Flanagan

Members of this House will be obliged to tune in to television to find out what is happening.

The Taoiseach

No, Members of this House can take on their responsibility to put on record their views.

Deputy Michael Creed

Will the Government's views be put on the record?

The Taoiseach

However, this also will provide us with an opportunity to outline what ideas and alternatives exist to bridge these problems and gaps. People who have ideas as to how that should be done should air them on the floor of this House.

Deputy James Bannon

What is needed is honest government.

The Taoiseach

However, one cannot simply come forward with the negative view that problems exist without solutions.

Deputy Charles Flanagan

We have provided several solutions to the Government.

The Taoiseach

The Government has proposed solutions within the framework of economic renewal that it provided before Christmas.

Deputy Ruairí Quinn

What about tomorrow?

The Taoiseach

As for what will be done tomorrow, the principles that should inform how we resolve this problem on an ongoing basis include a commitment by all that the first step should be a saving of €2 billion and we will proceed immediately thereafter on that basis.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

What a mess.

Deputy Michael Creed

The Taoiseach referred to the framework document and the social partners. In that context, does the framework document deal with the state of public finances or with the emerging black hole in the finances of the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, whereby there is a shortfall of €450 million——

An Ceann Comhairle

We will not go any further in this regard. The leaders of the parties have asked questions in this regard.

Deputy Michael Creed

——to pay the State's liability on farm waste management schemes?

An Ceann Comhairle

There are arrangements in place for tomorrow and we will not go any further with it now. The Taoiseach has answered it several times. The Deputy should ask something that is in order.

Deputy Michael Creed

In that context, will the Government introduce a Supplementary Estimate to deal with the shortfall in the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food to fund the farm waste management scheme?

An Ceann Comhairle

Is a Supplementary Estimate promised?

Deputy Michael Creed

There is an agreement between the State and the farming organisations under the farmer's charter to pay within an eight week period. Will a Supplementary Estimates be introduced in that regard?

An Ceann Comhairle

Is a Supplementary Estimate promised in this area?

The Taoiseach

No.

Deputy Michael Creed

I wish to raise a second matter on promised legislation. When will the animal health and welfare Bill be introduced to the House?

The Taoiseach

There is no date for that yet.

Deputy Seymour Crawford

I wish to raise three different issues. I have been raising the issue of the attachment of fines for years. While it has been promised in numerous debates, I note it now has been removed completely from the list of proposed Bills. Can the Taoiseach provide an indication when a similar measure will be introduced to allow money to be collected in a more constructive way? Second, while the Minister for Health and Children is no longer with us, the health information Bill would be a highly important tool to get the truth from the health system. It now is in 65th place on the list and is moving backwards, rather than forward. Finally, I back my colleague, Deputy Creed. When the farm waste management scheme was announced, I asked questions regarding its financing and was assured in a glib fashion that there would be no problem. However, we now have a problem.

An Ceann Comhairle

I assure Deputy Crawford that the Minister for Health and Children is very much with us.

The Taoiseach

There is no Bill relating to the third matter. As for the fines Bill, the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform is preparing a fines Bill, for which I understand the Minister shortly will seek Government approval to publish. It will include provisions, with some redrafting, that were addressed in the Fines Bill 2007. Such provisions will be aimed at giving the courts new powers to deal with a person's failure to pay a fine by the due date for payment. As the proposed new Bill will incorporate redrafted provisions contained in the Fines Bill 2007, it appears sensible to withdraw the latter from the Order Paper on publication of the Bill being drafted at present. This is the reason the Fines Bill on the Order Paper has not been proceeded with. The new Bill should be ready for publication during the coming Dáil session.

On the health information Bill, a wide-ranging public consultation exercise, using a detailed discussion document prepared in the Department, was initiated last June. Many submissions were received, including several received in late October 2008. All those who made submissions were invited to participate in a major feature on the Bill at the annual conference of the Healthcare Informatics Society of Ireland on 19 November last. The event proved highly successful and the level of consultation is considered to be essential given the complex and sensitive nature of the Bill. The Department is working towards finalising the heads of the Bill, which are expected in April.

Deputy Ruairí Quinn

Today and in recent days, the Taoiseach has advocated consensus and co-operation. The Government will introduce emergency legislation today because of a legal gap that has come to light at relatively short notice. I have pointed out previously and now wish to point out on the Order of Business in respect of legislation; that a primary school exists in north Dublin that is illegal. It is operated by the VEC, for which there is no statutory basis. I have drafted legislation that literally is a two line amendment to the Vocational Education Act 1930 and its related legislation.

There is no point in lecturing this House about co-operation and consensus unless the Government takes sensible ideas that its overworked parliamentary draftsmen cannot produce, for whatever reason. With the consent of all Members, this legislation could be brought in on a Thursday to put on a statutory basis something that will otherwise end up in the courts and will cause taxpayers unnecessary costs because Members did not get their act together. I invite the Taoiseach to consider this legislation. I have written to the Minister for Education and Science, Deputy Batt O'Keeffe, suggesting that he should take it up as the Labour Party cannot take this in Parliament. It is not worth three hours of Private Members' time because there is no issue in respect of it. It could be moved, subject to the agreement of the Whips, on a day of soft legislation of which there have been many in recent months.

The Taoiseach

Deputy Quinn stated he has written to the Minister concerned on the position. I do not have the detail in front of me. I will take the matter up with the Minister.

I understand there is a Bill in preparation, due to be provided shortly. Deputy Quinn has devised his own Bill. I do not know whether it is in line with what the Minister proposes. I will have to check.

Deputy Joan Burton

On the EU directive on combating money laundering, Ireland was meant to have signed up to that directive in November of 2007. We have been promised for some years a criminal justice (money laundering) Bill. As the Taoiseach is aware, and as he has referred to on several occasions, there are several thousand people in Ireland working in fund management and, because the anti-money laundering legislation to comply with the directive has not been brought in, they are being put at a competitive disadvantage to those working in fund management in the UK, in the Channel Islands, in Luxembourg and in other jurisdictions.

Given the difficulties in the banking sector, I fail to understand. We are being reported and brought before the European Court of Justice for our failure to implement the directive in Irish law.

An Ceann Comhairle

We cannot go into that now.

Deputy Joan Burton

It is on the pink sheet but I have no confidence that we will see it. Why can that not be brought in? Fragile jobs in fund management are now very competitive world-wide. This is a small competitive disadvantage that the Government is imposing on jobs in the finance sector by simply failing to legislate for this.

Why not bring it in next week? It is not difficult legislation.

An Ceann Comhairle

On the legislation, the Taoiseach.

The Taoiseach

It is not easy either.

The Bill is at an advanced stage of drafting. It is receiving the highest possible priority from the Office of the Parliamentary Counsel.

The Bill restates the law in several important respects. It is fully intended that the Bill will be published before the end of the spring session.

An Ceann Comhairle

I call Deputy Broughan.

Deputy Joan Burton

There are jobs dependent on this where——

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Burton made her point. Other Deputies are offering.

Deputy Joan Burton

——we are losing what is small competitive advantage.

An Ceann Comhairle

We cannot go into that now. The Taoiseach has answered the question.

Deputy Joan Burton

I am actually offering a bipartisan approach to the Taoiseach.

An Ceann Comhairle

He answered the question.

Deputy Joan Burton

He does not seem terribly capable——

An Ceann Comhairle

He answered the question.

Deputy Joan Burton

——of recognising bipartisanship——

An Ceann Comhairle

He answered the question. I call Deputy Broughan.

Deputy Joan Burton

——when it is offered.

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Broughan is next. The Taoiseach answered the question and that is it.

Deputy Thomas P. Broughan

No. 6 on the list of non-statutory documents laid before the Dáil is the Coffey report on the Stardust tribunal. Does placing the report on that list in effect mean that the Attorney General's difficulties with the report, if any, have now been resolved and, therefore, the Government is accepting the key recommendation and all the recommendations of the Coffey report, in other words, to set aside the key finding of the Keane tribunal report that arson was the probable cause of that fire rather than, as Mr. Paul Coffey SC rightly notes, that the cause could not determined?

An Ceann Comhairle

On the report, the Taoiseach.

The Taoiseach

I understand from the Chief Whip that he is seeking to schedule arrangements whereby a statement will be made in the House on this matter in line with a commitment made. He is seeking to arrange that through the whips.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

At the end of the last Dáil session several Members of the House raised the question of the legislation on estate management companies. We were led to believe that the legislation was at a very advanced stage of preparation and that a number of Departments were preparing the legislation.

I have looked at the pink list and it does not seem to be there, unless it is hidden in among the Bills proposed. I have looked at the white list and I still cannot find it.

I wonder is it intended to bring in that legislation. Has some change taken place because as we speak various management companies are issuing bills to residents all over the country,——

An Ceann Comhairle

That is it now. On the legislation, the Taoiseach.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

——with obvious concerns, from the residents' point of view. An indication was given in the House before Christmas that this would be dealt with soon.

An Ceann Comhairle

Give the Taoiseach an opportunity to answer that.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

I have another. Perhaps the Taoiseach might answer that one.

The Taoiseach

The Government is working intensely on this issue of multi-unit developments which is being treated as a priority. It is an ongoing issue which has been raised in the House and I have raised it at Government level. We intend to bring forward legislation, either one Bill or a number of them, in this regard in the not too distant future.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

I do not want to delay the proceedings of the House but I see a Bill on the list and I wonder what are the intentions. It is to provide for the collection and exchange of information relating to the endangerment, sexual exploitation or sexual abuse, or risk thereof of children. It is indicated that publication is expected in 2009. Is it intended to bring that Bill forward as a matter of some urgency given that there is considerable concern expressed throughout the country on related issues at present?

An Ceann Comhairle

Deputy Durkan has made his point.

The Taoiseach

We are well aware of that issue. Work is progressing toward bringing the heads of the Bill to Government at the earliest available opportunity. Officials from the Office of the Minister for Children are working with their counterparts in the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform to bring forward legislation. It is extremely complex and potentially has constitutional implications, but we are anxious to bring it forward during the course of this year, given the background to this situation.

Deputy David Stanton

Would the Taoiseach be kind enough at some stage to let us have some comprehensive, well thought-out and researched proposals on Dáil reform. When might that happen?

We on this side of the House have made proposals and we expect reaction from Government. We are very anxious to engage to make all our time, and especially the Taoiseach's, here more worthwhile. Can we see proposals at some stage with which we can meaningfully engage and maybe make some meaningful reform here?

An Ceann Comhairle

Taoiseach, I must move on.

The Taoiseach

The Government has a working group working on that at present. I will come back to the Deputy.