Vol. 483 No. 5
8 Mr. Rabbitte asked the Minister for Arts, Heritage, Gaeltacht and the Islands if she will make a statement on the outcome of her meeting with the Players' Council of the Abbey Theatre; the progress, if any, which has been made in relation to the council's request for a voluntary severance package; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [20649/97.
I was scheduled to meet with the Players' Council of the Abbey Theatre on 20 November last but, due to my attendance in the Dáil where Second Stage of a Bill relating to my powers and functions as Minister was being taken, I was obliged to cancel the meeting with the agreement of the Players' Council. The meeting will take place on 11 December. With regard to the issue of a voluntary severance package for the permanent acting company of the National Theatre Society, as I advised the House in my replies to Parliamentary Questions Nos. 208 of 7 October 1997, and 17 and 30 of 23 October 1997, the proposals for such a package have been submitted to An Chomhairle Ealaíon and copied to me as a courtesy. I am awaiting the recommendations of An Chomhairle Ealaíon in the matter.
Will the Minister agree it was a pity she was unable to meet the Players' Council on the day designated? Will she agree this matter has to be resolved, given that the Players' Council has lived for a long time in a state of limbo? Will she indicate how she anticipates this matter coming to a happy conclusion? People with great talent are in a state of limbo because decisions have not been made to the satisfaction of both parties. The Minister is responsible in an overall sense. How does she see her role in this matter and what is the timeframe in relation to reaching a satisfactory conclusion given that people's livelihoods have been seriously affected, in terms of their creativity? How does she envisage this need will be met in a fair way and in what timeframe?
Like the Deputy I consider this to be a serious matter and that is the reason I immediately agreed to meet the Players' Council. As explained, I could not do that on 20 November because I was taking Second Stage of the Minister for Arts, Heritage, Gaeltacht and the Islands (Powers and Functions) Bill, 1997. Given my particular interest in the matter, I immediately made another appointment and a meeting will take place on 11 December. On that occasion I shall listen to the issues directly from the Players' Council. The proposals have been submitted to An Chomhairle Ealaíon and I await its recommendations. On receipt of those recommendations I will not delay.
Will the Minister agree it is not a matter of meeting the Players' Council to hear what they have to say? We all know, including the Minister, what they have to say. Will she ensure she has the information she is waiting on before meeting the Players' Council? Surely, she is in a position to demand that information before meeting the Players' Council. Will she agree we are well beyond the point of simply having a meeting to listen to views expressed by the Players' Council? Does she perceive this meeting as one where progress can be made? The only way that progress can be made is if she has the information at hand before meeting the Players' Council.
It was the Players' Council who asked if I would meet with them. Obviously they want to speak with me, they wish to put forward certain views that I should be aware of. As Minister I very much wish to hear those views. When someone asks to meet me I do my best to facilitate them. I hope to receive the recommendations from An Chomhairle Ealaíon shortly. I look forward to meeting the Players' Council to see how this matter can be resolved at the earliest possible date.
This smacks of indecisiveness by the Minister. I support the thrust of the question by Deputy McManus. The Players' Council asked to see me and I met them. Their case is very real. The nine people involved have given service ranging from 21 years to 39 years in a national institution and have portrayed Ireland very well. The top wage is £21,000. There is no secret in bringing about a voluntary severance package. As Minister for Tourism and Trade I did this with Bord Fáilte and the Trade Board. The Minister should be in a position to deal with nine people, given that next week the Minister for Finance is to lash out £500 million. The meeting has been arranged conveniently for 11 December, after the budget. Will the Minister give a guarantee that that sum, small by comparative standards, will be included in the Finance Bill?
I am amused that when one tries to consult, one is told one is indecisive. Deputies who put forward that view would be the first to say it would not be right for a Minister to pre-empt decisions and that one should listen to the people directly involved. I look forward to meeting the Players' Council on 11 December. It would not be appropriate to pre-empt our discussions before taking part in them. In regard to Deputy Kenny's reference to the budget and the scheduling of the meeting, I assure him there is absolutely no connection between the two. The date of 11 December was the nearest that accommodated both the Players' Council and myself.
I am sympathetic to the Minister's intention to meet the Players' Council. While it will be a useful meeting, what Deputy McManus has said is also true, that the agenda is known. The Players' Council had more than nine people a few years ago. When the Minister gets advice from the Arts Council it will be impossible for her to solve the problem if the Abbey Theatre is instructed to find the money out of its annual grant allocation. The core of this problem has always been whether the Department of Finance would facilitate a once off payment of funds to enable the redundancy package to be implemented. This was an overhang that continued as the Abbey Theatre was responsible to different Ministers, including the Department of the Taoiseach. If, having met the Players' Council on 11 December, it becomes clear an approach to the Department of Finance is necessary, will it be made?
Deputy Higgins has pointed out that this is not a new problem that has suddenly materialised, it has continued under another Administration. Although Deputy Kenny said he was able to do all sorts of good things when Minister for Tourism and Trade——
Sometimes.
——obviously he did not have any influence in regard to this and other issues at Cabinet.
It was not my responsibility.
I am sure the Deputy could have argued that at Cabinet.
I would have had it dealt with long ago.
That is rather disingenuous of the Deputy.
We had 70 in Bord Fáilte, not nine.
In regard to the second question raised by Deputy Higgins, it would not be helpful to pre-empt discussions or to answer hypothetical questions today. I must first get to the discussions. I am aware of the problems before having these discussions. It would not be courteous or helpful to pre-empt the discussions, otherwise there would be no purpose in having them.
The Minister was asked a relevant question by Deputy Higgins. The Minister has succeeded in not giving a guarantee that she will go to the Department of Finance. Will the Minister go to the Department of Finance to have this matter resolved?
I have to find out the parameters of this case. In order to do that I have to meet the Players' Council and to await the recommendations of An Chomhairle Ealaíon. Deputies opposite will understand the Comhairle has a particular role to play in this and I have no intention of subverting that role.
